Computers the control the power grid have been hacked

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

AKA, Big Government = Better.

Not exactly.

Reasonable government regulation = better than voluntary industry compliance of essential services in order to protect the health and welfare of the citizens.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by Redux

Not exactly.

Reasonable government regulation = better than voluntary industry compliance in essential services to protect the health and welfare of the citizens.

Previous attempts at that have created big bloated bureaucracies, inefficiency, and cost over-runs. Sorry, I don't buy into that.

Time will tell with the intervention and take over of the numerous banking, credit, and insurance sectors, and now with the auto industry. But they have failed miserably in health care.

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

Previous attempts at that have created big bloated bureaucracies, inefficiency, and cost over-runs. Sorry, I don't buy into that.

Time will tell with the intervention and take over of the numerous banking, credit, and insurance sectors, and now with the auto industry. But they have failed miserably in health care.

It succeeded with protecting the environment. It succeeded with protecting food and drug safety and other consumer products. It succeeded with ensuring workplace safety and basic workers rights. It succeeded with ensuring the safe transportation of hazardous material by rail or truck as well as airline passenger safety (I could go on) ....to no detriment of the regulated industries.

And no one is talking about government "taking over" anything for the long term.

It is fear mongering to compare government regulation with government take-over or government control.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by Redux

It succeeded with protecting the environment. It succeeded with protecting food and drug safety. It succeeded with ensuring workplace safety and basic workers rights....

And no one is talking about government "taking over" anything for the long term.

It is fear mongering to compare government regulation with government take-over or government control.

Environment- yep, till Bush got into power, then no.

Food and Drugs- Nope, not under either Bush or Clinton.

Workplace safety- 50/50. Pretty good job.

IMHO it is not fear mongering when the President of his minions can have the president of a major US Automaker step down. It is not fear mongering when you watch as the Government slowly takes over or gains influence over the major banking, credit, and lending aspects of the private industry while it bankrupts our grandchildren's future with deficit spending.

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

... It is not fear mongering when you watch as the Government slowly takes over or gains influence over the major banking, credit, and lending aspects of the private industry while it bankrupts our grandchildren's future with deficit spending.

A case could be made that if not for the deregulation of banking/financial services by Reagan/Clinton/Bush....perhaps we would not be in this mess where even more stringent short term measures were deemed by many to be needed to right the ship.and those additional deficits avoided.

And government regulation still does not equal government control.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by Redux

A case could be made that if not for the deregulation of banking/financial services by Reagan/Clinton/Bush....perhaps we would not be in this mess where even more stringent short term measures were deemed by many to be needed to right the ship.and those additional deficits avoided.

Certainly.

And government regulation still does not equal government control.

It depends. When the government has the power to dismiss a major US car maker and it controls a major portion of our banking, insurance, and credit market, I would disagree.

[xoxoxoBruce]

You can't blame the government for that, it's the result of those industries fucking up bigtime, because nobody regulated (controlled) them. Now the government has to step in and straighten out the mess, which is hardly what the government wanted.

[sugarpop]

Originally Posted by Redux

It succeeded with protecting the environment. It succeeded with protecting food and drug safety and other consumer products. It succeeded with ensuring workplace safety and basic workers rights. It succeeded with ensuring the safe transportation of hazardous material by rail or truck as well as airline passenger safety (I could go on) ....to no detriment of the regulated industries.

And no one is talking about government "taking over" anything for the long term.

It is fear mongering to compare government regulation with government take-over or government control.

Yea, it's just too bad many of those things have been compromised over the past 8 years.