Less is More
The lighting inside the secret control bunker is subdued. Shades of red and amber flash malevolently in the semidarkness. Another shift, another hundred or so breakdowns. He pauses on his way into the room and looks forlornly at the the lights on the warning panel. So many. He reads the names with dumb amazement. Home Base. Current Events. Politics. IOTD. Comments and Suggestions. Food and Drink.
"Food and Drink?!? How the fuck can you troll Food and Drink?"
Hubris Boy staggers to his chair and collapses into it with a groan. He cradles his head in his hands. The incessant shrieking of the Mk.IV Troll Detector<sup>™</sup> causes his head to throb and his ears to ring like church bells. With bleary eyes he stares at the reset button across the room.
"Fuck it," he thinks to himself. "It'll just go off again in another 30 seconds."
He sips from his filthy coffee cup and wonders how it happened. It used to be so quiet here. He remembers a gentler time- a time without flashing lights and shrill alarms. A time of reasonable, sequenced arguments and lively debate. A troll-free time. Well, a troll-lite time, anyway.
He remembers, and is filled with indignation. Reaches for his for his keyboard and blows away the dust. He grins. "This oughta piss 'em off," he mutters.
Some time later, a new thread appears in Home Base; thread starter... Hubris Boy?? A handful of ancients blink with astonishment. "Hubris Boy? We thought he was dead."
The majority don't even notice. Why should they? "Who the heck is this Hubris Boy character? Never heard of him."
<hr width="50%">
Hubris Boy notes with dismay a change that has crept not so stealthily into the character of the Cellar in the past... oh... year or so.
Once upon a time, the Cellar was a witty, well-informed but not-stuck-up-about-it forum where people with widely varied backgrounds could discuss a wide variety of topics. Most posts were reasonable and reasonably well written- good grammar and spelling were the rule. (Okay... with the exception of Jaguar v0.9 beta. But they seem to have included a spellchecker in the release version.) It was a genuine pleasure to stop by and read what folks had to say about the topics of the day. GIANTS walked among us in those days, my friends. I used to live for new posts by tw. I rarely agreed with the man, but he was fun to read and even more fun to debate. People used to gather 'round to watch the sparks fly. [Yes, I know he's still here. I'm just making a point.]
Sadly, this is no longer possible.
Because the Cellar has been transmogrified into a chat room.
In place of well considered posts, we find ourselves inundated with a flood of messages that are semantically equivalent to "Heh. Me too." Or, "Oh yeah? Your mother." We're buried to our navels in drivel that looks like it was cut-and-pasted from the AOL "Tourettes Syndrome Singles #7432" chatroom. The sheer volume is such that it is no longer possible to separate the wheat from the chaff. We're drowning in chaff.
Some of this increased volume in posts can be attributed to the growth of the Cellar population- a phenomenon as pleasant as the Cellar is bound to expand by virtue of its own excellence. That's great. That's not what I'm talking about. What I'm talking about is an exponential increase in the volume of posts made by people who have absolutely nothing to say. Don't believe me? Check out the stats. They're right under our user names for all the world to see.
<OldGeezer>
I remember waaaay back to the day when Sycamore's post count rolled over into four digits. That was fucking amazing. A thousand posts?!? I couldn't believe he'd done it. It took forever to reach a thousand posts. What an impressive achievement.
</OldGeezer>
Fast forward to 2004 and prepare your senses for the assault. Waves of babble and blather break over our heads. There are new members who seem to make a thousand posts a day. There are old members who emulate them. Holy crap. Nobody is that interesting. Fer Chrissake, muzzle yourself. Anybody who breaks the thousand post mark in less than two years really needs to go outside more.
We're all guilty of it. And the occasional one line bon mot is okay... it adds zest to the soup. Every post doesn't have to be a "Summa Theolgica." But they don't all have to be "Beavis and Butthead," either.
