3/11/2005: Domesticated foxes

lookout123 · 03-11-2005, 12:21 PM

Ted Kaczinsky, Ted Kaczinsky... was his middle initial "W"? and does he regularly post in The Cellar?

Kitsune · 03-11-2005, 12:51 PM

Ah, poor foxes. I'm torn on this one: while I would love to have one, they're something I would prefer to see in the wild. It doesn't seem right to prevent something that beautiful and intelligent from running free.

But, as my nickname suggests, I can't resist them. Sigh.

Buckethead · 03-11-2005, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kitsune

Ah, poor foxes. I'm torn on this one: while I would love to have one, they're something I would prefer to see in the wild. It doesn't seem right to prevent something that beautiful and intelligent from running free.

I suspect that these cuddly, nice, selectively bred foxes wouldn't last too long in the wild. Have you ever actually seen a fox in the wild? They seem to have a knack for avoiding being seen by humans, or at least by me. I've seen a total of one in my lifetime.

jinx · 03-11-2005, 01:17 PM

Where are you from, I've seen a bunch. Saw one a couple of months ago (in a pumpkin patch) with both of my kids with me.

dar512 · 03-11-2005, 01:28 PM

What surprises me is how little time this took. Not that I have any expertise in this area, but I would have expected something more along the lines of an evolutionary timeline.

They don't say how many generations of selection they went through. But over 40 years it'd be ~20 or 30.

So how long before the marines breed an army of ape soldiers?

OnyxCougar · 03-16-2005, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dar512

What surprises me is how little time this took. Not that I have any expertise in this area, but I would have expected something more along the lines of an evolutionary timeline.

They don't say how many generations of selection they went through. But over 40 years it'd be ~20 or 30.

So how long before the marines breed an army of ape soldiers?

Must. Not. Get. Into. This. Here.

Kitsune · 03-11-2005, 01:21 PM

Have you ever actually seen a fox in the wild?

The really depressing part is that I haven't. I've certainly heard them, before, but I've yet to actually see one. Elusive little fuzzballs.

As for survival in the wild, I suspect they would probably do just as well as any domesticated dog or cat does when released, if not a bit better. I'd prefer that foxes maintained their fear of humans because, well, they're extremely cool for the intelligence they hold in evading people, sneaking about, and generally being, well, foxy.

Suggesting that no longer fearing humans has increased their social intelligence goes against what I see to be a fox's true smarts. They're social animals in the wild with each other already -- befriending people would be more harmful to them than good should the trait ever escape beyond the confines of the lab and actually survive.

Beestie · 03-11-2005, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kitsune

Have you ever actually seen a fox in the wild?

Saw one in the back yard a few months ago. A red one. Gorgeous animals.

hampor · 03-11-2005, 04:32 PM

The article it said that there had been 30-35 generations of foxes.

And 45,000 foxes. I'm afraid to think about what happened to all of them.

Also, how big was the population that they started with.

Wasn't Stalin really down on evolution?

sandra77 · 03-11-2005, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buckethead

I suspect that these cuddly, nice, selectively bred foxes wouldn't last too long in the wild. Have you ever actually seen a fox in the wild? They seem to have a knack for avoiding being seen by humans, or at least by me. I've seen a total of one in my lifetime.

I agree. I don't think they would last long either. They haven't been bred for surviving in the wild.

I have seen several foxes in the wild. We have a field behind our house & have watched a fox out there this winter. I was just watching him come across the field this morning.

Several years ago, a fox had a den with kits that we could watch from the road. They were really cute.

With all that said, I want one too but I think I would rather have a red one.

Sandra

Kitsune · 03-11-2005, 02:59 PM

With all that said, I want one too but I think I would rather have a red one.

They should have plenty of reds. The ones shown, silver foxes, are just a color/pattern variant of a red. I bet they would look kind of strange with the new, white markings, though.

blase · 03-11-2005, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buckethead

I suspect that these cuddly, nice, selectively bred foxes wouldn't last too long in the wild. Have you ever actually seen a fox in the wild? They seem to have a knack for avoiding being seen by humans, or at least by me. I've seen a total of one in my lifetime.

Spotted one on Weds.

03-11-2005, 12:21 PM	#1
lookout123 changed his status to single Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Right behind you. No, the other side. Posts: 10,308	Ted Kaczinsky, Ted Kaczinsky... was his middle initial "W"? and does he regularly post in The Cellar? __________________ Getting knocked down is no sin, it's not getting back up that's the sin

03-11-2005, 01:17 PM	#4
jinx Come on, cat. Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: general vicinity of Philadelphia area Posts: 7,013	Where are you from, I've seen a bunch. Saw one a couple of months ago (in a pumpkin patch) with both of my kids with me. __________________ Crying won't help you, praying won't do you no good.

03-11-2005, 01:28 PM	#5
dar512 dar512 is now Pete Zicato Join Date: May 2003 Location: Chicago suburb Posts: 4,968	What surprises me is how little time this took. Not that I have any expertise in this area, but I would have expected something more along the lines of an evolutionary timeline. They don't say how many generations of selection they went through. But over 40 years it'd be ~20 or 30. So how long before the marines breed an army of ape soldiers? __________________ "Against stupidity the gods themselves contend in vain." -- Friedrich Schiller

03-11-2005, 04:32 PM	#9
hampor Colloquialist Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: SiliValley Posts: 75	Generation XXXV The article it said that there had been 30-35 generations of foxes. And 45,000 foxes. I'm afraid to think about what happened to all of them. Also, how big was the population that they started with. Wasn't Stalin really down on evolution?

03-11-2005, 12:51 PM	#2
Kitsune still eats dirt Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Tampa, FL Posts: 3,031	Ah, poor foxes. I'm torn on this one: while I would love to have one, they're something I would prefer to see in the wild. It doesn't seem right to prevent something that beautiful and intelligent from running free. But, as my nickname suggests, I can't resist them. Sigh.

03-11-2005, 01:21 PM	#7
Kitsune still eats dirt Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Tampa, FL Posts: 3,031	Have you ever actually seen a fox in the wild? The really depressing part is that I haven't. I've certainly heard them, before, but I've yet to actually see one. Elusive little fuzzballs. As for survival in the wild, I suspect they would probably do just as well as any domesticated dog or cat does when released, if not a bit better. I'd prefer that foxes maintained their fear of humans because, well, they're extremely cool for the intelligence they hold in evading people, sneaking about, and generally being, well, foxy. Suggesting that no longer fearing humans has increased their social intelligence goes against what I see to be a fox's true smarts. They're social animals in the wild with each other already -- befriending people would be more harmful to them than good should the trait ever escape beyond the confines of the lab and actually survive.

03-11-2005, 02:59 PM	#11
Kitsune still eats dirt Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Tampa, FL Posts: 3,031	With all that said, I want one too but I think I would rather have a red one. They should have plenty of reds. The ones shown, silver foxes, are just a color/pattern variant of a red. I bet they would look kind of strange with the new, white markings, though.

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