Welfare Letter - Page 2

classicman · 01-18-2008, 07:36 AM

Problem with removing incentives is there are two issues at hand -
1) Those that are having children to live off the welfare system and
2) those who are just poor and ignorant (srsly). Not bein mean.

The first group would try to find some other way to abuse the system and the latter group would suffer terribly because they were/are unwittingly having children. I thought the implants (norplant?) would have some impact on this issue, but then it became a moral issue with preventing them from reproducing... human rights something blah blah blah.

Oh and yeah - don't forget there are kids involved here too - guess the whole adoption thing coulda helped out there, but it doesn't seem to be.

Shawnee123 · 01-18-2008, 07:45 AM

Some young adults get screwed on educational benefits in this country as well, by choosing to work, live on their own, remain single, and not have children yet. Help with school? Hey, you make a whopping 13 grand a year, you don't need funding. Now, if you'd find a way to get yourself a kid...

Education should be accessible, to the poor, but also to the middle. The incentive for many lies in using the system because let's face it, Burger King wages pale in comparison to the other side (unless, of course, you work in Financial Aid...then BK wages start looking pretty good.)

I don't know the solution. I have empathy for the poor. I love to see the success stories I see. I believe in helping others. (The tax credits, well sorry, I don't think making a $6000 profit on your tax return is fair to the childless; yes it costs money to raise children but I neither made that choice for them nor got them pregnant, but I watch my total tax liability go to the opposite end of profit every year. Can't I just write my check direct rather than funnelling it through the IRS?)

However, having said that, I see many, many, many (did I say "many"?) people who knowingly, willfully, and without shame, play the system...year after year.

Eh, like I said, I'm a bit jaded. One minute my picture was next to the entry in the dictionary for "liberal" and the next I'm thinking WTF? Jaded, not jaded. Jaded, not jaded.

classicman · 01-18-2008, 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shawnee123

Burger King wages pale in comparison to the other side...

Trust me, McDonalds doesn't pay much more.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shawnee123

Eh, like I said, I'm a bit jaded. One minute my picture was next to the entry in the dictionary for "liberal" and the next I'm thinking WTF? Jaded, not jaded. Jaded, not jaded.

You've got a lot of company.

Clodfobble · 01-18-2008, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sundae Girl

I suggest 3 year implants for every girl aged 14 unless there is a specific medical case against it.

Good luck with that. It would never ever happen here, because it would "encourage" those precious little snowflakes to have sex. We just had a huge hubbub about a new vaccine to prevent cervical cancer--there were actually large numbers of people who did not want the vaccine given to 12-year-old girls specifically because the cause of this particular cancer is an STD, and thus giving it to them was just one more safeguard for their immorality.

Cicero · 01-19-2008, 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clodfobble

Good luck with that. It would never ever happen here, because it would "encourage" those precious little snowflakes to have sex. We just had a huge hubbub about a new vaccine to prevent cervical cancer--there were actually large numbers of people who did not want the vaccine given to 12-year-old girls specifically because the cause of this particular cancer is an STD, and thus giving it to them was just one more safeguard for their immorality.

Sundae and Clod:
No. It wouldn't work because:People like me would get pissed about mandatory reproductive laws falling on girls (again) and say they have had enough!! I'm tired of women having to be responsible for every goddamned thing. We have always bared the burden for every fucked up social problem there is....screw that suggestion let's toss it. Here's one.

One word:Vasectomies.

K?

When the guy gets married,becomes a certain age, or is certain he wants a baby, and stops sowing his seed all over the field...it can be reversed. Which is the cause of so many welfare babies. Guys are fucking and running, at alarming rates. "dat ain' mi bebby" So before we even think to inconvenience women again lets attack the problem from where it stems.

Who remembers the male "pill"? What in the hell happened to that?!? Where did it go, and why has it not been released?!? This is bullshit...I get so frustrated sometimes....

classicman · 01-20-2008, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cicero

I'm tired of women having to be responsible for every goddamned thing. We have always bared the burden for every fucked up social problem there is....screw that suggestion let's toss it. Here's one.

One word:Vasectomies.

K?

When the guy gets married,becomes a certain age, or is certain he wants a baby, and stops sowing his seed all over the field...it can be reversed. Which is the cause of so many welfare babies. Guys are fucking and running, at alarming rates. "dat ain' mi bebby" So before we even think to inconvenience women again lets attack the problem from where it stems.

Who remembers the male "pill"? What in the hell happened to that?!? Where did it go, and why has it not been released?!? This is bullshit...I get so frustrated sometimes....

I'm not so sure I agree with your vasectomy point, but a male pill would be more than a great idea.

binky · 01-22-2008, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by classicman

I'm not so sure I agree with your vasectomy point, but a male pill would be more than a great idea.

Oh come on its just a little snip

classicman · 01-22-2008, 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by binky

Oh come on its just a little snip

FWIW - I did my part - snipped and clipped.

Shawnee123 · 01-18-2008, 10:39 AM

So true, Clodfobble. Incredibly sad and stupid and short-sighted (on their part), but true.

classicman · 01-18-2008, 11:08 AM

I third that thought!

Clodfobble · 01-18-2008, 11:10 AM

Fortunately in the end it passed, in Texas anyway. I don't know about other states. What it really came down to in the end is that our governor is more beholden to the pharmaceutical lobby than the religious lobby. Not the best of reasons, but I'm still glad it worked out the way it did.

TheMercenary · 01-18-2008, 11:22 AM

Well I will be saying a bit more than I want to about myself here but here goes any ways...