Some people will be offended by this thread. I don't give a fuck. I'm just making a shoe. If you want to put it on and loudly announce to the world that it fits, that's your decision.
If you're smart enough to find your way here, you must have at least some capacity for critical thinking. Use it. Put your super-ego in the driver's seat and think before you post. Before you click the 'submit' button, stop and ask yourself: "Am I contributing anything to this discussion?" If that's too much for you at first, try: "Does it least have a noun and a verb?"
There are a lot of us crowded into this small forum. Practice a little self-conscious self censorship, won't you? And let the Great Unwashed stay in the chat rooms. Where they belong.
I was going to agree with you, but alone, that would be a tad..problematic. Thus a sentence discussing the problems associated with that, which in itself is mindless drivel.
On the upside, it's spelt correctly.
Syc's could do with a larger following to hit that sweet spot.
None of the really good member seem to stick around. I am aware of the implications of this statement.
aw, c'mon. that was funny
i hear you h_b. and the shoe fits.
i think each of our perceptions of what the cellar 'is' is going to be different. there are those who only post well thought out, clearly stated positions on serious topics. there are those who enjoy the community that exists. for the latter, when the boards are slow, it's lonely. funny, the timing of your thread and dagney's. you both appear to miss the quieter slower paced days. i can see what you're both saying, but there's not much to be done about it. as I see it, there are maybe 30 or so active posters, and lots of readers. the well thought out posts have not gone away, they just have company now. if you don't have the time or inclination to sift through the chaff, then don't. msg boards constantly change and morph into different trends. it's just the way it is. all this tshirt hawking glitz obviously doesn't jibe with your ideal. i wish people would post more. I'd like to see the cellar grow enough that UT could charge admission and not lose anyone. a network of friends that can talk to each other all day, trade skills and knowledge, support each other emotionally, and refine their beliefs through argument and debate.
so what's the point of this thread? you want us all to shut up? why have a message board at all then?
i think i know where one more of the 'yes' votes on that poll came from, now, at least.
Ah that's where you're wrong. The quality of discussion here now is frankly, by comparison to what it was, shithouse. At best. Problem is I still can't find anywhere better. Gated forums are the only ones that can keep a good size and quality posters.
Well, HB, you're entitled to your opinion. You're also perfectly welcome to surf off somewhere else to find nobler boards with better spelling and grandma. No one is pointing a gun at your head, forcing you to read everyone's posts. I agree with LJ, how do you enhance the quality of a discussion by telling everyone to shut up? Are we all supposed to read only YOUR posts and be so dumbstruck with awe that we never reply?:p
(edited for "grandma")
Wow I'm about to agree with Jim. :p
As someone who has moderated mailing lists and currently co-administer my own board and chatroom, I understand the different ebbs and flows that a message board goes through. A certain "vibe" is established in the beginning, and as more and more people come on board, the tone and vibe tends to change. IMO, that's natural. Change is good (well, in most cases). Some people just take longer to adapt to change (not necessarily YOU HubrisBoy, but I am just saying in general).
But it's my understanding that their isn't a specific "way" for people to post here...unless I missed that memo. Ah well. Life goes on.
[prince] Peace and B wild! [/prince] ;)
*not a "Summa Theolgica" type of person anyway* *shrugs*
Originally posted by Hubris Boy
Anybody who breaks the thousand post mark in less than two years really needs to go outside more.
I seem to have figured this shit out years ago WITHOUT going outside more.
We've been treading water waiting for you to lead us to the promise land, HB.:haha:
I think one answer is removing the post count, which I think I will do when we go to vBulletin 3 (any weekend now).
I don't see how that is possibly the answer to anything HB addressed.
Then every post can be taken at face value rather then weighted against a percieved standing based on post counts, for or against.
Originally posted by jaguar
I don't see how that is possibly the answer to anything HB addressed.
Just taking a wild guess, but I think that it's been mentioned that people are probably posting comments merely to up their count (and at one point, I thought that too, but then I realized that some people just have a lot to say. oh well).
