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sexobon 10-25-2013 11:13 PM


Originally Posted by orthodoc (Post 881572)
... they provided a complete kit for each of us (having inquired about sizes beforehand), with boots, overalls, belt, radio, small self-contained self-rescuer, goggles, hard hat with ear muffs, and headlamp. ...

No canary? :eyebrow:

orthodoc 10-26-2013 12:21 AM

No canary. I guess we were the canaries ...

xoxoxoBruce 10-26-2013 05:32 AM


I ask, do we NEED these young men to die horrible deaths at 40, suffocating because their lungs can no longer transfer oxygen to their blood?
Not all of them do, you don't have contact with the others so that's what you see. What percent succumb to your worst case scenario and why them and not others. Was it because they weren't supplied or couldn't be bothered to use safety equipment?

glatt 10-26-2013 07:01 AM

It's the same question for the football players. They both voluntarily destroy their bodies for us in exchange for good pay. I didn't realize miners were paid that well. We've come a long way since the company towns would turn them into virtual indentured servants.

I wouldn't do either job, and wouldn't want my kid doing either job.

Griff 10-26-2013 09:15 AM

I wouldn't want that gig. You mentioned poultry production at the beginning and I might place that below coal mining, unless done in the Joel Salatin manner. A friend of mine in environmental testing went to a kosher chicken plant where everything seemed to be done well. He was super careful the whole time but the guys working there were very into the big physical handshakes. He ended up hospitalized with a campylobacter infection.

orthodoc 10-26-2013 09:50 AM


Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce (Post 881588)
What percent succumb to your worst case scenario and why them and not others. Was it because they weren't supplied or couldn't be bothered to use safety equipment?

Black lung dropped from about 11% of miners to 3.3% in the late 1990s, but by 2009 had risen again to 9% in some areas (eastern Kentucky, southern West Virginia, western Virginia, in a geographical area now known as the 'hot spot'). After each recent disaster (Sago, Utah, Big Branch) more safety equipment and regulations have been added. MSHA is required to inspect every mine in the country, and does.

Nevertheless, the industry doesn't have a 'safety first' culture, although the supervisors at the mine I toured stressed it. Still, things could have been better. No miner is going to complain too loudly when it means losing his job. Mine owners aren't overly concerned about safety relative to production because black lung benefits are largely tax-funded at the state and federal levels. That said, the rules are crazy enough that quite a few are denied on technicalities.

It's strenuous, dangerous work. Disasters still happen not infrequently and miners die horrible deaths. Between that and black lung, it's a high price in human lives.

glatt 10-26-2013 03:14 PM

Thanks for the long write-up orthodox, it was really interesting

glatt 11-25-2013 02:15 PM

I'm a tad apprehensive because I just bought a tenor saxophone off eBay. I know it's a bit beat up, but I hope it's playable.

I'm tired of paying $30-40 a month to rent a nice new one from the music store and I'm hoping this $200 one will work out just fine. It's for my son, and he knows it's all beat up and scratched and stuff, and he's fine with that. But it better be playable.

At least it's cheap enough that I can replace a bunch of pads and still be ahead. And it's a good model for a middle school kid like him.

New saxophones are ridiculously expensive.

glatt 12-03-2013 09:28 AM

I know you all have been on pins and needles waiting to see how it turned out, but the sax got here yesterday. I can't play, but my son played it and said it functions perfectly. It's 46 years old and quite scratched up and missing finish, but it sounds very good.

Perfect timing too, since we can return the rental on Saturday, which is the last day of the rental month.

This purchased sax will pay for itself in 6-7 months of no rental fees.
Cutting out a $30 monthly expense is a good thing.

limey 12-03-2013 01:05 PM

With a well maintained musical instrument of reasonable quality originally age doesn't matter. The consumables are easily and cheaply replaced. I wish your son much musical joy!

Sent by thought transference

xoxoxoBruce 12-03-2013 01:59 PM

Probably less likely to get stolen, also.
I agree with limey, glatt. You're giving the kid a fantastic gift.
Even if he graduates and never plays again, you'll have given him the ability to understand how music is constructed, how it's created, and enjoy the nuances. Good on you. :thumb:

Pete Zicato 12-03-2013 05:11 PM

And will give him instant cred if he decides to play jazz.

Griff 12-04-2013 05:40 AM

Yep, Coolest kid in the horn section!

orthodoc 12-06-2013 01:36 AM

Ultrasound and labs tomorrow. I've been having left-sided symptoms. Probably nothing, and it's time for a follow-up anyway. I just wish someone close to me was tuned in, had taken notice somehow.

Whatever. What will be, will be. If it's too much to bear I'll just help things along.

glatt 12-06-2013 07:27 AM

Good luck.

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