If you all have not figured it out, I work in the health care sector. Specifically I am a health care provider. That is all I want to say about that. I can tell you that a majority of people scam the system, in my limited experience of 30 years. It is not pretty. There is no easy fix. After a while you fold in on yourself and do the best you can for the people you care for, regardless of their personal situations or ability to pay, and in the end take care of yourself and your family to the best of your ability. Anyone have any experience slamming your head against a brick wall repeatedly? After a while all you get is a head ache, the brick wall only gets bloodied and remains indifferent.

Trilby · 01-19-2008, 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

Well I will be saying a bit more than I want to about myself here but here goes any ways...

If you all have not figured it out, I work in the health care sector. Specifically I am a health care provider. That is all I want to say about that. I can tell you that a majority of people scam the system, in my limited experience of 30 years. It is not pretty. There is no easy fix. After a while you fold in on yourself and do the best you can for the people you care for, regardless of their personal situations or ability to pay, and in the end take care of yourself and your family to the best of your ability. Anyone have any experience slamming your head against a brick wall repeatedly? After a while all you get is a head ache, the brick wall only gets bloodied and remains indifferent.

Working in health care destroyed me. Literally. When I quit I felt like I needed to be de-briefed and get PTSD therapy. The more you care the more you're burned.

classicman · 01-18-2008, 11:35 AM

wait - please. What passed? I missed it.

Flint · 01-18-2008, 11:46 AM

The "controversial" life-saving cervical cancer vaccine legislation.

01-18-2008, 07:36 AM	#1
classicman barely disguised asshole, keeper of all that is holy. Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 23,401	Problem with removing incentives is there are two issues at hand - 1) Those that are having children to live off the welfare system and 2) those who are just poor and ignorant (srsly). Not bein mean. The first group would try to find some other way to abuse the system and the latter group would suffer terribly because they were/are unwittingly having children. I thought the implants (norplant?) would have some impact on this issue, but then it became a moral issue with preventing them from reproducing... human rights something blah blah blah. Oh and yeah - don't forget there are kids involved here too - guess the whole adoption thing coulda helped out there, but it doesn't seem to be. __________________ "like strapping a pillow on a bull in a china shop" Bullitt

01-18-2008, 07:45 AM	#2
Shawnee123 Why, you're a regular Alfred E Einstein, ain't ya? Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 21,206	Some young adults get screwed on educational benefits in this country as well, by choosing to work, live on their own, remain single, and not have children yet. Help with school? Hey, you make a whopping 13 grand a year, you don't need funding. Now, if you'd find a way to get yourself a kid... Education should be accessible, to the poor, but also to the middle. The incentive for many lies in using the system because let's face it, Burger King wages pale in comparison to the other side (unless, of course, you work in Financial Aid...then BK wages start looking pretty good.) I don't know the solution. I have empathy for the poor. I love to see the success stories I see. I believe in helping others. (The tax credits, well sorry, I don't think making a $6000 profit on your tax return is fair to the childless; yes it costs money to raise children but I neither made that choice for them nor got them pregnant, but I watch my total tax liability go to the opposite end of profit every year. Can't I just write my check direct rather than funnelling it through the IRS?) However, having said that, I see many, many, many (did I say "many"?) people who knowingly, willfully, and without shame, play the system...year after year. Eh, like I said, I'm a bit jaded. One minute my picture was next to the entry in the dictionary for "liberal" and the next I'm thinking WTF? Jaded, not jaded. Jaded, not jaded. Last edited by Shawnee123; 01-18-2008 at 07:51 AM.

01-18-2008, 11:08 AM	#10
classicman barely disguised asshole, keeper of all that is holy. Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 23,401	I third that thought! __________________ "like strapping a pillow on a bull in a china shop" Bullitt

01-18-2008, 11:22 AM	#12
TheMercenary “Hypocrisy: prejudice with a halo” Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Savannah, Georgia Posts: 21,393	Well I will be saying a bit more than I want to about myself here but here goes any ways... If you all have not figured it out, I work in the health care sector. Specifically I am a health care provider. That is all I want to say about that. I can tell you that a majority of people scam the system, in my limited experience of 30 years. It is not pretty. There is no easy fix. After a while you fold in on yourself and do the best you can for the people you care for, regardless of their personal situations or ability to pay, and in the end take care of yourself and your family to the best of your ability. Anyone have any experience slamming your head against a brick wall repeatedly? After a while all you get is a head ache, the brick wall only gets bloodied and remains indifferent. __________________ Anyone but the this most fuked up President in History in 2012!

01-18-2008, 11:35 AM	#14
classicman barely disguised asshole, keeper of all that is holy. Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 23,401	wait - please. What passed? I missed it. __________________ "like strapping a pillow on a bull in a china shop" Bullitt

01-18-2008, 10:39 AM	#9
Shawnee123 Why, you're a regular Alfred E Einstein, ain't ya? Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 21,206	So true, Clodfobble. Incredibly sad and stupid and short-sighted (on their part), but true.

01-18-2008, 11:10 AM	#11
Clodfobble UNDER CONDITIONAL MITIGATION Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 20,012	Fortunately in the end it passed, in Texas anyway. I don't know about other states. What it really came down to in the end is that our governor is more beholden to the pharmaceutical lobby than the religious lobby. Not the best of reasons, but I'm still glad it worked out the way it did.

01-18-2008, 11:46 AM	#15
Flint Snowflake Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Dystopia Posts: 13,136	The "controversial" life-saving cervical cancer vaccine legislation. __________________ **************** There's a level of facility that everyone needs to accomplish, and from there it's a matter of deciding for yourself how important ultra-facility is to your expression. ... I found, like Joseph Campbell said, if you just follow whatever gives you a little joy or excitement or awe, then you're on the right track. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Terry Bozzio**

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