taxation

[BigV]

untwist your panties then we'll talk. Go ahead, I'll wait.





Ok. I posted in response to your post before reading the info at your link because I already know about this shit. It's all fucking posturing and posing and hot fucking air. You, me, Cronyn, anybody can make a statement that's supportable and oh em gee shocking, SHOCKING I tell you. Cronyn's statement is correct. It's misleading, but it's correct. It's misleading because it narrowly restricts the scope of his statement.

He's picked just one year (fine, let's pick a year and talk about it) and one kind of tax. This second one is a double restriction *federal* and *income*. So, by choosing this narrow set of circumstances and setting it against the noticeable threshold of 51% he draws attention to his remark. All good so far.

But here's where the discussion, even in this thread has derailed. Fewer than ten posts later, Lamplighter takes the bait. He even quotes your quote "... no income taxes..." and then breaks his own point by saying "... no taxes...". THIS is how it is misleading. Cronyn's narrow statement is true, but rarely repeated or discussed with the same strictness. Income taxes, payroll taxes these are just fucking accounting categories. It is all part of the same federal revenue stream that the federal government uses to meet its obligations. Income, payroll, what do these words mean? Certainly not what they pay for; they are the labels of the origin of the tax. Capital gains taxes? Taxes on capital gains. Taxes on dividends? The list goes on. We separate them by the source, but the money all goes into the same pot.

Let me ask you a question--(not a trick, I don't already know the answer though I did try for a while to find an answer). What percentage of households paid no capital gains tax in 2009? If it is even close to the SHOCKING 51% for the (narrow) income tax value, I'll eat my hat. Say it's 90%, 75%. THREE QUARTERS of households paid no capital gains taxes! That's totally believable, but I don't think that question's ever been raised. Why not? Well, for one, it's kind of a made up silly point, like the income point. But, if you look carefully, it's true for the same reason. Not many people qualify.

Stormieweather brings up another point, the percentage of households. Shocking! 51%! It is shocking, and the startling part is NOW with 51% of households not paying (federal income tax this year), means that every payer is supporting itself plus another household! Double taxation! (sorry, channeling mercy there). 51% is a majority and "majority rule" is an American idiom. It catches our attention. But the truth is we've long had a large number of households that don't pay income taxes. Sad but true.

Look--if you're scandalized that lots of people didn't pay federal income taxes, and you should be, look to the source of the problem NOT ENOUGH INCOME. Fix that problem, and the percentage moves in the desired direction, lower. And the nation's deficit moves in the desired direction, lower. Want more people to pay income tax? Get more income out there to tax.