SteveDallas • Nov 9, 2004 4:38 pm
Apparently their alleged liberalism does not extend to having druids amongst their priesthood.
The KJV translation of Matthew 26:69-70 reads: "Now Peter sat without in the palace: and a damsel came unto him, saying, 'Thou also wast with Jesus of Galilee.' But he denied before them all, saying, I know not what thou sayest."
The "Good as New" version?
"Meanwhile Rocky was still sitting in the courtyard. A woman came up to him and said: 'Haven't I seen you with Jesus, the hero from Galilee?" Rocky shook his head and said: 'I don't know what the hell you're talking about!'"
Um... Or of the entire Christian community in general? Or any of the monotheistic religions? Isn't "you shall worship no other gods before me" pretty much universally interpreted "you shall worship no other gods because they don't exist"?wolf wrote:... pagans allow quite a bit of latitude in terms of which of the multiplicity of dieties one chooses to worship, however, the converse is not true of the Episcopal Church of the United States, or of the Anglican Communion in general.
In Genesis, it is worth noting that Cain, having slain Abel, is cast out to the land of Nod where he takes a wife of a tribe of people not created by Yahweh.
16So Cain went away from the presence of the Lord and dwelt in the land of Nod [wandering], east of Eden.
17And Cain's wife [one of Adam's offspring] became pregnant and bore Enoch; and Cain built a [6] city and named it after his son Enoch.
Moses sees the burning bush, and asks what God it actually is, because there are a bunch of them
3And Moses said, I will now turn aside and see this great sight, why the bush is not burned.
4And when the Lord saw that he turned aside to see, God called to him out of the midst of the bush and said, Moses, Moses! And he said, Here am I.
5God said, Do not come near; put your shoes off your feet, for the place on which you stand is holy ground.
6Also He said, I am the God of your father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob. And Moses hid his face, for he was afraid to look at God.
3 So Moses thought, "I will go over and see this strange sight-why the bush does not burn up."
4 When the LORD saw that he had gone over to look, God called to him from within the bush, "Moses! Moses!"
And Moses said, "Here I am."
5 "Do not come any closer," God said. "Take off your sandals, for the place where you are standing is holy ground." 6 Then he said, "I am the God of your father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob." At this, Moses hid his face, because he was afraid to look at God.
Happy Monkey wrote:
Isn't "you shall worship no other gods before me" pretty much universally interpreted these days as "you shall worship no other gods because they don't exist"?
OnyxCougar wrote:Amplified Bible:
Amplified Bible:
NIV:
No where does Moses ask which God it is.
OnyxCougar wrote:
...
Amplified Bible:
17And Cain's wife [one of Adam's offspring] became pregnant and bore Enoch; and Cain built a [6] city and named it after his son Enoch.
wolf wrote:Isn't that how Noah and his family (and all the animals) got fruitful and multiplied also?
alphageek31337 wrote:Because in these books, the bush is quick to point out that it is the god of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, etc. Essentially, pointing out that it is the God of the Jews.
"Moses said to God, 'So I will go to the Israelites and say, 'Your fathers' God sent me to you.' They will immediately ask me what His name is. What shall I say to them?'
'I Will Be Who I Will Be,' replied God to Moses."
Exodus 3:13-14, as translated at bible.ort.org
"So, what's your name anyway?"
"Uh.....I'm me!"
13And Moses said to God, Behold, when I come to the Israelites and say to them, The God of your fathers has sent me to you, and they say to me, What is His name? What shall I say to them?
14And God said to Moses, I AM WHO I AM and WHAT I AM, and I WILL BE WHAT I WILL BE; and He said, You shall say this to the Israelites: I AM has sent me to you!
15God said also to Moses, This shall you say to the Israelites: The Lord, the God of your fathers, of Abraham, of Isaac, and of Jacob, has sent me to you! This is My [3] name forever, and by this name I am to be remembered to all generations.
alphageek31337 wrote:Incest being a sin/abomination against God/a bad idea, where did the rest of us come from? Where does it mention that Enoch's mom is actually Cain's sister? Or were there other people on earth and Yahweh is just the creator-god of the Jews?
alphageek31337 wrote:Also, the only thing I've been able to find in Genesis on Cain reproducing has a pretty abrupt jump:
"Cain went to the land of Nod, East of Eden. And Cain knew his wife."
