violence problem? ya think?

[MaggieL]

Originally Posted by BigV

Stereotypes and prejudices are not useful tools for understanding the truth. The map is not the terrain.

We have no direct experience of the terrain; we know it only through elaborate systems of maps.

Of course, *your* maps are better than everybody else's, being free of stereotypes and prejudice :-)

[BigV]

Originally Posted by MaggieL

We have no direct experience of the terrain; we know it only through elaborate systems of maps.

I'm certain you did not misunderstand me, MaggieL. I'm not in the mood to spar with you on the quality of my analogies.

For anyone else in need of a tedious explanation of my example, I intended "stereotypes and prejudices" to be represented by "map" and "understanding the truth" to be represented by "terrain". By saying that the map is not the terrain I meant that even though we can use a map to imagine the terrain, to help us shape our ideas of something beyond our direct experience, the terrain is what it is, regardless of the map. The map may be more or less accurate, but it is an abstraction, and the terrain is the reality. Stereotypes and prejudices exist, they have a function, but they are not the reality. You can complain loudly that the map shows the road crosses the river, but if the bridge is washed out when you get there, what happens? Fold your little map into a boat and sail across?

Specifically, MaggieL, if it is indeed true that

Originally Posted by MaggieL

... all the Muslim people I know personally are indeed peaceful.

then you do have direct experience of the terrain. Additionally, you may have an elaborate system of maps. But responding to the map while ignoring the terrain is not wise.

Originally Posted by MaggieL

Of course, *your* maps are better than everybody else's, being free of stereotypes and prejudice :-)

Well, duh! Right. That's helpful. If you wish to share my map and join me as I travel toward the truth, I welcome you. But if you're going to yammer on about why the road isn't the same color blue as it is on the map, I'll let you out at the next light.

[MaggieL]

Originally Posted by BigV

Specifically, MaggieL, if it is indeed true that...then you do have direct experience of the terrain. Additionally, you may have an elaborate system of maps. But responding to the map while ignoring the terrain is not wise.

Experience is itself "an elaborate system of maps", too. Perception operates by trying to construct a model--a map--by interpreting sensory input. But it's still a system of maps and models, from beginning to end. Nobody has "direct experience of the terrain". When you believe you do (which is apparently a part of the map you're offering to share), you're actually only reifying one particular map.

No, thanks...I'll steer by my own lights.