The right way to stop a bully

[morethanpretty]

Originally Posted by Aliantha

That's true, so I guess if we lived in a Utopian society, it'd be easy. Unfortunately we don't, and most (if they exist) cures for bullying, the nice way, are achieved through long term aid. Sometimes the victim doesn't have a long time to wait. It's sad, but it's very true, and it's also true that until you've watched your child deflate before your eyes because of bullying, it's hard to understand why a normally passive person would condone this sort of behaviour.

I keep reiterating that it is not easy, it is just better than violence. If it is going to take too long to get them to another school and the bullying is just THAT bad, then just remove them from school for the time being.

@Lookout- It is NOT running away or teaching them to run away. It is teaching them to remove themselves from a bad situation before they accidentally make it worse. So you would rather your child be put in a situation where he could accidentally cripple or KILL another child just so they won't have to swallow their pride and walk away from a fight? One punch can kill, there is not appropriate amount of violence. Plus no one said anything about selling your house and moving states. What, you only have one school in your whole state?

[lookout123]

Originally Posted by morethanpretty

I there is not appropriate amount of violence.

And there is the philosophical difference that will prevent us from ever agreeing on this topic. You see it as a horrible evil that can and must be avoided at all cost. I know that it is sometimes unfortunately necessary because not everyone is directing gumdrops and goodwishes in your direction. I do not enjoy violence but I will not live in fear of it.

[morethanpretty]

Originally Posted by lookout123

And there is the philosophical difference that will prevent us from ever agreeing on this topic. You see it as a horrible evil that can and must be avoided at all cost. I know that it is sometimes unfortunately necessary because not everyone is directing gumdrops and goodwishes in your direction. I do not enjoy violence but I will not live in fear of it.

Good job taking the quote out of context and thereby misinterpreting it and its meaning. I never said anything about gumdrops or goodwishes fixing the issue. Its not a philosophical difference, its a literate one apparently.

[Spexxvet]

Originally Posted by lookout123

No thanks. Conflict is rarely beneficial and it is certainly something to be avoided, but there is value in having a spine and being willing to stand up for yourself and not waiting for some benevolent authority figure to come save you. Waiting for an authority figure to come save you only works when they have the time, energy, and desire to give a shit about you. If you won't stand up for yourself in the unfortunate event it is required, don't expect anyone else to do it for you. Violence/conflict should not be desired, nor should it be feared.


and before you go further down the "he could have permanently damaged that poor bully" road, yes - you are right. A discussion on appropriate use of force and escalation would be a good idea, but no damn way would I scold the kid for standing up for himself.

This kind of parenting creates bullies.

You're obviously not christian.

Originally Posted by lookout123

You see it as a horrible evil that can and must be avoided at all cost.

How did you get that from what she wrote? She wrote that there are systems that have been ceated by society to resolve conflict in a civilized way. Use them. If the systems are slow, it is still incumbent upon the parent to protect a child's wellbeing.

Is that right, Moretp?

[lookout123]

Originally Posted by Spexxvet

This kind of parenting creates bullies.

You're obviously not christian.

Use a sharper stick, maybe I'll respond.

[Spexxvet]

Originally Posted by lookout123

Use a sharper stick, maybe I'll respond.

Typically evasive.

[Spexxvet]

What would all you "go victim" people think if the little one had gotten up and he and his crew had beaten the big kid until he was unconscious? Still and epic win, because he stood up to his attackers?

[lookout123]

Originally Posted by Spexxvet

Typically evasive.

Have you answered Pete Zicato's question yet?

Let me know when you do and I'll take that as a signal you actually want a discussion.

[piercehawkeye45]

Originally Posted by Spexxvet

This kind of parenting creates bullies.

This philosophy is used in almost all martial arts. You NEVER start a fight and try to avoid them if you can but if you are ever placed in a situation where you need to fight, train so you can defend yourself. This philosophy will usually not create bullies but quite the opposite.

Bullies are not created from learning how to fight. Bullies are created when learning and embracing that using force on someone you perceive as weaker than yourself will benefit you somehow.

[Aliantha]

Originally Posted by morethanpretty

I keep reiterating that it is not easy, it is just better than violence. If it is going to take too long to get them to another school and the bullying is just THAT bad, then just remove them from school for the time being.

I'm not sure what the rules are in the US, but over here you can't just take a kid out of school and keep them at home. Sure you could home school, but what if you already have a full time job? Maybe you should quit to support your child, but then, how will the bills get paid?

It's just not that simple.

Resorting to violence is a last resort, and most parents would encourage their children to try all other avenues, but sometimes they just don't work.

Sure systems could/might be implimented maybe in the future, but what if it's happening now?

It's just like all the other social issues. There's no quick fix, so we have to 'make do' with the best solution until something better comes along.

eta: My recent posts are not so much about this particular thread, but trying to explain what some of you feel is the 'cheering on' of the victim. Trying to help you understand why some of us feel less than sympathetic to the bully and why we recognise that the victim felt he had no other choice. That's real life. That's the way it is, and wishing it were something different is pointless.