A New World Order

[TheMercenary]

A United Nations document on "climate change" that will be distributed to a major environmental conclave next week envisions a huge reordering of the world economy, likely involving trillions of dollars in wealth transfer, millions of job losses and gains, new taxes, industrial relocations, new tariffs and subsidies, and complicated payments for greenhouse gas abatement schemes and carbon taxes — all under the supervision of the world body.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,510937,00.html

[classicman]

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

A United Nations document on "climate change" that will be distributed to a major environmental conclave next week envisions a:
1) huge reordering of the world economy, likely involving
2) trillions of dollars in wealth transfer,
3) millions of job losses and gains,
4) new taxes, industrial relocations,
5) new tariffs and subsidies, and
6) complicated payments for greenhouse gas abatement and
7)carbon taxes —
all under the supervision of the world body.

Which of these hasn't already happened?

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by classicman

Which of these hasn't already happened?

8)all under the supervision of the world body.

Even if Obama supports the final version of this new accord (and he hasnt yet), it's passage in Congress is highly unlikely.

Like the Kyoto accord, US probably wont sign it.

[TheMercenary]

Thank God. But it is only a matter of time.

[classicman]

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

8)all under the supervision of the world body.

In your delusional dreams.

[Beestie]

I've used up my outrage quota for this year.

Well, hang on... I'll give it one more try...

Grrr

Yep, all out.

[sugarpop]

Well, I for one really think we need to get this under control, and the United States is the worst offender.

I know President Obama is getting a lot of flak for the cap and trade part of the budget. Energy companies have come out and said they will pass any fines onto their customers. Now, is it RIGHT for a company to have their customers pay for fines they get for practicing bad business? I think NOT. IF it passes, and I have a feeling that part might not, but IF it does, it should be written in that energy plants have to eat that, and CANNOT pass it on to their customers. After all, they have been fighting this for years.

[classicman]

Originally Posted by sugarpop

the United States is the worst offender.

orly?

[xoxoxoBruce]

It wouldn't be if you'd eating that broccoli.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by sugarpop

Well, I for one really think we need to get this under control, and the United States is the worst offender.

I know President Obama is getting a lot of flak for the cap and trade part of the budget. Energy companies have come out and said they will pass any fines onto their customers. Now, is it RIGHT for a company to have their customers pay for fines they get for practicing bad business? I think NOT. IF it passes, and I have a feeling that part might not, but IF it does, it should be written in that energy plants have to eat that, and CANNOT pass it on to their customers. After all, they have been fighting this for years.

I think cap and trade is a fantasy system trading on nothingness. Just like the BS of "carbon footprint".

Originally Posted by classicman

orly?

orly!

The US is number one in the world in anthropogenic CO2 emissions...unless China has passed us in the last year.

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

I think cap and trade is a fantasy system trading on nothingness. Just like the BS of "carbon footprint".

Cap and trade worked pretty well in the US for reducing sulphur dioxide and nitrous oxide emissions as part of the phase-out of leaded gas and CFCs.

IMO, for CO2, a straight carbon tax would be better, but politically unacceptable.

[classicman]

Originally Posted by Redux

The US is number one in the world in anthropogenic CO2 emissions...unless China has passed us in the last year.

These statistics are rapidly dated due to huge recent growth of emissions in Asia. The United States is the 10th largest emitter of carbon dioxide emissions per capita as of 2004.[1] According to preliminary estimates, since 2006 China has had a higher total emission due to its much larger population and an increase of emissions from power generation.[

The beauty of statistics - you get to see what you want.

Originally Posted by classicman

The beauty of statistics - you get to see what you want.

I wouldnt be surprised if China surpassed the US in 2006...but I dont think any official stats to that effect are available yet.

So we are now probably number two...and both the US and China are millions of metric tons above any other country....which IMO means we both should be taking the lead on reducing emissions, but as a US citizen, I cant have much impact on China (well, maybe boycott "made in china" products)

The per capita emissions is interesting...US - #10, China - #91...but not as relevant to me, particularly since the top nine countries are so small, their impact is neglible.

I'm more concerned about total metric tons and what we can do to lower ours....not because of the still debatable impact on climate change, but because IMO, its good public policy to lower greenhouse gas emissions in an environmentally and economically sustainable manner.

Much like the environmental programs of the 70s - clean water act, safe drinking water act, solid waste disposal act, toxic materials disposal act, and clean air act (which Bush rolled back to some extent)....,all were beneficial and despite all the industry dire warnings at the time, there were little or no adverse economic impacts...and in fact, they stimulated the development of cleaner technologies.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by Redux

...which IMO means we both should be taking the lead on reducing emissions...

Not if it costs us billions while China can continue to chug along and build a new coal fired plant each week with no controls.