Of course, that's only a guess, a theory...no one knows for sure if some post short and supposedly "AOL-type chat" comments just to brag about their numbers. I figured some people are just to the point, or that's all they had to say about the post they were commenting on. *shrugs*
Too bad...I was looking forward to seeing myself hit 1,000 posts ( I wasn't paying much attention to my stats until about 2 weeks ago anyway).
Carry on.
Now people will just look at registration dates. While I see the point it still seems not overall very constrctive.
ah fuckit I think i'll follow dagney and become more of a lurker.
You can still see the number of posts in the profile.
I just want to say 'LOL! Me Too!' :rolleyes:
Who gives a shit really?
Now where are the forks pictures?! Anybody do something they regret? I went to my nephews boring grad party, but holy crap did things get out of hand....was happily talking with the old folks 'til the young girls showed up with the wop.
Glad I don't do that every weekend.
Sometimes brevity is the soul of wit. A one sentence reply or even one word or even a single emoiticon can convey more than a 1,000 words of drivel. I never cared much one way or the other for my post count, so its all the same to me (does this mean we get to have the word association thread back, now? ;) )
HB, you are still one of the greatest posters ever. These newer folks only wish they could create posts like you...hell, I wish I could create posts like you.
You still owe me dinner, btw.
I dig what you're saying as a whole. I think that the quality has definitely gone downhill since late last year. And I freely admit that I spend too much time on here posting...though not to boost my post count.
(UT has mentioned boosting post count as a possible issue twice now in the past month. I don't know why anyone would do that. The fact that I am #1 in total posts just means that I like to babble a lot, though all my posts are incredibly sexy...owww!)
I remember a couple of years ago that one Dwellar in particular was lamenting about the good ol' days, and she seemed to enjoy directing her ire at jag and I. *shrugs* Whatever...the Cellar has been around for 14 years now. How could it not change?
And it will probably continue to change. Who ever thought we'd get an influx of liberals in here? I sure as hell didn't...jag and I have been the token liberals forever.
Bottom line...if you want the "good ol' days" back, then work to make it more like that. This past week had some of the best political discussion we've had in a long time. We definitely need more good thoughtful discussion to raise the collective IQ around here.
Having said that, I think that some of the newer peeps, though they are rather chatty, have brought a lot of good things to the table...even Jim. :) And I don't think there's anything wrong with being silly here and there.
Jag, as far your comment about the Bosque...I wouldn't mind more folks hanging out, and I'm open to changes, but I'm rather pleased with its current direction. I'm not trying to compete against Cellar.
HB, my man, you have more than a few excellent points there ... I don't, though think that anybody really relies on how long they've been here, or how many posts they have as a real measure of anything ... it's been amusing as a "lack o' life meter" to see folks total number of posts and/or daily post ratios, but it doesn't mean a damn thing.
Yes, there are some days and some threads for which the content level just really wanes ... but you spend too much time being serious and something's going to go *snap*.
The Cellar is one of those things that for some helps keep that day "somewhere out in the future."
:shrug: Sometimes it's just your turn to be silly.
Originally posted by Hubris Boy
We're buried to our navels in drivel that looks like it was cut-and-pasted from the AOL "Tourettes Syndrome Singles #7432" chatroom.
Damn.
Now everyone will know where I'm from...........
Originally posted by marichiko
<snip>
You're also perfectly welcome to surf off somewhere else to find nobler boards with better spelling and grandma.
</snip>
Well, I suppose I could do that. But then I wouldn't be Hubris Boy. I'd be... mmmm... something unspeakable. Like Nic Name. Or something like that.
So no, I won't be going anywhere. I prefer to stand on the wall- and try to keep the barbarians from destroying the city.
Originally posted by sycamore
<snip>
Having said that, I think that some of the newer peeps, though they are rather chatty, have brought a lot of good things to the table...even Jim.
