Why (some) GM products suck - Page 3

lumberjim · 06-15-2009, 01:51 PM

damned predatory opportuninstic consumers

Shawnee123 · 06-15-2009, 01:59 PM

I'm just a big wimp about this kind of thing.

classicman · 06-15-2009, 02:03 PM

just pretend they are ... you know who. That should take care of your timidity pretty quick.

Clodfobble · 06-15-2009, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lumberjim

damned predatory opportuninstic consumers

Meh. Lots of salespeople are honest. We just bought a car from one not too long ago. But you can't blame folks for being bitter.

lumberjim · 06-15-2009, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clodfobble

Meh. Lots of salespeople are honest. We just bought a car from one not too long ago. But you can't blame folks for being bitter.

oh..i was just being ironic. Not hard to shine in this business. It's pretty much down to not being a dick and not lying. If i had a nickel for every time i heard a customer tell me that we treat them SO much better than the OTHER place they went to....

...that might be slightly tilted, actually, since I only meet them if they make it past the salesmen.

I refer to the 'Filter Effect' when speaking about salesmen with other managers sometimes. What I mean is that if a customer actually buys a car from some of theses guys, then they have to be somewhat trusting or gullible. Some of the better salesmen have a zero filter rating....meaning....they can deal with just about anyone and sell them a car if they're buying.

Undertoad · 06-15-2009, 05:24 PM

Speed-sensitive steering is standard on the XR models.

tw · 06-15-2009, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Undertoad

Speed-sensitive steering is standard on the XR models.

Not on all models. Why not? Which model was tested by Popular Mechanics?

Meanwhile, avoid the Saturn. It does not have reliability and value so often touted by those who 'feel' rather than learn.

Having said that, if Fiat does get Opel, then will Saturn be saved?

What did Marchionne do to save Fiat? What is he expected to do to save Chrysler? Remove the #1 problem - top management. 85% of all problems - including Saturn's poor reliability - would be directly traceable to top management. Buying a Saturn also says, "Keep destroying America. Keep destroying American jobs."

UT's many points posted up top are old news. DeLorean defined them in his 1970s book "On a Clear Day, You Can See GM". MaryAnn Keller defined them accurately and bluntly (ie The Reckoning(?)) - which is why GM banned GM employees from taking interviews with her. The LA Times defined the problem in 2005 - so GM tried to bankrupt the LA Times. And Michelle Maynard (?) of the NY Times has been quite blunt about this. The many points needed no response because some were defined even by Ralph Nader in the early 1960s - "Unsafe at Any Speed".

Problems have remained that long and were that well understood. For 30 years, GM would not put a major innovation in any car until required by a government regulation. GM did exactly what is taught in business schools. UT's points have been routinely known for decades.

ZenGum · 06-15-2009, 06:53 PM

Yeah, you can see her playing hard-to-get already.

If in doubt, get a corolla. They go for evah. Engineered by autistic savants and built by anal retentives.

DanaC · 06-15-2009, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZenGum

Yeah, you can see her playing hard-to-get already.

If in doubt, get a corolla. They go for evah. Engineered by autistic savants and built by anal retentives.

Well, I'm sold.

sugarpop · 06-16-2009, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZenGum

Yeah, you can see her playing hard-to-get already.

If in doubt, get a corolla. They go for evah. Engineered by autistic savants and built by anal retentives.

Corollas get great gas milage as well, one of the best on the road. And if you coast a lot you can milage comparable to a hybrid. (I coast all the time when I drive my Geo.) They also have a very high resale value.

Aliantha · 06-15-2009, 07:04 PM

Yeah, you can always tell how good a model is by the number of uni students driving them 20yrs later.

ZenGum · 06-15-2009, 07:10 PM

2009 - 1992 = 17 year old corolla in driveway... had it 18 months, no trouble at all.

I occasionally see late '70s corollas about, they're quite recognisable.

Shawnee123 · 06-15-2009, 07:25 PM

Heee, in college I drove a 73 Impala. That 450 engine would still kick it!

I might just drive this car until it actually dies. It seems to be the right thing to do, for a car that has hung in for so long. I'm in no hurry, though it seems I am.

