All White Jury

classicman · 09-12-2008, 08:04 AM

The jury selection is complete and O.J. Simpson is to be tried by an all white jury. There are 9 women and 3 men all white comprising the jury. Also, there are two alternates who are black. Anyone see a problem with this?

Quote:

LAS VEGAS - An all-white jury will judge O.J. Simpson and a co-defendant on kidnapping and robbery charges after defense lawyers lost a contentious courtroom battle to include two African-American women on the panel.
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District Attorney David Roger gave the judge what he called "race neutral" reasons for removing the two with his peremptory challenges, and defended the final makeup of the jury chosen late Thursday night, saying that two of six alternate jurors are black.

Both of the women who were removed had strong religious views, and the prosecutor said he thought one of them would be inclined to "forgive" Simpson while the other said she was hesitant to send anyone to prison.

Simpson's 1995 acquittal on murder charges came from a predominantly black jury.

Link

Anyone else have reservations with this?

glatt · 09-12-2008, 08:11 AM

It's not a jury of his peers.

It would be better if the jury's ethnicity reflected the ethnicity of the Las Vegas community. Maybe it does. I don't know anything about the Vegas population.

DanaC · 09-12-2008, 08:11 AM

I think it's clumsy. If the verdict is guilty it will be automatically suspect because of the jury being white.

If they allowed an all black jury the samne could be said of any not guilty verdict.

Ibby · 09-12-2008, 08:34 AM

12-13% of America is african-american. roughly 10% of las vegas is african-american. 10% of nine people is .9, which rounds to one. but including the alternates, 10% of 11 is 1.1, which also rounds to one. while it is a little bit iffy to have all 9 jury members white and both alternates black... we aren't talking anything MAJORLY statistically deviant. one in ten people are gay, too - should we question any jury that doesn't include a gay person?

Sundae · 09-12-2008, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glatt

It's not a jury of his peers.

But where are they going to find 12 black, ex pro football playing, sports commentating murderers?

Shawnee123 · 09-12-2008, 08:47 AM

Some of the Bengals aren't busy.

Bullitt · 09-12-2008, 09:02 AM

No I do not see a problem with this.

classicman · 09-12-2008, 09:22 AM

My initial thought was the same as Dana's post. I like what Ibram did with the statistics though. Interesting on the gay question too. Hmm, I wonder if that would be a relevant stance if sexuality was germane to the crime.

Ibby · 09-12-2008, 09:38 AM

How is race germane to the crime?

BrianR · 09-12-2008, 09:41 AM

I question the whole "peers" term.

It seems to me that the only thing they have in common is being adult (aged). My jury did not include either the truck driver or the paratransit guy. A "Peer" should be at least as well educated and a group should include gender, occupation and a germane similarity in the crime in question.

My jury was simply too stupid to get out of jury duty.

glatt · 09-12-2008, 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by classicman

I like what Ibram did with the statistics though. Interesting on the gay question too. Hmm, I wonder if that would be a relevant stance if sexuality was germane to the crime.

Yeah, but according to your quote, there are 12 people on the jury, not 9. Plus 2 alternates. I don't know why Ibby did his calculation based on 9. It all still rounds off to 1 black juror if you are trying to mimic the general population. But it's between 1 and 2, not less than 1.

I think it would be healthy to have a couple blacks on the jury. It looks bad with all whites. I'm not gonna lose sleep over it though. They had their day in court (literally) to try to get a sympathetic jury.

Pico and ME · 09-12-2008, 09:44 AM

Quote:

How is race germane to the crime?

Im pretty sure Classicman didnt mean 'crime' per se....replace it with 'jury picks'.