</snip>
No doubt that's true, Syc. One of the best things about the Cellar is that there's room at the table for everyone.
But after they've been seated, I'd appreciate it if they'd refrain from pissing in the fingerbowls.
this thread sucks
you, hb, do not have the right to dictate how people should post, what they should post, how often they should post. you DO have the right to read as much or as little of what is posted as you like.
talking down to anyone who cares to respond to this trap of a thread is lame. it's hubris, in fact.
He has as much right as you to express his opinions and I know I'm not alone in saying he's dead on. You haven't been here long enough to know the difference between the quality of postings. Most of the people who could really nail and point to the wall have left, I'm yet to see a thread here recently that doesn't dissolve quickly into random crap. I don't blame anyone specific but it's a simple fact. God knows I've done it enough myself, I'm posted some right crap on here on times, particularly back, as HB so kindly put it in .9beta but it has got worse and the signal/noise ratio is nothing like it was. Sheer numbers or quality? I'm not quite sure, I think a combination of the above.
That said, some of the new people have contributed a lot as well, *shrugs*, there isn't a solution, every online community over a certain size suffers this.
I suggest a Test Debate. This involves someone setting up a debate on an Important Topic and seeing how people respond. Those that contribute something worthwhile get to stay, the others have to leave. That would be really funny. Heh heh. ASL. LOL. Etc.
I don't get it. All the "giants" leave then one comes back to bitch about the condition of the place. Well, if the Cellar was indeed Raphael's School of Athens
then why did all the "giants" take off and where did they go?
Each of us regulars (non-Giants) decide on a daily or so basis (on average) to stay and make the most of our Cellar experience. We don't leave when we get chastised nor do we treat people like shit then run away squeeling the first time someone bloodies our nose. We stay and we work it out. You and the rest of the Giants need to come to grips with the reality that maintaining the integrity of this place requires
work - sometimes even
hard work. Some of the people who you are indirectly critical of have done one hell of a lot to make this place fun, interesting and, above all, worthwhile. Why don't you check out the compliment thread and other threads and see who's getting shout outs over a long period of time.
But, I realize that its easier to just shut down, mourn for the glory days and complain about they way things are.
If you want to take the easy way out and abandon ship then don't complain about how the ship is run. You want to stay and slug it out with those who are pissing on the temple then I'll have a lot more respect for your complaint.
Internet forums are temporal venues - a poster is only as good as his/her last post. Same applies to the forum itself. If you think the Cellar is heading off in the wrong direction then do your part to reverse the brain drain you perceive.
Do **I** think the Cellar could be better? Sure. I just think the Cellar is best off when good posts and good posters drown out the poor posts and poor posters - self policing at its finest. So put the gloves back on and get with it.
[COLOR=indigo]Sometimes, Beestie, I really love you.[/COLOR]
huh huh huh. hb doesn't like that not all posts are thought provoking. huh huh
Originally posted by jaguar
He has as much right as you to express his opinions and I know I'm not alone in saying he's dead on.
here's why it bothers me, jag. not because he voiced his opinion. he has, as you say, just as much right as i do to say whatever he wants. but to attempt to chastise people on a public forum for not conforming to his admittedly outdated perceptions is like telling someone in the grocery store that they're doing their shopping wrong. the cellar ( and any message board) is what you take from it, or what you put in. to you. talk about pissing in finger bowls. this is counterproductive. HIS good old days. maybe you remember them fondly, too. great. whatever.
it wouldnt even bother me if he had pointed to a particular instance of ;chaffing; and said, " hey, put some freaking thought into a post before you post it" or even saying to one person in particular that they are chatting too much. but to comment on the general malaise he feels and in a way that creates apprehension in some users to post at all for fear of being talked down to.....?
why bother?
sorry - i had to leave that last one. i'm too much of a smart ass to have passed up the opportunity.
