suicide

BigV · 05-07-2006, 04:29 PM

Friday. Phone rings. It's a call for our daughter. Hello? No, she's not here. I'll take a message. Name, number, something about Saturday. Please call. Wrote name and number on board.

Sunday in the paper we learn the young girl killed herself.

God.

What do I say to my daughter? I don't know her friend or their family. I have no idea what to say to them either.

MaryMary · 05-07-2006, 04:42 PM

That is terrible BigV, so sorry, I wouldn't even know where/how to start a conversation like that.

Griff · 05-07-2006, 08:16 PM

Make sure your daughter talks to somebody about this. Watch her closely. Wolf probably knows what should be done.

05-08-2006, 01:07 AM

Of course I would want to talk to my kid about it... I sure as hell would not want them talking to someone else about it.

limey · 05-08-2006, 09:30 AM

Yes, talk to your daughter. Here are a few random thoughts from someone with personal experience of this sort of thing:

you don't know what the girl wanted to say to your daughter, it could equally well have been "good-bye", "help" or to make future plans (yes, suicides can and do make plans with other people for things they know they aren't going to live to do)
Whatever it was, getting through to your daughter or not on this one occasion will not have had any impact on the girls' decision
Encourage your daughter to talk to you, or someone else, or to write/draw/otherwise express what she is feeling.

Meanwhile do some research yourself and be prepared for all the stages of bereavement (I can't remember them all and haven't got past disbelief myself, in almost a year). If you don't know the girl's family I don't think there's much you can do there, beyond an expression of sympathy. I always wondered whether there was any point in sending bereavement cards, but having been on the receiving end, I can assure you there is.

mrnoodle · 05-08-2006, 09:37 AM

I don't know if I'd tell her that the girl was trying to call her... no point in hiding it, I guess, but it's one extra little piece of emotional baggage she could avoid..

BigV · 05-08-2006, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrnoodle

I don't know if I'd tell her that the girl was trying to call her... no point in hiding it, I guess, but it's one extra little piece of emotional baggage she could avoid..

Our daughter already knows. "The board" is a whiteboard in the kitchen where all such messages are posted. It is in a high traffic spot, by design, and I know she already received the message. What she did with the message, I don't know.

Last night there was a...vigil, get together, whatever by many of her classmates, teammates, friends, adults and kids in rememberance of the young girl. There were teachers and coaches there, including the school counselor(s). I didn't go, I stayed home with other parental responsibilities, but MrsV went with her. They took a case of candles and a bunch of tissues.

I gather the girl and her boyfriend had broken up on Friday, the night before she jumped from the bridge. They gathered just about where she died. She and our daughter were teammates, although I don't think they were close friends. At least I don't remember seeing the girl around the house like other friends of hers.

I'm just playing it by ear, now. Today, the first schoolday following will be eventful, I'm sure.

Thank you all for your suggestions and your support.

LabRat · 05-08-2006, 10:21 AM

Hope your family gets through this OK. My thoughts are with you. Sad story. Hope everyone who hears of this uses the experience to open up or strengten the communication between them and their kids. --probably bad english, sue me.

Trilby · 05-08-2006, 11:16 AM

It is very important for your daughter to know and internalize the fact that this young woman did NOT kill herself because of an unreturned phone call. When a determined suicide makes the decision...the successful suicides I've seen in my career were suffering from a brain chemistry imbalance, they were mentally ill at the time of the decision and the action. Breaking up with a boyfriend is just one thing that can push a suicide over the final edge, but, they were lurking there long before. Someone who jumps is not asking for help. Someone who jumps has made up her mind. It is imperative that your daughter get some sort of counseling about this. I'm sure the school has counselors there now and perhaps all week.

Suicide is utimately a selfish act. When people are mentally ill, (and my belief is that you must be to off yourself) and in so much pain, they just want OUT of the pain. Your daughter didn't cause the pain. She couldn't cure it, either.