Ibby · 09-12-2008, 09:59 AM

My bad, I read too fast.
Okay, so. 12 jurors - still, only about 1 of them should statistically be black - and not having any isn't statistically shocking.
including alternates there's 18. 2 are black. 1.8 is 10% of 18. 1.8 rounds to about 2, so that's about right.

dar512 · 09-12-2008, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by classicman

The jury selection is complete and O.J. Simpson is to be tried by an all white jury. There are 9 women and 3 men all white comprising the jury. Also, there are two alternates who are black. Anyone see a problem with this?

Problem with jury selection in general or problem with this particular instance?

As I understand it, both sides have a say in the jury selection. If the defense thought they'd be better off with the alternates, I'd guess they'd have been selected.

Shawnee123 · 09-12-2008, 10:13 AM

I'm amazed they could find a jury at all; most humans have some pretty deeply ingrained notions about the Juice, whether good or bad.

09-12-2008, 08:34 AM	#4
Ibby erika Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: "the high up north" Posts: 6,127	12-13% of America is african-american. roughly 10% of las vegas is african-american. 10% of nine people is .9, which rounds to one. but including the alternates, 10% of 11 is 1.1, which also rounds to one. while it is a little bit iffy to have all 9 jury members white and both alternates black... we aren't talking anything MAJORLY statistically deviant. one in ten people are gay, too - should we question any jury that doesn't include a gay person? __________________ not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh

09-12-2008, 08:47 AM	#6
Shawnee123 Why, you're a regular Alfred E Einstein, ain't ya? Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 21,206	Some of the Bengals aren't busy. __________________ A word to the wise ain't necessary - it's the stupid ones who need the advice. --Bill Cosby

09-12-2008, 09:02 AM	#7
Bullitt This is a fully functional babe lair Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Akron, OH Posts: 2,324	No I do not see a problem with this. __________________ Kiss my white Irish ass.

09-12-2008, 09:22 AM	#8
classicman barely disguised asshole, keeper of all that is holy. Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 23,401	My initial thought was the same as Dana's post. I like what Ibram did with the statistics though. Interesting on the gay question too. Hmm, I wonder if that would be a relevant stance if sexuality was germane to the crime. __________________ "like strapping a pillow on a bull in a china shop" Bullitt

09-12-2008, 09:38 AM	#9
Ibby erika Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: "the high up north" Posts: 6,127	How is race germane to the crime? __________________ not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh

09-12-2008, 08:11 AM	#2
glatt ™ Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Arlington, VA Posts: 27,717	It's not a jury of his peers. It would be better if the jury's ethnicity reflected the ethnicity of the Las Vegas community. Maybe it does. I don't know anything about the Vegas population.

09-12-2008, 08:11 AM	#3
DanaC We have to go back, Kate! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 25,964	I think it's clumsy. If the verdict is guilty it will be automatically suspect because of the jury being white. If they allowed an all black jury the samne could be said of any not guilty verdict.

09-12-2008, 09:41 AM	#10
BrianR Cleverly disguised as a responsible adult Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 3,338	I question the whole "peers" term. It seems to me that the only thing they have in common is being adult (aged). My jury did not include either the truck driver or the paratransit guy. A "Peer" should be at least as well educated and a group should include gender, occupation and a germane similarity in the crime in question. My jury was simply too stupid to get out of jury duty. __________________ Never be afraid to tell the world who you are. -- Anonymous

09-12-2008, 09:59 AM	#13
Ibby erika Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: "the high up north" Posts: 6,127	My bad, I read too fast. Okay, so. 12 jurors - still, only about 1 of them should statistically be black - and not having any isn't statistically shocking. including alternates there's 18. 2 are black. 1.8 is 10% of 18. 1.8 rounds to about 2, so that's about right. __________________ not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh

09-12-2008, 10:13 AM	#15
Shawnee123 Why, you're a regular Alfred E Einstein, ain't ya? Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 21,206	I'm amazed they could find a jury at all; most humans have some pretty deeply ingrained notions about the Juice, whether good or bad. __________________ A word to the wise ain't necessary - it's the stupid ones who need the advice. --Bill Cosby

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