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		#16 | 
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			 trying hard to be a better person 
			
			
			
			Join Date: Jan 2006 
				Location: Brisbane, Australia 
				
				
					Posts: 16,493
				 
				
				
				
				
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			Mental illness is unpredictable.  You can in no way put any of this on yourself Els.  You can only do what you can do and no more.   
		
		
		
		
		
		
			I'm sorry for your loss. 
				__________________ 
		
		
		
		
	Kind words are the music of the world. F. W. Faber  | 
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		#17 | 
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			 Encroaching on your decrees 
			
			
			
			Join Date: Feb 2004 
				Location: An island within the south-west coast of Scotland 
				
				
					Posts: 7,016
				 
				
				
				
				
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			I'll add my condolences and sympathy to those already expressed here, both for you and for the families of the victims.
		 
		
		
		
		
		
		
			
				__________________ 
		
		
		
		
	Living it up on the edge ... of civilisation, within the southwest coast of  
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		#18 | 
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			 “Hypocrisy: prejudice with a halo” 
			
			
			
			Join Date: Mar 2007 
				Location: Savannah, Georgia 
				
				
					Posts: 21,393
				 
				
				
				
				
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			I am sorry for you loss.
		 
		
		
		
		
		
		
			
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	Anyone but the this most fuked up President in History in 2012!  | 
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		#19 | 
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			 Gone and done 
			
			
			
			Join Date: Sep 2001 
				
				
				
					Posts: 4,808
				 
				
				
				
				
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			This is the first I've heard of this sad event. 'Spode, Selene, I sorrow for you and your community.
		 
		
		
		
		
		
		
			
				__________________ 
		
		
		
		
	per·son \ˈpər-sən\ (noun) - an ephemeral collection of small, irrational decisions The fun thing about evolution (and science in general) is that it happens whether you believe in it or not.  | 
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		#20 | 
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			 Why, you're a regular Alfred E Einstein, ain't ya? 
			
			
			
			Join Date: Jun 2006 
				
				
				
					Posts: 21,206
				 
				
				
				
				
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			I'm trying to send the healing energy you send to those of us in need. I am so sorry for your loss, and the pain you must feel.
		 
		
		
		
		
		
		
		
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		#21 | 
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			 UNDER CONDITIONAL MITIGATION 
			
			
			
			Join Date: Mar 2004 
				Location: Austin, TX 
				
				
					Posts: 20,012
				 
				
				
				
				
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			Sorry to hear about this, Els. Hope you and Selene have a chance to give his sister and your mutual friends some comfort in all of it.
		 
		
		
		
		
		
		
		
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		#22 | 
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			 twatfaced two legged bumhole 
			
			
			
			Join Date: Jun 2004 
				
				
				
					Posts: 3,143
				 
				
				
				
				
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			My condolences to you and your family & friends, please don't beat yourself up too much over this.  
		
		
		
		
		
		
			 
		
				__________________ 
		
		
		
		
	Strength does not come from how much weight you can lift, or how many miles you can run. It comes from knowing that you set a goal, and rose to the challenge. Strength comes from within.  | 
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		#23 | ||
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			 When Do I Get Virtual Unreality? 
			
			
			
			Join Date: Dec 2002 
				Location: Raytown, Missouri 
				
				
					Posts: 12,719
				 
				
				
				
				
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			Today was a busy day, with our local Pagan community having to fend off the inevitable characteriztion of my madman murderer friend David Logsdon as a Satanist: 
		
		
		
		
		
		
			Quote: 
	
 Quote: 
	
 As the result of a blog posting I made yesterday on the web site of local Fox affiliate WDAF, I was contacted by one of their reporters and asked to do an interview about Dave. I did that this afternoon, and it was shown at 9:00 tonight. The editing and overall presentation was fair and an accurate representation of what I intended to communicate, including the opportunity to denounce the satanic characterization. I don't know f it will be available online or not. I find myself in a very strange position...discussing and attempting to illuminate the actions of a madman without giving the impression that I in any way see him as a victim himself, or that there was the slightest good reason for what he did. It is a trecherous line to walk, and not at all desireable as I do not wish to be seen as being media hungry in any way. I am not. In the end, I mainly want people to understand that Pagan doesn't equal Satanism, and most especially that we all need to love, respect and support each other; we need to be vigilant for the warning signs of mental instability and depression that can lead to tragedies such as this community experienced last Sunday. I very much appreciate the kind words of support and empathy you folks have expressed. You are my friends. If I start to go crazy, I expect you to tell me so. 
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	"To those of you who are wearing ties, I think my dad would appreciate it if you took them off." - Robert Moog  | 
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		#24 | 
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			 LONG LIVE KING ZIPPY!   per Feetz 
			
			
			
			Join Date: Mar 2003 
				Location: Arkansas 
				
				
					Posts: 7,661
				 
				
				
				
				
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			Well I for one can't think of a more level headed and articulate person to be doing that interview .
		 
