Shooting at Virginia Tech

[Spexxvet]

Originally Posted by rkzenrage

Actually, no, I will not answer you questions for two reasons. You don't answer mine and it is sad, bordering on sick, for you to want to hear those kinds of stories.
...

I don't think you have any stories. I think you exhibit this false internet bravado to bolster your self-esteem, which, in itself, is sick.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by Spexxvet

I think those two posts are in direct conflict. Nice try, though.

Wrong, nice try though.

[Shawnee123]

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by Spexxvet
1. Seriously, follow it out to it's logical conclusion - ultimately, you have to kill someone to "protect yourself". Anything short of that leaves you unprotected. Got it?

You are not unprotected if you wound someone trying to kill you. So you are incorrect.

And if you're not "protecting" yourself or a loved one, is it worth killing for?

Many people kill in the line of duty, police and military come to mind most quickly and I am sure that there are others, who may in the course of their duties in those capacities who may need to kill when they are neither "protecting themselves or loved ones", for example they may be protecting others.

Originally Posted by Spexxvet

I don't think you have any stories. I think you exhibit this false internet bravado to bolster your self-esteem, which, in itself, is sick.

Back to throwing insults, again, and you call me sick?
I could make-up as many stories as I have time for and you would take that as proof?
I worked on a ranch and defended myself against poachers and animals and was an armed bouncer and security for three years. What you believe means nothing to the world.

[Spexxvet]

Originally Posted by rkzenrage

Back to throwing insults, again, and you call me sick?....

Just giving as I get.

[Spexxvet]

Originally Posted by Spexxvet

So what posession is worth killing for? A TV? A pack of gum? Certainly there's a continuum - where do you killers draw the line?

[Clodfobble]

Sorry man, I have crap to do sometimes.

It comes down not to what they're taking, but the manner in which they're taking it.

--If you break into my house, I don't care if it's just to admire the decor, you are worthy of being shot.
--If you walk by me on the street and jerk my piece of gum out of my hands and keep walking, no, that is not worth shooting over.
--If you pull out a knife and demand that I give you my gum, then yes, you are worthy of being shot.

Each scenario is different, and I consider the average person capable of differentiating.

[elSicomoro]

I dunno about that Clod...sometimes, the judgment of Americans scares the shit out of me.

[Spexxvet]

Originally Posted by Clodfobble

Sorry man, I have crap to do sometimes....

Hold on a darn minute, thar! Are you insinuating that there is something in this world more important than posting on the Cellar? I think Syc's right:

Originally Posted by sycamore

I dunno about that Clod...sometimes, the judgment of Americans scares the shit out of me.

The Cellar comes first, damnit!

[Spexxvet]

Originally Posted by Clodfobble

Sorry man, I have crap to do sometimes.

It comes down not to what they're taking, but the manner in which they're taking it.

--If you break into my house, I don't care if it's just to admire the decor, you are worthy of being shot.
--If you walk by me on the street and jerk my piece of gum out of my hands and keep walking, no, that is not worth shooting over.
--If you pull out a knife and demand that I give you my gum, then yes, you are worthy of being shot.

Each scenario is different, and I consider the average person capable of differentiating.

I don't know... If your house is fully engulfed in fire, you don't go back in, or send a family member in to get your stuff. You're thankful that you and yours got out without injury - that what you lost was onlt "stuff". If someone with a knife wants your gum, and you try to stop him, you and/or your loved ones could end up harmed - is it worth it? Even if you draw you gun and kill him, think of the shit you'll have to go through. You many even regret it, creating emotional problems for yourself. And what if the assailant falls dead, and his knife accidently slices little clod on the way down? Or if your child has post traumatic stress disorder from seeing his mom waste another human being? How could these results be more favorable than giving the fucker the gum, and moving on with your life?

[jinx]

Originally Posted by Spexxvet

...How could these results be more favorable than giving the fucker the gum, and moving on with your life?

How do you know that's what will happen? Crystal ball? Crazy people with weapons don't always do what you think is logical. So, then what? More barbed wire and flood lights?

[Undertoad]

Yeah -- if someone threatens you with deadly force for GUM, they might be a tad unpredictable!

[Clodfobble]

How could these results be more favorable than giving the fucker the gum, and moving on with your life?

That all assumes that all he really wants is my gum. If I could be guaranteed that all I would lose is my stuff, like I would in a fire, then no, I probably wouldn't escalate the situation by bringing out my weapon. But you have no idea what's going to happen when someone's already at the point of threatening another person with a weapon. I would have to assess the situation as it arose--but if I had no weapon, then that whole set of options would be unavailable to me if it turned out he really wanted more than the gum.

I know you don't want to legislate the guns away, you just want to convince people of their foolishness, but I don't think you really understand that the very fact that I might have a gun is a huge deterrant for him, whether or not I do have one. Truth is, we don't actually own a gun, because I don't have the extra cash or the time/interest in proper upkeep of the machinery. We had them in my family growing up, and I would certainly consider it in the future if our lifestyle or neighborhood changed. But if I ever hear anyone breaking into our house, you can be sure that the first thing I will do is yell, "Honey, get the gun!"

[piercehawkeye45]

Originally Posted by rkzenrage

Oh, no... the hand-holders want to disarm you... and did disarm the students, so over thirty of them died.

I am not against total disarmament in society but there should be at campuses. If students and faculty were allowed to carry guns it wouldn't have done anything except for the one in a million chance that someone with a weapon would be close, calm, and skilled enough to do anything. Campuses have many other resources to prevent crime, rape, etc, that normal society doesn't so there is no reason to have a gun for protection. I wouldn't be too against police having guns but I don't see how it would help much since most crime doesn't occur with an officer nearby.