Scouts get pwned

[Lamplighter]

The BSA is finally making a decision, but I seriously question if this one is for the better or worse.

NY Times
By ERIK ECKHOLM
April 19, 2013

Boy Scouts Move to Lift Ban on Gay Youth Members

Seeking an elusive middle ground on an issue that has divided
its ranks and drawn heated national debate, the Boy Scouts of America on Friday
proposed ending its longstanding ban on openly gay scouts
but continuing to bar gay adults from serving as leaders.

The decision must be approved by the roughly 1,400 voting members
of the Scouts’ National Council at a meeting in Texas the week of May 20.
<snip>
“The Boy Scouts have missed an opportunity to exercise leadership and
usher the organization back to relevancy,” said Richard Ferraro,
the vice president of the Gay and Lesbian Alliance Against Discrimination.
“What this resolution appears to be doing is reinforcing the outrageous idea
that gay people somehow pose a threat to kids, which experts like the
American Psychological Association have dismissed for more than a decade.”
<snip>

First, understand that to be a volunteer leader in the BSA,
a person MUST be the parent of a boy who has joined the Scouts.
So, a gay boy is allowed to join, but his gay father or mother are not allowed to participate ?

Separating boys from their parent(s) as a matter of policy does not seem like the very good idea to me.

But Martez Moore, chief operating officer of the Scouts’ Middle Tennessee Council,
said he supported the proposal, especially the continued barring of gay leaders.
In surveys, he said, local parents were “overwhelmingly in support of banning gay Scout leaders.”

He said he did not expect that a decision to admit openly gay boys as scouts would have a major effect.
“Scouts who are gay usually decide with their own families whether they want to stay in a troop,”
he said. “It is a decision made within a family, not usually within the Scouts.”

So, let them join... and then drive them out.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by Lamplighter

First, understand that to be a volunteer leader in the BSA,
a person MUST be the parent of a boy who has joined the Scouts.

When did this come about? This was not true back in the dark ages of my youth.

So, a gay boy is allowed to join, but his gay father or mother are not allowed to participate ?

Of all the scouts in the country, damn few parents want to be, or have the skills, to be scout leaders.

Separating boys from their parent(s) as a matter of policy does not seem like the very good idea to me.

I thought the idea of the scouts was to get them out of the comfort zone of family, and teach them to be self reliant. Teach them to work with other kids, who have different skills and perspectives.

While not ideal, I see this as a workable compromise for the millions of parents that don't want their sons to catch the gays. If their boy doesn't catch it from a queer scout, it'll ease their fears of queer leaders.

[glatt]

Baby steps. I can see this working and I support it as a step in the right direction.

But it's wrong on its face. If the fear is that somebody who is attracted to men might also be attracted to boys, and therefore shouldn't be allowed to be a leader, then why are women allowed to be leaders? Most women are attracted to men. If being attracted to men means you are also attracted to boys, then aren't moms also a huge risk to the organization? It's nonsense.

Besides, they have a tough policy that's been in place for years that says that no adults can be alone with a scout unless they are a parent. Following that policy means that nobody has a chance to molest a scout.

If there is a concern with having gays in scouts it would be that a gay scout gets to sleep side by side in a 2 man tent with a straight scout. Or even 2 gay scouts together. We probably wouldn't put a 17 year old girl in a tent next to a 17 year old boy without a chaperone. When openly gay scouts are admitted into a troop, I think leaders need to be aware of the situation and pay attention to sleeping arrangements. I'm not sure how to handle that. If there's only one gay scout, it's not fair to make them sleep by themselves. Maybe three in a tent is best. I'm not sure about that.

Here is the current policy for youth protection in scouts.

•
Two-deep leadership.
Two registered adult
leaders or one registered adult leader and a
parent of a participant, one of whom must be
21 years of age or older, are required on all
trips and outings. The chartered organization
is responsible for ensuring that sufficient
leadership is provided for all activities. This
requirement applies to all the activities of
the Order of the Arrow as well as
provisional unit activities.
•
No one-on-one contact.
One on one contact
between adults and youth members is not
permitted. In situations that require personal
conferences, such as a Scoutmasters
conference, the meeting is to be conducted
in view of other adults and youths.
Respect of privacy.
Adult leadership needs to
respect the privacy of youth members in situations
such as changing into swimming suits or taking
showers at camp and intrude only to the extent
that health and safety requires. They also need to
protect their own privacy in similar situations.
•
Separate accommodations.
When camping, no youth is permitted to sleep in the tent of an adult
other than his own parent or guardian. Councils
are strongly encouraged to have separate shower
and latrine facilities for females and when separate
facilities are not available, times for male and
female use should be scheduled and posted for
showers.
•
Proper preparation for High-adventure
activities.
Activities with elements of risk should
never be undertaken without proper preparation,
equipment, clothing, supervision, and safety
measures.
•
No secret organizations.
There are no “secret”
organizations recognized by the Boy Scouts of
America. All aspects of the scouting program are
open to observation by parents and leaders.
•
Appropriate attire.
Proper clothing for activities
is required- for example, skinny-dipping is not
appropriate as part of Scouting.
•
Constructive discipline.
Discipline used in
Scouting should be constructive and reflect
Scouting’s values. Corporal punishment is never
permitted.
•
Hazing prohibited.
Physical hazing and
initiations are prohibited and may not be included
as part of any Scouting activity
•
Junior leader training and supervision.
Adult leaders must monitor and guide the
leadership techniques used by junior leaders
and see that BSA policies are followed.

[Lamplighter]

For my post above, I did not go into "unforeseen consequences" or "hidden agendas".

The first "unforseen" that came to my mind was a drifting segregation
into troops/packs of straight and gay boys, with all the negatives that can generate.

The "hiddens" are hidden, but I strongly suspect the the religious organizations
their support of BSA will be quite opposed to activities or literature
demonstrating that gay (adoptive) parents can be as good role models as straight parents,
and how will a boy explain to others and himself that his Dad is not good enough to be a leader or volunteer ?

Over the past few days, I've come to the opinion this "new" policy
of the BSA reeks of old and new pathways to discrimination, belittling, and harm.

[Lamplighter]

This looks like either finally a court case, or finally some sanity in the BSofA


With Hire, Boy Scouts Affiliate in New York Defies Ban on Gays
NY Times - JAMES BARRONAPRIL 2, 2015

Taking the first step toward a possible face-off over the Boy Scouts of America’s ban on openly gay adult members or employees,
the organization’s New York affiliate said on Thursday that it had hired a gay Eagle Scout to work in a scout camp this summer.

The New York group, the Boy Scouts’ Greater New York Councils, announced the hiring of Pascal Tessier, an 18-year-old Eagle Scout
who grew up in Kensington, Md., and is now a student at the College of Wooster in Wooster, Ohio.
He became a prominent figure among those speaking out against the ban on gay people over 18 in scouting.

“We’ve had an antidiscrimination policy for a very, very long time,” said Richard G. Mason, a board member of the Greater New York Councils,
the local umbrella group for Boy Scouts in the city’s five boroughs.

<snip>

[glatt]

With hundreds of thousands of members across all regions of the country, there are lots of different points of view within scouting. At the national level, they make these rules, but as you get down to the individual level, you don't have uniform agreement with those rules, and in my experience, people sometimes look the other way when it comes to some of the more ridiculous ones.

It's great that this Council level group is openly defying the national level rules instead of just looking the other way to achieve the same thing. I hope it brings change to the national level.

The downside of individuals looking the other way on some of the ridiculous rules is that you get individuals who look the other way on the good rules and do shit like destroy geological features in protected parks.