Goddess be with you, BigV, and your family and the young woman's. How very, very sad.

BigV · 05-08-2006, 12:42 PM

I'm just so sad. And scared. How can I know if one of *my* kids or nephews or nieces or scouts or ballplayers or neighbor kids is on the cusp of this decision?

limey · 05-08-2006, 01:10 PM

BigV, you don't know when someone is considering suicide, especially if they really mean it. If you're lucky it is a cry for help and they choose a method that allows an escape route. But if they are determined to kill themselves then they'll do it and all you can do is wonder why, and what if ...
I think Bri is right, it is a selfish act, and one caused by illness. But that doesn't mean to say that you could do anything about it even if you were aware of what a suicide is planning.
My internet research on the subject indicates that the relatives of a "successful suicide" are more likely to kill themselves, too: somehow the fact of a suicide in the family makes it a more viable option. My experience tells me that once you've seen the train-wreck that a suicide makes of the lives of those that loved that person, it's the last thing you'd do.
Wolf, comments?

Trilby · 05-08-2006, 01:37 PM

I'm a damn poor substitute for wolf and I know it, but, some (SOME) suicides DO bang a few warning gongs. Typical of teenagers is giving away things that meant a lot to them, sudden happiness or energy after being 'down in the dumps', listening to morose music (I know, that's a hard one as most of them listen to this stuff regardless of mental state), saying things like, "well, tomorrow it won't matter that ______ broke up with me," increase in risky behaviors and suicide 'try-outs'--esp. true for girls who may be cutting themselves. You'll see hesitation cuts, etc. in weird places. That said, some suicides never let on AT ALL that anything is wrong. They go about their lives, they're 'normal' kids, not into drugs, booze, etc., and then, one morning, you find them hanging in the garage. I think keeping the lines of communication open--open, open, open, is KEY. You have to let them know that no topic is off limits to discuss. When my 16 year old son broke up with the love of his life he was very, very down. We worried about him and I did ask him if he felt like hurting or killing himself. He told me yes, he had considered killing himself. We got him to a doctor PRONTO, he was put on zoloft for about 6 months with talk therapy and he is ok today. (This was about two years ago)--and he now knows that the topic of suicide is NOT verboten. His father and I will not shrivel up and freak out if he brings this up. Same with drugs, alcohol, sex. Let them know you are aware. Let them know they can say ANYTHING to you. One caveat: Once they know they can talk about anything with you and you won't judge, they WILL open up. My younger son came to me once and said, "well, mom, I just masturbated for the first time!" that was a bit cringe-worthy, but! it WAS an opportunity to talk about sexuality! Be there for her, BigV. I bet you are a wonderful father. I know you are.

anonymous · 05-28-2006, 06:05 PM

god.

i want to hurt myself. owant the pain iam feeling to stop. I wand to jjust get it all over eith wiht one time.

can't it just stop? please make ti stop.

limey · 05-28-2006, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by anonymous

god.

i want to hurt myself. owant the pain iam feeling to stop. I wand to jjust get it all over eith wiht one time.

can't it just stop? please make ti stop.

Ring the Samaritans, NOW.

wolf · 05-28-2006, 11:13 PM

We don't have the Samaritans in the US. Our national line is 1-800-SUICIDE.

All I know for sure there is that ain't zippy. There's a particular illogic to his spelling.

Short term advice: Stop drinking, go to sleep, and take a fresh look at things in the morning.

If that's an overdose and not drunkeness, call 911.

05-07-2006, 04:29 PM	#1
BigV Goon Squad Leader Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Seattle Posts: 27,063	suicide Friday. Phone rings. It's a call for our daughter. Hello? No, she's not here. I'll take a message. Name, number, something about Saturday. Please call. Wrote name and number on board. Sunday in the paper we learn the young girl killed herself. God. What do I say to my daughter? I don't know her friend or their family. I have no idea what to say to them either. __________________ Be Just and Fear Not.