And P.S. I would totally buy a car from LJ...I just am thinking about the distance and the costs involved there. There are some great salespeople out there, my younger sis-in-law being one, and I was put off by the local Honda online guy's approach. I might get a better experience if I just look around.

Shawnee123 · 06-15-2009, 08:21 PM

Is it just how Motorweek presents cars, that I was feeling like I had made a nice preliminary decision on a car?

I think I might like an Astra. 3 door. Sunroof? I haven't seen one at the local dealer which included sunroof. Standard shift is perfect because I'd rather drive a manual transmission.

Pico and ME · 06-15-2009, 08:50 PM

Shawnee, when I bought my Sentra I was able to pit two dealerships against each other. I was actually able to get the price down by $1500 doing that.

06-15-2009, 01:59 PM	#2
Shawnee123 Why, you're a regular Alfred E Einstein, ain't ya? Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 21,206	I'm just a big wimp about this kind of thing. __________________ A word to the wise ain't necessary - it's the stupid ones who need the advice. --Bill Cosby

06-15-2009, 02:03 PM	#3
classicman barely disguised asshole, keeper of all that is holy. Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 23,401	just pretend they are ... you know who. That should take care of your timidity pretty quick. __________________ "like strapping a pillow on a bull in a china shop" Bullitt

06-15-2009, 06:53 PM	#8
ZenGum Doctor Wtf Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Badelaide, Baustralia Posts: 12,861	Yeah, you can see her playing hard-to-get already. If in doubt, get a corolla. They go for evah. Engineered by autistic savants and built by anal retentives. __________________ Shut up and hug. MoreThanPretty, Nov 5, 2008. Just because I'm nominally polite, does not make me a pussy. Sundae Girl.

06-15-2009, 07:04 PM	#11
Aliantha trying hard to be a better person Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 16,493	Yeah, you can always tell how good a model is by the number of uni students driving them 20yrs later. __________________ Kind words are the music of the world. F. W. Faber

06-15-2009, 07:10 PM	#12
ZenGum Doctor Wtf Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Badelaide, Baustralia Posts: 12,861	2009 - 1992 = 17 year old corolla in driveway... had it 18 months, no trouble at all. I occasionally see late '70s corollas about, they're quite recognisable. __________________ Shut up and hug. MoreThanPretty, Nov 5, 2008. Just because I'm nominally polite, does not make me a pussy. Sundae Girl.

06-15-2009, 01:51 PM	#1
lumberjim I can hear my ears Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 25,571	damned predatory opportuninstic consumers __________________ This body holding me reminds me of my own mortality Embrace this moment, remember We are eternal, all this pain is an illusion ~MJKeenan

06-15-2009, 05:24 PM	#6
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	Speed-sensitive steering is standard on the XR models.

06-15-2009, 07:25 PM	#13
Shawnee123 Why, you're a regular Alfred E Einstein, ain't ya? Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 21,206	Heee, in college I drove a 73 Impala. That 450 engine would still kick it! I might just drive this car until it actually dies. It seems to be the right thing to do, for a car that has hung in for so long. I'm in no hurry, though it seems I am. And P.S. I would totally buy a car from LJ...I just am thinking about the distance and the costs involved there. There are some great salespeople out there, my younger sis-in-law being one, and I was put off by the local Honda online guy's approach. I might get a better experience if I just look around. __________________ A word to the wise ain't necessary - it's the stupid ones who need the advice. --Bill Cosby

06-15-2009, 08:21 PM	#14
Shawnee123 Why, you're a regular Alfred E Einstein, ain't ya? Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 21,206	Is it just how Motorweek presents cars, that I was feeling like I had made a nice preliminary decision on a car? I think I might like an Astra. 3 door. Sunroof? I haven't seen one at the local dealer which included sunroof. Standard shift is perfect because I'd rather drive a manual transmission. __________________ A word to the wise ain't necessary - it's the stupid ones who need the advice. --Bill Cosby

06-15-2009, 08:50 PM	#15
Pico and ME Are you knock-kneed? Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Middle Hoosierland Posts: 3,549	Shawnee, when I bought my Sentra I was able to pit two dealerships against each other. I was actually able to get the price down by $1500 doing that.

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