Save the Sea Kittens

[Aliantha]

Have you eaten your share of sea kitten today?

PETA have a new campaign to improve the image of fish in order to promote awareness of all the cruelty done to fish by man.

Sure we all know PETA are a bunch of greenie type weirdos who like to go to extreme lengths to get their point across, but please, can't they leave the children out of it???

Have a look at the website this quote comes from and you'll see what I mean.

People don't seem to like fish. They're slithery and slimy, and they have eyes on either side of their pointy little heads—which is weird, to say the least. Plus, the small ones nibble at your feet when you're swimming, and the big ones—well, the big ones will bite your face off if Jaws is anything to go by.

Of course, if you look at it another way, what all this really means is that fish need to fire their PR guy—stat. Whoever was in charge of creating a positive image for fish needs to go right back to working on the Britney Spears account and leave our scaly little friends alone. You've done enough damage, buddy. We've got it from here. And we're going to start by retiring the old name for good. When your name can also be used as a verb that means driving a hook through your head, it's time for a serious image makeover. And who could possibly want to put a hook through a sea kitten?

Ask the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service to stop promoting sea kitten hunting.

[tw]

Originally Posted by Aliantha

Sure we all know PETA are a bunch of greenie type weirdos who like to go to extreme lengths to get their point across, but please, can't they leave the children out of it???

Well both PETA (and Aliantha who will now reply hysterically) miss a bigger point. Man has so harmed the oceans since the mid 1980s that, for example, the once robust Grand Banks has now been depleted of cod for 16 years. Grand Banks were once one of the seven great fisheries in the world. But rampant overfishing - especially nets that capture, kill, and throw back 25% of the fish - has so depleted the Grand Banks that fishing has been banned for over a decade. 16 years later and the once plentiful cod on the Grand Banks are still near extinction with no sign of recovery.

A problem that exists all over the world and is still getting worse. The severe reduction in all categories of fish is (unfortunately) proceeding as the math predicted.

[classicman]

Originally Posted by tw

(and Aliantha who will now reply hysterically) miss a bigger point.

There you go again. Was that really necessary?

Originally Posted by tw

Man has so harmed the oceans since the mid 1980s

cite something... anything to prove your timeline. This has been going on since long before the mid 80's. It started at least a decade earlier, probably more.

[tw]

Originally Posted by classicman

cite something... anything to prove your timeline.

Of course. According to your reasoning, its been going on since the end of neanderthal man. But then classicman always posts attacks AND never risks posting a fact. Did classicman every cite a supporting facts for this (or any other) post? Of course not. He is doing as any good wacko would do. Post accusations and post subjectively - as he learned from listeningt to Rush Limbaugh.

Cite? classicman never posts citations. That is classic Limbaugh.

Meanwhile PETA (and Aliantha) miss the point. Since the 1980s, the world has massively depleted all fish stocks including something new - killing off and throwing back of 25% of the fish stock. A problem so severe that even after 16 years without fishing, the cod still have not returned to the Grand Banks. A problem now found all over the world.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by tw

Of course. According to your reasoning, its been going on since the end of neanderthal man. But then classicman always posts attacks AND never risks posting a fact. Did classicman every cite a supporting facts for this (or any other) post? Of course not. He is doing as any good wacko would do. Post accusations and post subjectively - as he learned from listeningt to Rush Limbaugh.

Cite? classicman never posts citations. That is classic Limbaugh.

He asked for a citation for why you picked the 80's as the defining moment. That, Sir, is a legitimate question, and your tirade is way out of line.

Meanwhile PETA (and Aliantha) miss the point. Since the 1980s, the world has massively depleted all fish stocks including something new - killing off and throwing back of 25% of the fish stock. A problem so severe that even after 16 years without fishing, the cod still have not returned to the Grand Banks. A problem now found all over the world.

Couldn't of you just said that in the first place? Maybe they missed your point (not the point), because you told why you think the change in fishing technique has depleted fish stocks, while others including myself, are thinking about man's inhumanity to the oceans that has been going on for a very long time, and in more ways than just overfishing. While your point may be valid, you're thinking like an MBA. Our treatment of the oceans is much more troublesome than decreased food production. That, is the bigger point.

