Immigration Enforcement Un-American?

[TheMercenary]

You should hear the horror stories from the hospital in Brownsville, TX.

[classicman]

... or any border state hospital. The tens of millions (or more) that are spent could fund care for so many uninsured/underinsured Americans.

[monster]

Originally Posted by classicman

Help me out here - If they are here illegally, America isn't their country is it?

No, but last I heard, Americans seem to view themselves as a good force in the world, upholding fairness and adhering to basic human rights. So tearing parents from children and breaking down doors in the middle of the night to do so might be considered un-American in that respect. she said un-American, not anti-American, right?

"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me.
I lift my lamp beside the golden door."

This is still the image America projects to the world. Agreed it is unsustainable, but you can't blame people for still believing in it. they may be illegal, but they're still human.

And believe me, there's nothing that pisses us legals off more than illegals because they make the process harder and nastier for the rest of us.

But they're still human.

[sugarpop]

I agree with that, and I don't blame them for wanting a better life. I have always said the people who cause them to come here should be severely punished. No job, and many of them would leave. But, some people who were born here can't get the care they get. It's infuriating. it's the government's fault for being so wishy washy about it.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by monster

But they're still human.

And they are still criminals. :p

[DanaC]

Originally Posted by sugarpop

But, some people who were born here can't get the care they get. It's infuriating. it's the government's fault for being so wishy washy about it.

The reason those people can't get the care they get, is not because illegal immigrants have taken the care they should have had. It doesn't have to be either or. My God, the damage that has been done to your economy and to your families by a handful of glorified robber barons and yet billions can be found to patch up the wounds they left. You could let everybody in who wanted to come in and you'd probably do less damage to your economy and ramp up the national debt considerably less than the bankers have.

Illegal immigrants are an easy target for anger. But as individuals what they've done is insignificant.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Hardly insignificant.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by monster

No, but last I heard, Americans seem to view themselves as a good force in the world, upholding fairness and adhering to basic human rights.

No, those are images others put on us.

So tearing parents from children and breaking down doors in the middle of the night to do so might be considered un-American in that respect.

She is blowing out of proportion a minority of cases where those who did so did it under the direction of the people who are burdened with trying to get employeers to adhere to the law. The mothers have been allowed to stay with the children and the fathers have been sent to detention to await a hearing for, I hope eventual deportation. But again, this is such a small minority of the number of illegal immigrants in this country.

Here is the cost:

The nation's school system faces the economic burden of providing services to the millions of children born to illegal immigrants. In a 2004 United States General Accounting Office report, three states submitted their annual cost estimates of educating illegal children. The estimates provided ranged from 50 million dollars to 87.5 million in Pennsylvania and 932 million to 1.04 billion dollars in Texas.[i]

FAIR estimates there are currently more than 425,000 children born to illegal aliens each year. This figure is based on the crude birth rate of the total foreign-born population (33 births per 1000) and the size of the illegal alien population (13 million in 2008). In 1994, California paid for 74,987 deliveries to illegal alien mothers, at a total cost of $215.2 million (an average of $2,842 per delivery). Illegal alien mothers accounted for 36 percent of all Medi-Cal funded births in California that year and now count substantially more than half.

http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServe...suecenters4608

[monster]

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

No, those are images others put on us

um... No.


You created this situation, you're all immigrants yourselves. It's like when people stop smoking they turn into nicotine nazis.

OK, Godwin's law invoked, thread dies

[tw]

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

You should hear the horror stories from the hospital in Brownsville, TX.

Same horror stories are found in other hospitals where the clients are overwhelmingly poor. The other forgotten fact.

Eliminate silly raids. Offer visas so that 1.8 million need not vie for only 29,000 permits. Fix the problem rather than enforcing defective laws. So many criticize Pelosi and yet still ignore realities posted here long ago.
Amnesty In America

The Silicon Valley is still screaming about problems created only because government has restricted immigration visas. America no longer graduates enough people with technical knowledge. Instead we graduate mostly business majors. So America desperately needs more productive people - both in the Silicon Valley and on the farms. Smarter is to make productive people legal. Intead we waste money on walls - as if that creates economic stimulus.

What happened when immigration laws were strongly enforced? Economic recessions (ie Nebraska) because those hated immigrants are essential to a more productive America.

[classicman]

Originally Posted by monster

So tearing parents from children and breaking down doors in the middle of the night to do so might be considered un-American in that respect. she said un-American, not anti-American, right?

read post #14

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by monster

um... No.


You created this situation, you're all immigrants yourselves. It's like when people stop smoking they turn into nicotine nazis.

OK, Godwin's law invoked, thread dies

It cannot die! We cannot let it be so!

We are all immigrants like everybody is an immigrant.

Poi Dogs Pondering.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by monster

um... No.


You created this situation, you're all immigrants yourselves.

It's not about immigrants, it's about criminals.
A republic is based on the rule of law. Enforce it or change it, ignoring it debases the very fabric of our country.

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

It's not about immigrants, it's about criminals.
A republic is based on the rule of law. Enforce it or change it, ignoring it debases the very fabric of our country.

Illegal immigration is not a criminal act....it is a civil violation.

Treating persons who commit a civil violation as criminals yet denying them the rights given to criminals -the right to counsel, the right to a speedy hearing or trial, the right to post bond or a bond hearing, etc. - debases the rule of law which is the very fabric of our country.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by Redux

Illegal immigration is not a criminal act....it is a civil violation.

Treating persons who commit a civil violation as criminals yet denying them the rights given to criminals -the right to counsel, the right to a speedy hearing or trial, the right to post bond or a bond hearing, etc. - debases the rule of law which is the very fabric of our country.

They are criminals.