SCOTUS Grants Guantanamo Prisoners Habeas Corpus

[Undertoad]

I asked for a cite that torture occurred at Guantanamo. You quoted my request and then wrote a long post that does not contain a cite.

[dar512]

wiki

Then search for the word torture.

[tw]

Originally Posted by Undertoad

I asked for a cite that torture occurred at Guantanamo. You quoted my request and then wrote a long post that does not contain a cite.

We are well beyond needing citations for torture. Documents now define approval for torture in the White House. Recent revelations report that the CIA was so concerned about their own safety for doing torture as to demand written documents from the White House that approved it.

Current questions are specifically who authorized torture. For example, currently under investigation is AG Gonzales. You can argue these silly needs for citations all you want. At this point, America tortured prisoners in Guantanamo. The recently discovered documents from the CIA state that the White House authorized it in writing. Question now is who in the White House authorized it.

What is just a few rogue plumbers bugging the Watergate? Investigators are now asking the same questions about torture in Guantanamo - and elsewhere.

Bad enough we tortured them, kept them in solitary confinement, denied them due process, and even refused to let the Red Cross tell their families where they were. Worse - hundreds (probably all but maybe 16) were completely innocent. This is the moral and religous George Jr? Torture of innocent people happens when only god tells a leader what to do. A damning reality.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by tw

Current questions are specifically who authorized torture. For example, currently under investigation is AG Gonzales. You can argue these silly needs for citations all you want. At this point, America tortured prisoners in Guantanamo.

So you can't site it. Ok.

[dar512]

http://jurist.law.pitt.edu/paperchas...nce-may-be.php

http://talkradionews.com/2008/07/wat...in-guantanamo/

http://topics.nytimes.com/top/refere...es&match=exact

http://cbs5.com/national/hearing.wat....2.563973.html

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/0...-_n_87082.html

http://www.salon.com/news/feature/20...y_deprivation/

[dar512]

While you may have doubts that Guantanamo prisoners have been waterboarded, there is no doubt that prisoners have been tortured.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2007...guantanamo.usa

I don't get the defense of this behavior. If it's legal to do against POWs how soon will we see it used against citizens? How soon will a citizen be declared a POW so that torture can be used?

One of the objectives of the law is to prohibit abuses of power. This is the sort of thing that should be specifically prohibited.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by dar512

While you may have doubts that Guantanamo prisoners have been waterboarded, there is no doubt that prisoners have been tortured.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2007...guantanamo.usa

I don't get the defense of this behavior. If it's legal to do against POWs how soon will we see it used against citizens? How soon will a citizen be declared a POW so that torture can be used?

One of the objectives of the law is to prohibit abuses of power. This is the sort of thing that should be specifically prohibited.

I am not defending it as much as I am getting those who believe it to prove their assertions in these discussions. Most of you can't. Did it happen, sure, most likely, but not at GITMO. Was it a standard practice, no I don't believe it. But hell, if I was locked up in GITMO for as long as some of those poor saps I would claim it too. What defense attorney would not tell their defendant in GITMO to make such a claim, I would.

[dar512]

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

I am not defending it as much as I am getting those who believe it to prove their assertions in these discussions. Most of you can't. Did it happen, sure, most likely, but not at GITMO. Was it a standard practice, no I don't believe it. But hell, if I was locked up in GITMO for as long as some of those poor saps I would claim it too. What defense attorney would not tell their defendant in GITMO to make such a claim, I would.

Well it's going to be very hard to get evidence considering how tight they have Guantanamo locked up, isn't it.

In any case, the very fact that the current administration has policy that allows this kind of torture is reprehensible.

[richlevy]

Originally Posted by Undertoad

I asked for a cite that torture occurred at Guantanamo. You quoted my request and then wrote a long post that does not contain a cite.

I wanted to be clear if I needed to find only waterboarding or if you agreed that the other methods are also torture.
How about the New York Times? It appears we took examples of torture that our military was being taught to withstand and turned it into a "howto" guide.

WASHINGTON — The military trainers who came to Guantánamo Bay in December 2002 based an entire interrogation class on a chart showing the effects of “coercive management techniques” for possible use on prisoners, including “sleep deprivation,” “prolonged constraint,” and “exposure.”
What the trainers did not say, and may not have known, was that their chart had been copied verbatim from a 1957 Air Force study of Chinese Communist techniques used during the Korean War to obtain confessions, many of them false, from American prisoners.
The recycled chart is the latest and most vivid evidence of the way Communist interrogation methods that the United States long described as torture became the basis for interrogations both by the military at the base at Guantánamo Bay, Cuba, and by the Central Intelligence Agency.
Some methods were used against a small number of prisoners at Guantánamo before 2005, when Congress banned the use of coercion by the military. The C.I.A. is still authorized by President Bush to use a number of secret “alternative” interrogation methods.

In 2002, the training program, known as SERE, for Survival, Evasion, Resistance, Escape, became a source of interrogation methods both for the C.I.A. and the military. In what critics describe as a remarkable case of historical amnesia, officials who drew on the SERE program appear to have been unaware that it had been created as a result of concern about false confessions by American prisoners.