Britons named world's biggest emitters - Page 6

Sundae · 10-31-2007, 04:04 PM

How does that fit with your view that we are going to hell in a handbasket and nobody cares?

You do realise that this is not really an issue regarding CCTV (despite the comment from Liberty who are a pressure group within Britain who oppose CCTV) this is an issue re not properly screening the features of a man who made a suicide attempt in a public place?

I don't see anything in that article which suggests the Judge disagrees with CCTV.

HungLikeJesus · 10-31-2007, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aliantha

I watched in interesting doco on CCTV in England last night. There's actually only 130 (or close to that figure) cameras in the whole of the country which surprised me. I would have thought there'd be more.

...

Not to get involved in this debate one way or another, but this article says that "There are up to 4.2m CCTV cameras in Britain - about one for every 14 people."

Aliantha · 10-31-2007, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jinx

That's only in the movies... the people they show on the news wear a baseball cap and sunglasses.

you mean the bad guys don't wear balaclavas? I can't believe that! They all wear them over here. Except the ones that're so drug fucked they forgot.

Aliantha · 10-31-2007, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HungLikeJesus

Not to get involved in this debate one way or another, but this article says that "There are up to 4.2m CCTV cameras in Britain - about one for every 14 people."

It's possible that I misheard. Perhaps they were talking about a particular section of a grid or something?

I'm sure the poms here can give us the facts anyway.

Besides, I did say I thought there'd be more, so at least I can content myself with that.

DanaC · 10-31-2007, 05:01 PM

That ruling is about the use of footage, not about where the camera is. I wholly agree that such footage should be protected.

Christ on a bike Cic. Are you saying you are inside Britain?

Aliantha · 10-31-2007, 05:04 PM

you lasted longer than me Dana.

I appreciated your points and I agree that Cic was being insulting towards you for no reason. She does it to me also which I why I dropped out of this debate (in any meaningful way).

DanaC · 10-31-2007, 05:09 PM

Quote:

The judge, Mr Justice Harrison, ruled in November 1997 that the council was within its rights under English law to release the film and had not been acting irrationally.

But he added: "Unless and until there is a general right of privacy recognised by English law - and the implications are there may soon be so by the incorporation of the European convention on human rights into law - reliance must be placed on effective guidance being issued by codes of practice in order to try and stop such undesirable invasions of a person's privacy."

Guidelines. The judge is suggesting that unless privacy is protected by law, there should be stricter guidelines. he has not said CCTV are dangerous and should be fought against.

It is standard practice in this country to disguise people's faces if they are being shown on TV or in newspapers, unless the footage is being shown to help apprehend a criminal (e.g the TV show crimewatch may show cctv from inside a shop during a robbery), or permission is sought and given. What went wrong on this occassion is that CCTV footage was shown in which this gentleman's face had not been properly disguised.

In what way is this a route to a Big Brother state?

I'd also like to point out that the CCTV in question was placed by a local Council as part of its LAA (Local Area Agreement), a document which is available for any citizen to read and comment on. IN most areas of the country, Councils are struggling with the fact that properly managed CCTV is expensive and yet their constituents want more of them.

Cic, I said you were an outsider as in you have an outsider's perspective on Britain. In much the same way I have an outsider's perspective on America. On an intellectual level I understand the American approach to gun laws and medical provision. On a gut level I do not fully understand it. These things clash with my cultural understanding of the world. They do not fit into my mentalite.

DanaC · 10-31-2007, 05:10 PM

Ali, just so your post doesn't look out of context, I want to point out to people that I have edited the preceding post :P

Aliantha · 10-31-2007, 05:14 PM

I think my point as a response to your post is still pretty clear mate.

DanaC · 10-31-2007, 05:15 PM

*chuckles* good good, just wanted to be sure

Cicero · 10-31-2007, 06:12 PM

I'm sorry I was refering to your own watch-dog groups....forget it.

She had to erase the post because I'm not insulting anyone. I'm not even talking to anyone in this thread right now but DanaC. But we'll close that out as well.

DanaC · 10-31-2007, 06:23 PM

*bangs head against a brick wal then walks off with bleeding forehead*

Hang on no. Before I go. I edited that post because in it I said I wasn't going to talk to you any more. I suggested that you are the one refusing to step outside your 'cultural closet' because every time I try to explain to you what the British perspective on CCTV is, you tell me I am blindly tripping down a path towards a Big Brother state.

I was far too vehement. I do not believe I was particularly insulting, certainly not as insulting as I am capable of being. I did however use this phrase:

When will enough be enough? Right fucking now.

I am repeating that phrase because I think it adequately sums up how I feel right now.

