Entitlements of prisoners

[DanaC]

Across the road from my uni is a halal take away. The food is no more expensive than any other take away.

[Clodfobble]

Dana, seriously? You know the answer to this one. It's not the food itself which is more expensive, it is maintaining two entirely separate menus, two sets of dishes washed by different soaps, training staff in what is acceptable for which setup... and that doesn't even begin to touch on the notion that if one special diet is provided then half a dozen others will be immediately requested.

[DanaC]

If that prisoner is the only Moslem in the prison then yes it will be expensive. I doubt that's the case however.
What if the day's menu is serving pork? Are any jewish prisoners going to have to put up with pork or eat a meal lacking in basic nutrition by not eating the pork on offer?

[Flint]

The answer to this, of course, is that someone needs to demand an all-spaghetti diet, to honor their lord and savior

[wolf]

In the U.S., because of the extent of religious diversity, this can get pretty complex. I was searching for something else and wandered across a 23 page document from the Alabama Dept of Corrections that details the religious supplies to which inmate adherents of particular faiths are allowed access. I vaguely recall a longer (50+ page version) from one of the other states.

[Aliantha]

Originally Posted by DanaC

If that prisoner is the only Moslem in the prison then yes it will be expensive. I doubt that's the case however.
What if the day's menu is serving pork? Are any jewish prisoners going to have to put up with pork or eat a meal lacking in basic nutrition by not eating the pork on offer?

He's the only one to use the anti discrimination laws to demand halal food so far which means that yes, he is the only one.

They're going to change the legislation so that it can't be abused in this manner in future.

[DanaC]

Another factor is that I have no idea how strict his requirements are. Not all moslems follow that long list as a given. In hospitals, schools, universities, council offices etc across the uk, halal options are offered as standard. Usually, this does not require different kitchens or different staff......it generally involves a bunch of bulk bought frozen halal meat and a few other important ingredients. It ain't perfect and most moslems will likely engage in a much stricter definition at home....but the compromise seems to work for most people and does not involve more than a minimal cost on the part of the authority.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Any variation in the planned program requires time and trouble (read money) in an overtaxed system trying to streamline costs as much as possible. Any concession to variation will bring demands for more concessions, so they nip it in the bud.

[Beestie]

As long as the Halal food is made available to all prisoners then I'm fine with it as long as the prison is able to offer the special menu without any significant impact to their budget or facilities.

You absolutely cannot treat prisoners differently from each other for any reason other than the behaviour they exhibit.

I forget who said it but someone made the insightful point that you can tell a lot about a nation by the way it treats its prisoners. That should be a guiding principal in making a decision whether or not to accomodate the request.

[Griff]

It is also a good idea to not do things to p.o. the prisoner population. The last thing prison guards want is a riot based on something that is so easy to address.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Isn't one of the basic causes of friction(heat) in the prison population, anyone getting something they don't? As I understand it, even if you shit on somebody's pillow, somebody else will be pissed off you didn't shit on their pillow.

[Aliantha]

The point is, in Australian prisons, prisoners can have just about anything they want in their cells as long as they pay for it. With this in mind, I would think that if having a special menu is important to this person, then he should spend his money on halal food and not other luxuries (I don't know if he has any or not, but if they're available, I imagine he would be excercising his rights just as anyone else would be).

I agree that it's important to rehabilitate prisoners where possible and that caring for their specific requirements can in some cases enable or assist in rehabilitation, however I object to someone committing a crime and then abusing a law set up to protect victims in order to better his own position.

[DanaC]

I'd accept that argument if he was asking for better food. But he's not, he's simply asking for food which corresponds to his (religious) dietary needs. It may not seem so important to you and I, as we aren't moslems, but for him it may be of paramount importance and being denied it may seem a greater humiliation than that inflicted on his fellow prisoners by dint of incarceration.

[Pie]

How about medical needs? Plenty of diabetic prisoners. Should they get the same high-carb slop as everyone else, even though it'll kill them? (Or at least make them blind, with failed kidneys and bad heart?)

Oooh ooh -- we don't owe them anything, they failed society's tests, they can't tolerate the lowest common denominator, let 'em die.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by DanaC

I'd accept that argument if he was asking for better food. But he's not, he's simply asking for food which corresponds to his (religious) dietary needs. ~snip

No, his dietary wants, his dietary customs, not needs. He relinquished his right to wants and customs when he went to jail.There are only two choices in jail, do what you're told or suffer the consequences. That makes it very simple and theoretically equal for everyone, so nobody can complain of favoritism.