		
		
		
		
		
		
			
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	"Success is getting what you want. Happiness is wanting what you get. " Brother Dave Gardner  | 
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		#25 | 
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			 UNDER CONDITIONAL MITIGATION 
			
			
			
			Join Date: Mar 2004 
				Location: Austin, TX 
				
				
					Posts: 20,012
				 
				
				
				
				
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			Good for you, Els, that's a pretty solid second article there. I like that they included the  "'disgusting' and 'a blatant example of sensationalism'" bit.
		 
		
		
		
		
		
		
		
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		#26 | 
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			 twatfaced two legged bumhole 
			
			
			
			Join Date: Jun 2004 
				
				
				
					Posts: 3,143
				 
				
				
				
				
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			I was impressed that they actually printed that as well, good on them. I second zippyts sentiments about you, and hope that the damage done by the ignorance of Dave's old neighbor is minimal. Grrrrr to people shooting their mouths off about things they have no business spouting off about.
		 
		
		
		
		
		
		
			
				__________________ 
		
		
		
		
	Strength does not come from how much weight you can lift, or how many miles you can run. It comes from knowing that you set a goal, and rose to the challenge. Strength comes from within.  | 
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		#27 | 
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			 Person who doesn't update the user title 
			
			
			
			Join Date: Jan 2001 
				
				
				
					Posts: 12,486
				 
				
				
				
				
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			Unfortunately, a lot of people still don't understand paganism...probably because it got a bad rap in the Bible.  If it isn't Jewish or Christian, people freak out.  Look at the rap Islam is getting. 
		
		
		
		
		
		
		
	I'm sorry you and your peeps are getting picked on, Ep, but hopefully the follow-up pieces you guys did will at least change some hearts.  | 
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		#28 | 
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			 The future is unwritten 
			
			
			
			Join Date: Oct 2002 
				
				
				
					Posts: 71,105
				 
				
				
				
				
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			Very, very glad you were able to walk the line successfully, Els.  
		
		
		
		
		
		
			 
		
				__________________ 
		
		
		
		
	The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.  | 
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		#29 | 
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			 polaroid of perfection 
			
			
			
			Join Date: Sep 2005 
				Location: West Yorkshire 
				
				
					Posts: 24,185
				 
				
				
				
				
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			Elspode I'm so sorry that this has come right to your doorstep.  While I'm sure there are people out there even closer to the situation, I don't know them.  I know you and respect you and understand how painful this must be, so it's you and Selene I feel for most keenly.  I hope it doesn't hurt more than you can deal with. 
		
		
		
		
		
		
			Re the Satanism angle - perhaps it's good that the first story was presented? After all I'm sure that the neighbour (through her own ignorance) did believe she had witnessed Satanic rituals. But it has given the pagan community a chance to unite in order to refute the spin, and perhaps given you something to thing about and focus on apart from the horrible waste of life. And perhaps some people out there will understand that Dave's beliefs had nothing to do with his actions and be interested enough to look into paganism themselves. BTW if you go crazy there's not much hope for the rest of us... 
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	Life's hard you know, so strike a pose on a Cadillac  | 
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		#30 | 
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			 When Do I Get Virtual Unreality? 
			
			
			
			Join Date: Dec 2002 
				Location: Raytown, Missouri 
				
				
					Posts: 12,719
				 
				
				
				
				
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			My boss saw the piece last night by accident, because he had been watching American Idol with his girls, and the piece followed directly after.  This morning, he complimented me on my deportment, but he was puzzled by the fact that I bothered to correct the perception that a crazed killer was actually a Pagan, and not a Satanist.  In retrospect, I understand where he's coming from (why not let people think he's a Satanist, then the Pagans won't get the rap?).  Unfortunately, to those who don't get it, Pagan = Satanic, and so the educational process must continue. 
		
		
		
		
		
		
			As it happens, the FOX 4 website does have the piece that included my interview archived. Look for the subsection labelled "Videos". It is the first one, the one with the thumbnail pic of Dave's face, at the top of the column of video thumbnails. I really appreciate everything you've all said. BS is now starting to bubble up in the Pagan community between those who have a "fuck the crazy bastard for making Pagans look crazy" outlook, and those of us who knew him before he was a lost cause insane alcoholic. Even *we* eat our own sometimes. I think that this fact, above all, proves how ordinary and human we truly are. 
				__________________ 
		
		
		
		
	"To those of you who are wearing ties, I think my dad would appreciate it if you took them off." - Robert Moog  | 
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