Consider this subject closed as far as I am concerned.

Sundae · 10-31-2007, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cicero

I'm not even talking to anyone in this thread right now but DanaC. But we'll close that out as well.

But don't you see that that speaks volumes? I've posted, Zen and Ali have posted (being subjects of a similar "police state") and yet you refuse to believe this has anything to do with the values with which you were brought up?

It's not a personal attack Cicero. We are not saying you are some sort of dumb American. We are just trying to agree to disagree without mudslinging. You may notice the non-Americans keep a low profile in the gun laws threads.

Perry Winkle · 10-31-2007, 06:47 PM

It's so weird seeing all the CCTV cameras around. It's so odd that my mind has mapped them out. I think I know upwards of 75% of the cameras within a one mile radius of my dorm. My brain has become fixated on the stupid things.

I think the strange thing for me is that they're all linked to the same organisation. In the States they are mostly privately owned, even if they are centrally monitored by the likes of ADT.

DanaC · 10-31-2007, 06:53 PM

The ones you know about are :P Have you talked to anybody about them? Just wondering if you'd got any opinions from others.

10-31-2007, 04:04 PM	#76
Sundae polaroid of perfection Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 24,185	How does that fit with your view that we are going to hell in a handbasket and nobody cares? You do realise that this is not really an issue regarding CCTV (despite the comment from Liberty who are a pressure group within Britain who oppose CCTV) this is an issue re not properly screening the features of a man who made a suicide attempt in a public place? I don't see anything in that article which suggests the Judge disagrees with CCTV. __________________ Life's hard you know, so strike a pose on a Cadillac

10-31-2007, 05:01 PM	#80
DanaC We have to go back, Kate! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 25,964	That ruling is about the use of footage, not about where the camera is. I wholly agree that such footage should be protected. Christ on a bike Cic. Are you saying you are inside Britain? Last edited by DanaC; 10-31-2007 at 05:03 PM. Reason: Unfairly vehement.

10-31-2007, 05:04 PM	#81
Aliantha trying hard to be a better person Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 16,493	you lasted longer than me Dana. I appreciated your points and I agree that Cic was being insulting towards you for no reason. She does it to me also which I why I dropped out of this debate (in any meaningful way). __________________ Kind words are the music of the world. F. W. Faber

10-31-2007, 05:14 PM	#84
Aliantha trying hard to be a better person Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 16,493	I think my point as a response to your post is still pretty clear mate. __________________ Kind words are the music of the world. F. W. Faber

10-31-2007, 06:12 PM	#86
Cicero Looking forward to open mic night. Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: New Mexico Posts: 5,148	I'm sorry I was refering to your own watch-dog groups....forget it. She had to erase the post because I'm not insulting anyone. I'm not even talking to anyone in this thread right now but DanaC. But we'll close that out as well. __________________ Show me a sane man, and I will cure him for you.- Carl Jung Last edited by Cicero; 10-31-2007 at 06:19 PM.

10-31-2007, 05:10 PM	#83
DanaC We have to go back, Kate! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 25,964	Ali, just so your post doesn't look out of context, I want to point out to people that I have edited the preceding post :P

10-31-2007, 05:15 PM	#85
DanaC We have to go back, Kate! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 25,964	chuckles good good, just wanted to be sure

10-31-2007, 06:23 PM	#87
DanaC We have to go back, Kate! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 25,964	bangs head against a brick wal then walks off with bleeding forehead Hang on no. Before I go. I edited that post because in it I said I wasn't going to talk to you any more. I suggested that you are the one refusing to step outside your 'cultural closet' because every time I try to explain to you what the British perspective on CCTV is, you tell me I am blindly tripping down a path towards a Big Brother state. I was far too vehement. I do not believe I was particularly insulting, certainly not as insulting as I am capable of being. I did however use this phrase: When will enough be enough? Right fucking now. I am repeating that phrase because I think it adequately sums up how I feel right now. Consider this subject closed as far as I am concerned.

10-31-2007, 06:47 PM	#89
Perry Winkle Esnohplad Semaj Ton Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: A little south of sanity Posts: 2,259	It's so weird seeing all the CCTV cameras around. It's so odd that my mind has mapped them out. I think I know upwards of 75% of the cameras within a one mile radius of my dorm. My brain has become fixated on the stupid things. I think the strange thing for me is that they're all linked to the same organisation. In the States they are mostly privately owned, even if they are centrally monitored by the likes of ADT.

10-31-2007, 06:53 PM	#90
DanaC We have to go back, Kate! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 25,964	The ones you know about are :P Have you talked to anybody about them? Just wondering if you'd got any opinions from others.

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