No mention of other people created by God, no mention of the incestuous relationship that must have developed if these people weren't created by God and, therefore in the mind of biblical literalists, didn't exist. Incest being a sin/abomination against God/a bad idea, where did the rest of us come from? Where does it mention that Enoch's mom is actually Cain's sister? Or were there other people on earth and Yahweh is just the creator-god of the Jews?
We don’t even know her name, yet she was discussed at the Scopes trial, mentioned in the play and movie Inherit the Wind1 and the book and movie Contact2, and has been talked about in countries all over the world. Is she the most-talked-about wife in history?
Skeptics have used Cain’s wife time and again to try to discredit the book of Genesis as a true historical record. Sadly, most Christians have not been able to give an adequate answer to this question. As a result, the world thinks Christians cannot defend the authority of Scripture and, thus, the Christian faith.
{snip}
Thus, there was only one man at the beginning—made from the dust of the Earth (Genesis 2:7).
This also means that Cain’s wife was a descendant of Adam. She could not have come from another ‘race’ of people and must be one of Adam’s descendants.
{snip}
All this makes it obvious that there was only one woman, Adam’s wife, at the beginning. There were never any other women around who were not Eve’s descendants.
{snip}
During their lives, Adam and Eve had a number of male and female children. The Jewish historian Josephus wrote that, ‘The number of Adam’s children, as says the old tradition, was thirty-three sons and twenty-three daughters.’11
The Bible does not tell us how many children were born to Adam and Eve. However, considering their long life spans (Adam lived for 930 years—Genesis 5:5), it would seem reasonable to suggest there were many! Remember, they were commanded to ‘Be fruitful, and multiply’ (Genesis 1:28).
{snip}
Some claim that the passage in Genesis 4:16–17 means that Cain went to the land of Nod and found a wife. Thus, they can conclude there must have been another race of people on the Earth, who were not descendants of Adam, who produced Cain’s wife.
‘And Cain went out from the presence of the Lord, and dwelt in the land of Nod, on the east of Eden. And Cain knew his wife; and she conceived, and bore Enoch: and he built a city, and he called the name of the city, after the name of his son, Enoch.’
From what has been stated previously, it is clear that all humans, Cain’s wife included, are descendants of Adam. However, this passage does not say that Cain went to the land of Nod and found a wife. John Calvin, commenting on these verses, states:
‘From the context we may gather that Cain, before he slew his brother, had married a wife; otherwise Moses would now have related something respecting his marriage.’13
Cain was married before he went to the land of Nod. He didn’t find a wife there, but ‘knew’ (had sexual relations with) his wife.14
Others have argued that because Cain built a ‘city’ in the land of Nod, there must have been a lot of people there. However, the Hebrew word translated as ‘city’ need not mean what we might imagine from the connotations of ‘city’ today. The word meant a ‘walled town’ or a protected encampment.15 Even a hundred people would be plenty for such a ‘city.’ Nevertheless, there could have been many descendants of Adam on the Earth by the time of Abel’s death (see below).
{snip}
Whereas if you take the book as an allegory, a collection of really cool stories that give you a pretty good example of how to live, then it all makes perfect sense.
Many people immediately reject the conclusion that Adam and Eve’s sons and daughters married each other by appealing to the law against brother-sister intermarriage. Some say that you cannot marry your relation. Actually, if you don’t marry your relation, you don’t marry a human! A wife is related to her husband even before they marry because all people are descendants of Adam and Eve—all are of ‘one blood.’ The law forbidding marriage between close relatives was not given until the time of Moses (Leviticus 18–20). Provided marriage was one man to one woman for life (based on Genesis 1 and 2), there was no disobedience to God’s law originally when close relatives (even brothers and sisters) married each other.
Remember that Abraham married his half-sister (Genesis 20:12). God blessed this union to produce the Hebrew people through Isaac and Jacob. It was not until some 400 years later that God gave Moses laws that forbade such marriages.
But if it's only allegory, then it's not the infallible word of God.The infallible allegory of God, then. :eyebrow:
OnyxCougar wrote:
But if it's only allegory, then it's not the infallible word of God.
Cain went out from before God's presence. He settled in the land of Nod, to the east of Eden. Cain knew his wife. She conceived and gave birth to Enoch. [Cain] was building a city, and he named the city Enoch, after his son.