Kyoto Treaty

[Phil]

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

No. Not until all parties, including so called "emerging economies" like China and India have to install and implement the same protections they expect of me. Those are two of the most polluted nasy smokey countries I have ever visited. When the Chinese and Indians insall multi-million dollar scrubbers on all their power plants and factories we may consider involvement, till then screw em.

thats exactly the "we dont give a shit cuz we're allright" attitude that made me want ask the question in the first place, because while i agree about China and India, America is just as big a polluter and wastes more energy than countries who havent even got it to waste.

nobody so far has said whether they "do their part", by recycling paper, cardboard, glass, plastic etc.

i also agree that big polluting industries need to take the reins and set an example to the public, and even thought the treaty may seem to be a farce to some people, it has to be the first step to international concern and co-operation.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by Phil

thats exactly the "we dont give a shit cuz we're allright" attitude that made me want ask the question in the first place, because while i agree about China and India, America is just as big a polluter and wastes more energy than countries who havent even got it to waste.

nobody so far has said whether they "do their part", by recycling paper, cardboard, glass, plastic etc.

i also agree that big polluting industries need to take the reins and set an example to the public, and even thought the treaty may seem to be a farce to some people, it has to be the first step to international concern and co-operation.

Bottom line is this. The developing economies like India and China would like nothing more than to see our country sign on to kyoto and sit back and watch as we further outsource and spend billions nation wide to meet the double standards they will never have to meet or spend money on to achieve ANY level of CO emissions that we will have to do. When the playing field is level I would agree to it. But I am not going to sit back and watch people point fingers at us as they expand and build thier economies on our back as we further spin down the toilet economically and as a nation. So yea, screw them.

[Aliantha]

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

Bottom line is this. The developing economies like India and China would like nothing more than to see our country sign on to kyoto and sit back and watch as we further outsource and spend billions nation wide to meet the double standards they will never have to meet or spend money on to achieve ANY level of CO emissions that we will have to do.

So you don't think we'll be here by the time emerging economies have emerged?

I wonder why that might be.

Yes I know that's not exactly what you said, but really, why would they never have to meet the same standards? People in emerging economies are not the enemy. They're just doing the same thing developed countries have been doing for centuries...and in most cases still are.

[tw]

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

Bottom line is this. The developing economies like India and China would like nothing more than to see our country sign on to kyoto and sit back and watch as we further outsource and spend billions nation wide to meet the double standards they will never have to meet or spend money on to achieve ANY level of CO emissions that we will have to do.

Wow! You have not a clue. You never once bothered to learn from history. Those nations that innovated - that created solutions to previous environmental problems - then reaped massive profits both from less waste (more efficient industries) and from selling those innovations to all other nations. Amazing how TheMercenary so loves the status quo as to disparage innovation. Well, TheMercenary, innovation (not 'big dic' thinking) defined the patriotic American. You have just advocated communism - the stifling of innovation and maintaining status quo. Shame on you for posting without even learning from history. You have just advocated the destruction of the American economy. You actually hate innovation - or somehow know without first learning reality.

Well lets see how much knowledge your opinions are based in. Please tell us what the catalytic converter does. Since you so know India and China would love to see us innovate, then you learned from history – you can even tell us what a catalytic converter does. I await your demonstration of greater knowledge.