I have to agree with jim - i like the fact that you can count on reading ridiculous statements and stupid one liners in with the serious stuff. i like the community of it all. most of you all are in the east and i am in AZ, but we can exchange ideas and ridicule each other at will. i, for one, truly enjoy it. i'm a stock broker, so i work by myself except when i have an appt come in. i keep the cellar on my screen and post when i feel like it. it is a way to still touch the outside world while getting my job done. i won't go to a chat room because i have no interest in discussing what i look like with someone named "tinytits69" or "bigone1983". on the worst day the cellar still has adult conversation - so here i will stay.
i've been gone for most of the last 3 weeks for work. since i've been back i've been a little disappointed because the cellar has been pretty quiet. maybe it is because it is summer; hopefully people haven't become silent because of this thread.
i'll also add that i found this through another board that was growing stagnant because there were a couple of "old timers" that would gang up and shred anyone who disagreed. not in an "i disagree with you" way, but a "get the hell off our board, you are ruining our way of life" type of way. i have been here since the beginning of the year because it is an open forum for whatever discussion may come up.
and on that note - can we have a new word association thread?
edit - added last 2 paragraphs.
I'm with Jim and Beestie on this one, but then I would be wouldn't I, being new here!
I came here following an ad placed on another bulletin board, so I assumed newcomers were being actively sought. If you want to maintain a certain style to a board I suppose you should make it private, by invitation only, and perhaps with a test to pass before admission?
Otherwise you get what you get ... i.e. me:eek: (LOL)
Originally posted by sycamore
Good point, limey.
Perhaps UT should quit paying to advertise Cellar for a while.
that's right- we don't want our opinion pool polluted anymore. let's put a big lock on the front screen with a big sign that says
[SIZE=4]Go Away! New People Suck[/SIZE]
or maybe we new guys should sign a disclosure committing ourselves to scrape and grovel at the feet of those who have gone before...
but seriously, what is the big deal. it doesn't take that long to either read or skip over goofy posts. for that matter, you can be like Radar and just put a bunch of people on ignore.
*shrugs*
Outdated is a funny word to use, I assume it means political discussion above the level of fark.com. I fail to see how stating, point blank that there is hell of a lot of crap being posted and putting a little bit of thought it to it, or possibly refraining from pinky and the brain style 'NARF' posts when you have nothing to say is unreasonable. It's not some kind of arcane idea he's made up, it's just general decency. In another era it was called etiquette.
Why bother? It's called a signal to noise ratio for a reason. Look at any major public forum, look at the forums of slashdot, or fark, or any other major site you happen to name, you'll see the same thing, hundreds of oh-so-fucking hilarious one liners drowning out anything worthwhile, after a certain point moderation often makes it worse to boot. Cellar used to have a remarkably high one, it doesn't anymore. People left over time for various reasons, a few in silly spats of one kind or another but most simply flitted off into the ether as the ratio slowly dropped, I assume for greener pastures or simply found better ways to spend their time. Some of us have different tolerances than others and while today there's not tinytits69, the ways things are going it would not shock me before long. If and when there is, dig this out, you might see what I mean after all.
As for ads, I noticed UT has stayed out of this, I assume he follows a policy that new blood will always replenish the forums with new ideas and perspectives, I'm not so sure that works so well but that's his choice, it's his board.
Make of it what you will, I really don't give a fuck anymore.
Originally posted by jaguar
...hilarious one liners drowning out anything worthwhile, after a certain point moderation often makes it worse to boot...
the things that are worthwhile and important are easy to see and read. the rest is just friendship (as much as can happen online). it sounds to me like it is just another way to make it clear that you feel intellectually superior to the common folk who like to treat this as a conversation instead of a place to post carefully edited theses.
there is a time and a place for everything.