05-07-2006, 04:42 PM	#2
MaryMary Confounded Conjuror Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Bored Stiff, PA Posts: 33	That is terrible BigV, so sorry, I wouldn't even know where/how to start a conversation like that. __________________

05-07-2006, 08:16 PM	#3
Griff still says videotape Join Date: Feb 2001 Posts: 26,813	Make sure your daughter talks to somebody about this. Watch her closely. Wolf probably knows what should be done. __________________ If you would only recognize that life is hard, things would be so much easier for you. - Louis D. Brandeis

05-08-2006, 09:30 AM	#5
limey Encroaching on your decrees Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: An island within the south-west coast of Scotland Posts: 7,016	Yes, talk to your daughter. Here are a few random thoughts from someone with personal experience of this sort of thing: you don't know what the girl wanted to say to your daughter, it could equally well have been "good-bye", "help" or to make future plans (yes, suicides can and do make plans with other people for things they know they aren't going to live to do) Whatever it was, getting through to your daughter or not on this one occasion will not have had any impact on the girls' decision Encourage your daughter to talk to you, or someone else, or to write/draw/otherwise express what she is feeling. Meanwhile do some research yourself and be prepared for all the stages of bereavement (I can't remember them all and haven't got past disbelief myself, in almost a year). If you don't know the girl's family I don't think there's much you can do there, beyond an expression of sympathy. I always wondered whether there was any point in sending bereavement cards, but having been on the receiving end, I can assure you there is. __________________ Living it up on the edge ... of civilisation, within the southwest coast of

05-08-2006, 09:37 AM	#6
mrnoodle bent Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: under the weather Posts: 2,656	I don't know if I'd tell her that the girl was trying to call her... no point in hiding it, I guess, but it's one extra little piece of emotional baggage she could avoid.. __________________ Sìn a nall na cuaranan sin. -- Cha mhór is fheairrde thu iad, tha iad coltach ri cat air a dhathadh

05-08-2006, 01:07 AM	#4
rkzenrage Guest Posts: n/a	Of course I would want to talk to my kid about it... I sure as hell would not want them talking to someone else about it.

05-08-2006, 10:21 AM	#8
LabRat twatfaced two legged bumhole Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 3,143	Hope your family gets through this OK. My thoughts are with you. Sad story. Hope everyone who hears of this uses the experience to open up or strengten the communication between them and their kids. --probably bad english, sue me. __________________ Strength does not come from how much weight you can lift, or how many miles you can run. It comes from knowing that you set a goal, and rose to the challenge. Strength comes from within.

05-08-2006, 11:16 AM	#9
Trilby Slattern of the Swail Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 15,654	It is very important for your daughter to know and internalize the fact that this young woman did NOT kill herself because of an unreturned phone call. When a determined suicide makes the decision...the successful suicides I've seen in my career were suffering from a brain chemistry imbalance, they were mentally ill at the time of the decision and the action. Breaking up with a boyfriend is just one thing that can push a suicide over the final edge, but, they were lurking there long before. Someone who jumps is not asking for help. Someone who jumps has made up her mind. It is imperative that your daughter get some sort of counseling about this. I'm sure the school has counselors there now and perhaps all week. Suicide is utimately a selfish act. When people are mentally ill, (and my belief is that you must be to off yourself) and in so much pain, they just want OUT of the pain. Your daughter didn't cause the pain. She couldn't cure it, either. Goddess be with you, BigV, and your family and the young woman's. How very, very sad. __________________ In Barrie's play and novel, the roles of fairies are brief: they are allies to the Lost Boys, the source of fairy dust and ...They are portrayed as dangerous, whimsical and extremely clever but quite hedonistic. "Shall I give you a kiss?" Peter asked and, jerking an acorn button off his coat, solemnly presented it to her. —James Barrie Wimminfolk they be tricksy. - ZenGum

05-08-2006, 12:42 PM	#10
BigV Goon Squad Leader Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Seattle Posts: 27,063	I'm just so sad. And scared. How can I know if one of my kids or nephews or nieces or scouts or ballplayers or neighbor kids is on the cusp of this decision? __________________ Be Just and Fear Not.

