Ending God's Tax Exempt Status - Page 28

piercehawkeye45 · 08-30-2007, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rkzenrage

What does that mean?
You think people should be punished just for being rich alone?
It seems like you think it is self-explanatory, it is not.

The previous argument for the speeding ticket prices was that it evened out the playing field for all income levels so the rich were penalized proportionally the same as the poor. Some people say it is an advantage of being rich that should be there to be proportionality penalized less and some people think that it shouldn't be there. I said besides that point so that means I didn't place my opinion on that matter so no, I don't think people should be punished for being rich alone.

Quote:

I'm really curious as to what you mean by this.... I think my answer to it is probably, no I don't, if it means what I think it does.

The system of a flat rate is naturally classist. A speeding ticket for a poor person can screw up their entire balance while it doesn't even leave a dent for a rich person. Some people and countries want to break down that naturally classist system and this is one way of doing this. Once again, I placed no personal opinion on that particular statement.

08-30-2007, 11:14 PM

Yup.

9th Engineer · 08-30-2007, 11:23 PM

It's really the practice of adjusting punishment according to a person's tolerance for it. You say a rich person can tolerate a fine more easily then someone on a lower income and that's true. But I don't like the idea of the courts telling me "we've decided that you can stand more punishment then we usually give out, so we're going to increase our sentence". It's just easier with money, doesn't make it just.

Aliantha · 08-30-2007, 11:27 PM

So maybe giving people fines isn't the best way then since it seems one person will be 'punished' more than another no matter which way you go.

HungLikeJesus · 08-31-2007, 12:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yesman065

I think it was a reverence to context.

Reverence, yes.

xoxoxoBruce · 08-31-2007, 03:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aliantha

No, just fine them proportionately to their income. The same as a sliding tax scale which if my memory serves me correctly, you're opposed to also.

I'm not questioning the country's choice of a percentage fine being fair. However, I think 14 days gross pay, that's almost three weeks, for that offense, is very severe.... draconian, even.

DanaC · 08-31-2007, 05:13 AM

I agree with the idea of proportionate fines. I also agree with Bruce that 14 days pay is an over harsh fine.

In the UK I think a speeding ticket is between £60 and £100. Which is less than half a week's wage for the average earner. You also get points on your licence, I think it's three points for speeding. I'm not sure how long the points stay on, something like a year or two. If you go over 12 points on your licence your licence is revoked (for a period of time, I think about a year).

Aliantha · 08-31-2007, 07:33 AM

Yep. two weeks is pretty harsh...unless you're going very very fast I suppose.

piercehawkeye45 · 08-31-2007, 09:23 AM

For what speeding offense is 14 days pay for? Like were they going 20 over on a country road or 50 over on a city road in a school zone?

I agree that 14 days pay is way too much for almost every situation but there should be variations of fines on how much faster you are going and where you are speeding. The only way I can see that being justified if they were doing something really stupid and seriously putting other people in danger, then I find it to be a completely fair punishment.

queequeger · 08-31-2007, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

No, he want's to bring the US down to their level. He's more than happy to give away my money and my country so we aren't being mean.

Hahahahahahaha!!!!

Dana, Aliantha, how does it feel living in squalor and without freedoms? You guys must really hate sitting on the other side of the pond reading our free, amazing, american comments and thinking 'Oh, please! Please let me come in, it's so horrible over here!'

Anyone else from outside the US, do you guys have little meetings where you gush over living in the states? I mean, I'm sure you're all desperately in love with us, but is it public? I mean the reason there aren't "We Love the US" rallies all over the news all the time is because your oppressive governments don't allow peaceful assembly, right? I'd love to let you in, but :sorry: my economy couldn't take it.

xoxoxoBruce · 08-31-2007, 11:30 AM

There you go again. Saying I said things I clearly didn't. Stop it.

yesman065 · 08-31-2007, 11:44 AM

queerqueger, If it was so great everyehere else or sucks so bad to be here, why do so many people want to be here? Better yet, if its so great everywhere else why don't YOU go there? We let lots of people leave. Why is they are not flocking to get outta here?

queequeger · 08-31-2007, 11:51 AM

I am, actually.