[tw]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

He asked for a citation for why you picked the 80's as the defining moment. That, Sir, is a legitimate question, and your tirade is way out of line.

His is not a legitimate question because 'cite' without facts to justify a doubt is simply classicman's passive aggressive mockery again. You, on the other hand, are asking for further clarification in a responsible manner that includes clarification or foundation for your doubt or question. So you get a reply - not the turd.

Studies cite the 1980s as a point which fisheries were being depleted to levels that began a complete collapse of various species. It is now estimated that 90% of all species are in various stages of that complete collapse. Cod on the Grand Bank being a worst case example of what has been happening. After 16 years of banned fishing, Cod numbers still remain depleted for reasons not fully understood.

The 1980s is also when fish caught, killed, and thrown back went from near zero to 25%. Mankind now also trashes many other species that are important to stability of the ocean’s balance. Perfect example of what created this problem are drift nets which came into widespread use in the 1980s.

1980s is cited often as the time that numbers of fish taken exceeded a supportable number. Something like five of the world’s seven largest fisheries are now in trouble – on the verge of completely collapse. A problem made even more obvious by virtually no fish now around Taiwan and Japan where fish stock were depleted to complete collapse. The fish stocks never returned. What happened there long ago is now (and suddenly) being discovered all over the world.

[Aliantha]

Originally Posted by tw

Meanwhile PETA (and Aliantha) miss the point. Since the 1980s, the world has massively depleted all fish stocks including something new - killing off and throwing back of 25% of the fish stock. A problem so severe that even after 16 years without fishing, the cod still have not returned to the Grand Banks. A problem now found all over the world.

What makes you think that I personally am not aware of the problems with fisheries the world over?

My husband has written numerous papers on the subject. He's written a book on fisheries management in Australia. He has a phd in zoology and his subject was the biology and management of the swallow tailed dart of the surf zone carangid.

You don't live with someone with that wealth of knowledge without learning a few things.

Come back to me if you actually want to have a discussion on the subject mate.

[tw]

Originally Posted by Aliantha

Come back to me if you actually want to have a discussion on the subject mate.

Aliantha is not the topic. PETA is the topic. PETA missing the point. I gather you understand the point. But you fail to grasp that I am not discussing Aliantha. I am discussing the relevant part of the topic - which PETA seems to completely ignore.

Somehow, you have confuse a criticism of the point with a criticism of you? Why? You are not attached to PETA or a serous fisheries problem. But you missed (did not post) what is an obvious criticism of (mistake made by) PETA.

[Aliantha]

Why would I respond hysterically?

And you've missed the main point in that PETA while they may possibly be approaching this new campaign for conservationist reasons the issue is that they're obviously targeting children (or mentally retarded adults) with their website.

My opinion is that they're not trying to conserve fish for human consumption or otherwise. My opinion is that they're suggesting we're terrible for eating them, including the indigenous communities who rely on fish as an important source of protien such as the communities in PNG who my husband has been working closely with on exactly this issue.

[xoxoxoBruce]

They want us to eat seaweed... after the sea kittens have had their fill of course. I wonder if they can convince the sea kittens to stop eating smaller sea kittens?

[TheMercenary]

Save the Sex Kittens.

[Sundae]

I thought PETA were pro-hunting anyway.
And as they believe the owning of pets is wrong (obviously assuming that scrawny feral cat populations live a much happier, jollier life) I can't see why picturing fish as kittens would help. Because any urban population allowed to breed unchecked become vermin and have to be culled at best and exterminated at worst.

Still, they always have been one sandwich short of a picnic.

[TheMercenary]

In the US they are totally anti-hunting. Anything that they think is harming animals, they are against it, even if it helped save their sorry ass from cancer, or treated their brother for a head injury. If they truely believed the crap they spewed out they would never seek medical care.

[Sundae]

Hmmmmmmm

I honestly can't remember where I read it.
It surprised me at the time, but then it kinda made sense - where people eat their kill I mean. The suggestion was that the animals hunted live more naturally than farmed animals do, to the effect that if you have to eat meat, you should be required to hunt it yourself and see how many people end up as veggies then, huh!? Huh?!

I accept I may be wrong on their stance - a little light Googling certainly suggests that I am.

[fargon]

People Eating Tasty Animals