05-08-2006, 01:10 PM	#11
limey Encroaching on your decrees Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: An island within the south-west coast of Scotland Posts: 7,016	BigV, you don't know when someone is considering suicide, especially if they really mean it. If you're lucky it is a cry for help and they choose a method that allows an escape route. But if they are determined to kill themselves then they'll do it and all you can do is wonder why, and what if ... I think Bri is right, it is a selfish act, and one caused by illness. But that doesn't mean to say that you could do anything about it even if you were aware of what a suicide is planning. My internet research on the subject indicates that the relatives of a "successful suicide" are more likely to kill themselves, too: somehow the fact of a suicide in the family makes it a more viable option. My experience tells me that once you've seen the train-wreck that a suicide makes of the lives of those that loved that person, it's the last thing you'd do. Wolf, comments? __________________ Living it up on the edge ... of civilisation, within the southwest coast of

05-08-2006, 01:37 PM	#12
Trilby Slattern of the Swail Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 15,654	I'm a damn poor substitute for wolf and I know it, but, some (SOME) suicides DO bang a few warning gongs. Typical of teenagers is giving away things that meant a lot to them, sudden happiness or energy after being 'down in the dumps', listening to morose music (I know, that's a hard one as most of them listen to this stuff regardless of mental state), saying things like, "well, tomorrow it won't matter that ______ broke up with me," increase in risky behaviors and suicide 'try-outs'--esp. true for girls who may be cutting themselves. You'll see hesitation cuts, etc. in weird places. That said, some suicides never let on AT ALL that anything is wrong. They go about their lives, they're 'normal' kids, not into drugs, booze, etc., and then, one morning, you find them hanging in the garage. I think keeping the lines of communication open--open, open, open, is KEY. You have to let them know that no topic is off limits to discuss. When my 16 year old son broke up with the love of his life he was very, very down. We worried about him and I did ask him if he felt like hurting or killing himself. He told me yes, he had considered killing himself. We got him to a doctor PRONTO, he was put on zoloft for about 6 months with talk therapy and he is ok today. (This was about two years ago)--and he now knows that the topic of suicide is NOT verboten. His father and I will not shrivel up and freak out if he brings this up. Same with drugs, alcohol, sex. Let them know you are aware. Let them know they can say ANYTHING to you. One caveat: Once they know they can talk about anything with you and you won't judge, they WILL open up. My younger son came to me once and said, "well, mom, I just masturbated for the first time!" that was a bit cringe-worthy, but! it WAS an opportunity to talk about sexuality! Be there for her, BigV. I bet you are a wonderful father. I know you are. __________________ In Barrie's play and novel, the roles of fairies are brief: they are allies to the Lost Boys, the source of fairy dust and ...They are portrayed as dangerous, whimsical and extremely clever but quite hedonistic. "Shall I give you a kiss?" Peter asked and, jerking an acorn button off his coat, solemnly presented it to her. —James Barrie Wimminfolk they be tricksy. - ZenGum

05-28-2006, 06:05 PM	#13
anonymous Operations Operative Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: in hiding Posts: 578	god. i want to hurt myself. owant the pain iam feeling to stop. I wand to jjust get it all over eith wiht one time. can't it just stop? please make ti stop.

05-28-2006, 11:13 PM	#15
wolf lobber of scimitars Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Phila Burbs Posts: 20,774	We don't have the Samaritans in the US. Our national line is 1-800-SUICIDE. All I know for sure there is that ain't zippy. There's a particular illogic to his spelling. Short term advice: Stop drinking, go to sleep, and take a fresh look at things in the morning. If that's an overdose and not drunkeness, call 911. __________________ wolf eht htiw og "Conspiracies are the norm, not the exception." --G. Edward Griffin The Creature from Jekyll Island High Priestess of the Church of the Whale Penis

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