How can you guys not see how ridiculous comments like that are? The rest of the world doesn't want to live here, some people do. And countries in every corner of the globe have many immigrants. To say that immigration means we're BETTER than everyone else is absurd, and frankly it's bordering on jingoism. We're not a BAD country, I would never go that far. There are things I absolutely love about the US and that I will miss, but to think we're so much better than everyone else that comparison is out of the question... well it's just a little weird.

xoxoxoBruce · 08-31-2007, 11:53 AM

Just who the fuck said we were better than everyone else?

DanaC · 08-31-2007, 12:27 PM

Quote:

No, he want's to bring the US down to their level.

That kind of hints at it.

08-30-2007, 11:23 PM	#408
9th Engineer Bioengineer and aspiring lawer Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 872	It's really the practice of adjusting punishment according to a person's tolerance for it. You say a rich person can tolerate a fine more easily then someone on a lower income and that's true. But I don't like the idea of the courts telling me "we've decided that you can stand more punishment then we usually give out, so we're going to increase our sentence". It's just easier with money, doesn't make it just. __________________ The most valuable renewable resource is stupidity.

08-30-2007, 11:27 PM	#409
Aliantha trying hard to be a better person Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 16,493	So maybe giving people fines isn't the best way then since it seems one person will be 'punished' more than another no matter which way you go. __________________ Kind words are the music of the world. F. W. Faber

08-31-2007, 07:33 AM	#413
Aliantha trying hard to be a better person Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 16,493	Yep. two weeks is pretty harsh...unless you're going very very fast I suppose. __________________ Kind words are the music of the world. F. W. Faber

08-31-2007, 11:30 AM	#416
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	There you go again. Saying I said things I clearly didn't. Stop it. __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

08-31-2007, 11:51 AM	#418
queequeger Hypercharismatic Telepathical Knight Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: The armpit of the Universe... Augusta, GA Posts: 365	I am, actually. How can you guys not see how ridiculous comments like that are? The rest of the world doesn't want to live here, some people do. And countries in every corner of the globe have many immigrants. To say that immigration means we're BETTER than everyone else is absurd, and frankly it's bordering on jingoism. We're not a BAD country, I would never go that far. There are things I absolutely love about the US and that I will miss, but to think we're so much better than everyone else that comparison is out of the question... well it's just a little weird. __________________ Hoocha, hoocha, hoocha... lobster.

08-30-2007, 11:14 PM	#407
rkzenrage Guest Posts: n/a	Yup.

08-31-2007, 05:13 AM	#412
DanaC We have to go back, Kate! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 25,964	I agree with the idea of proportionate fines. I also agree with Bruce that 14 days pay is an over harsh fine. In the UK I think a speeding ticket is between £60 and £100. Which is less than half a week's wage for the average earner. You also get points on your licence, I think it's three points for speeding. I'm not sure how long the points stay on, something like a year or two. If you go over 12 points on your licence your licence is revoked (for a period of time, I think about a year).

08-31-2007, 09:23 AM	#414
piercehawkeye45 Franklin Pierce Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,695	For what speeding offense is 14 days pay for? Like were they going 20 over on a country road or 50 over on a city road in a school zone? I agree that 14 days pay is way too much for almost every situation but there should be variations of fines on how much faster you are going and where you are speeding. The only way I can see that being justified if they were doing something really stupid and seriously putting other people in danger, then I find it to be a completely fair punishment.

08-31-2007, 11:44 AM	#417
yesman065 Banned - Self Imposed Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 1,847	queerqueger, If it was so great everyehere else or sucks so bad to be here, why do so many people want to be here? Better yet, if its so great everywhere else why don't YOU go there? We let lots of people leave. Why is they are not flocking to get outta here?

08-31-2007, 11:53 AM	#419
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	Just who the fuck said we were better than everyone else? __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

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