#2 VS #14

[jinx]

Originally Posted by Pete Zicato

I'm looking for a frame of reference.
Is this a big problem or a little problem? How does it compare with the other problems we have? Will it cost more to fix this problem than to leave it alone? If you don't have the answers to these questions, then why are you focusing on this particular problem? America's got lots of problems and this is just one of many.

Because changing the constitution is brain surgery. You don't want to do this unless the problem is a major problem. You also don't want to do this if the problem can be fixed with less drastic measures.

The economy is in the toilet, unemployment is very high. Re-evaluation of where the money is going is happening at a familial level all the way thru national level- that's why this issue is in the forefront (imo anyway). America does have a lot of problems. It's not an either-or thing though, you can address this problem AND any other problem you personally want to focus on. Focusing on this one to say we shouldn't be focusing on it is helping how?

The costs: How much does it cost to NOT grant citizenship, issue birth cert. and social secuirty cards, to infants who's mothers can't prove they are here legally?
How much does it cost to have a federal task force inspect paperwork at ever business in America, frequently? (Keep in mind that targeting businesses that most commonly hire illegals would be profiling, so they would have to check every single one. Frequently.)

I agree that business should face penalties for hiring illegals. If done effectively it would reduce incentive for illegal immigration, just like getting rid of the anchor-baby option. Unfortunately, it would also cost a lot.

[Pete Zicato]

Originally Posted by jinx

America does have a lot of problems. It's not an either-or thing though, you can address this problem AND any other problem you personally want to focus on.

This is untrue. Unless you want to raise taxes, there is only so much money to spend on solving americas problems. You can't focus on everything, so you've got to pick and choose.

Originally Posted by jinx

Focusing on this one to say we shouldn't be focusing on it is helping how?

People seem to be in "the sky is falling" mode over this issue. Call me a skeptic, but if people want me to be all upset over this, then I need more than rhetoric. Someone must be out there saying we need to change the constitution. Isn't that the focus of this thread? All I'm saying is that changing the constitution is (or should be) a big deal, and should not be done for issues that can be handled in cheaper simpler ways.

Originally Posted by jinx

The costs: How much does it cost to NOT grant citizenship, issue birth cert. and social secuirty cards, to infants who's mothers can't prove they are here legally?

This sounds ok to me. What is the current law on this? Are children of illegals legal or is this just bad record keeping?

[classicman]

Originally Posted by Pete Zicato

What is the current law on this? Are children of illegals legal or is this just bad record keeping?

Any child born in the US is a US citizen. This is one of the hot-button issues as it creates situations whereby there are millions of families who have both legal and illegal members here. Typically the parents came here illegally and had a child.
Parents = illegal
Child = US citizen.

One argument is that this is not what was intended when it was originally written.