Originally posted by lookout123
that's right- we don't want our opinion pool polluted anymore. let's put a big lock on the front screen with a big sign that says
[SIZE=4]Go Away! New People Suck[/SIZE]
Why not? :)
Seriously, the advertising has certainly been good to a degree. But I think we've finally hit critical mass, and maybe it's time to be more exclusive. I'm not saying new people shouldn't be welcomed...I just don't think we should be actively looking for them right now.
Originally posted by jaguar
*shrugs*
In another era it was called etiquette.
To me, etiquette is about realizing that people have differences, but making an effort to respect their dignity as a person regardless. It is not about who is superior to whom. It is not about behaving one way towards people you want to impress and another towards people you feel are unworthy of your greatness. Any decent etiquette guide will tell you drink from (or piss in) your finger bowl if that's what your guest has done - as it's the pinnacle of rudeness to chastise them instead.
Where the fuck did superiority come into this? Talk about a goddamn straw man. I must have been sleeptyping when I said we should all have gold stars next to our names in order of rank. Etiquette is about behaving in an appropriate manner.
Your post has a strange structure. First you accuse me of claiming to be some kind of superior. Then you imply that by not, as HB so wonderfully put it, pissing the finger bowl, I'm some kind of outsider and should well, I assume start posing crap all over the place in a better effort to fit in. Make your mind up.
Christ, all I, HB, Syc (speak out if I've got your angle wrong) and no doubt a few silent others want to do is raise the tone of the conversation a bit, at least in some forums and encourage intelligent, articulate discussion over inane babble. Who would have thought that would have raised such indignation. How that can be construed as haute dictation from up on high is beyond me.
Originally posted by jaguar
Christ, all I, HB, Syc (speak out if I've got your angle wrong) and no doubt a few silent others want to do is raise the tone of the conversation a bit, at least in some forums and encourage intelligent, articulate discussion over inane babble.
Soooo.... what's stopping you?
No indignation here, really. And if this thread causes you to proof read more of your posts, then I'm all for it.
Originally posted by Undertoad
I think one answer is removing the post count, which I think I will do when we go to vBulletin 3 (any weekend now).
jaguar
Neutiquam erro.
Registered: Apr 2001
I don't see how that is possibly the answer to anything HB addressed
xoxoxoBruce
The future is unwritten
Registered: Oct 2002
Then every post can be taken at face value rather then weighted against a percieved standing based on post counts, for or against.
well, then let's also lose the registration date.
this is why i say this thread sucks. there was nothing wrong with the forum, and i personally dont give a shit about post count ( i know that sounds like a bunch of shit given the comments i've made about it, but if anything, i worry about posting TOO much, so my post count not displaying bothers me not) but if the reason for losing the post count IS so that each post stands on it's value, and not percieved wieght based on the author, why have his start date...or his name for that matter?
Originally posted by jaguar
Why bother?... Make of it what you will, I really don't give a fuck anymore.
I think LJ's point is that it is infinitely more productive to specifically address posters and posts than to drop in for your 8th post of 2004 and proclaim with the angst of a soul cast into Gehenna that the Giants have abandoned the Great City and left us, the pissants, to defile its once great carcass.
And LJ is correct.
If hubris boy decided to dust off his keyboard and take to task the 3 most eggregious violators of his unwritten law then you can easily imagine that things would tighten up around here. After that, he can take on the new three most egregious posters. Clean up from the ground up if that is what he thinks needs to be done. But, that takes work. One must become
engaged. Much easier to fuss about it from a sterile distance.
While the Cellar might not be as great as it once was neither is Rome. Wanna burn it down too? Of course not.
And quit saying you don't give a fuck when you clearly do. And its good that you do. We should all take pride in the Cellar and we should all do our part to protect it - from the bottom and from the top.
Well no, the thing is I don't. Chances are this'll be my last post, at least for a while. I have enough uphill battles right now without one with so little reward and such obvious animosity. Cellar used to be a good outlet, it no longer is.
--- I know for certain that once a place gets to a certain size, encouraging post count becomes extremely counter-productive. Let's see what happens with this change and also the vBulletin 3 switchover. I think people will step back and take a new tack to how they treat the place, and it will have to absorb the shock and take time to adjust.
--- Point taken on the ads, and I will stop running them.
--- It may be that we finally need an inner circle where members can keep up with other members without having to read the entire system.
By the way, here's the detail for the last six months on Google adwords.
Campaign #4 Paused [ $2.00 / day ] 2,259 1,561,983 0.1% $0.05 $111.05
Campaign #3 Paused [ $1.00 / day ] 773 1,194,188 0.0% $0.12 $96.19
First column 2259 is number of actual clickthroughs
Second 1561983 is number of impressions
0.1% is clickthrough rate
$.05 is price per clickthrough
$111.05 is cost of campaign
I think campaign #3 was buying Google words "intelligent people" "interesting people"
Originally posted by jaguar
As for ads, I noticed UT has stayed out of this, I assume he follows a policy that new blood will always replenish the forums with new ideas and perspectives, I'm not so sure that works so well but that's his choice, it's his board.
And that is exactly what I'm going to go by. I have always been more partial to what the
owner of the board says is appropriate. And since it's my understanding that there are no "written-in-stone" rules on how to post and what to post, then I would think that new members (hell, and old ones too) would take the board in various directions, even one that some posters do not like.
Like Syc said, this board has been around for 14 years (!!!), and changes are bound to happen. We have "only" been here for 3 of those 14 years, so I can imagine was this board was like 5, 10 years ago.
lookout123 wrote:
"the things that are worthwhile and important are easy to see and read. the rest is just friendship (as much as can happen online). it sounds to me like it is just another way to make it clear that you feel intellectually superior to the common folk who like to treat this as a conversation instead of a place to post carefully edited theses."
Good point. When I first came here, I thought that I wasn't "good enough" to be here. Everyone seemed so well read and highly educated and quite honestly, I felt a bit intimidated. I felt that I had to "step up my game" here. I don't have a college degree, but most of what I know came from various experiences and living life, pure and simple. And what I've found is that people can have all the degrees, education and smarts in the world but that they can still sound like the dumbest person alive.
Basically, I have an average IQ (120's) and I take that to mean that I am an average person, and for the most part, my responses to things are
probably going to be...average. It has worked in pretty much every other avenue in my life, and it
should be good enough here.
jaguar wrote:
"Where the fuck did superiority come into this? Talk about a goddamn straw man. I must have been sleeptyping when I said we should all have gold stars next to our names in order of rank. Etiquette is about behaving in an appropriate manner."
Well, sometimes it's about perceived intent rather than the actual words. The "tone" came across to some as somewhat...well, superior. Plus, I've noticed over the last 5 years that I've been on the net that "etiquette" has taken on various meanings to some people. Some thing that top posting in a newsgroup is "understood" to be "improper", but some people will do it anyway, for whatever reason. Since newsgroups as a whole are
NOT moderated by anyone, I say all bets are off as far as how someone is "supposed" to post, but many will still chastise that poster for doing something so "heinous".
In addition, sometimes a conversation just.can't.stay.focused. It may indeed veer off into some kind of dribble, and then that's a sign that the coversation may bloody well be over with. Oh well, it happens. *shrugs*
You also said that there is a time and a place for everything. What exactly do you mean? That anything considered "chatty" should be banished? If so, then who is to determine what is "chatty"? That anyone who is "average" or below average should not post? Just some questions.
I see by your replys that you seem angry by the responses. Did you really think that some would just accept what you were saying without *some* debate and maybe even some attitude? And now I see that you are going to just poof go away and not try to turn the ship 'round. Well ok then. Your choice.
I leave this with a comment that Beestie said so well:
"One must become engaged. Much easier to fuss about it from a sterile distance."
OK, now i'm upset. i lurked here for so long because there were some good discussions due to 'giants' calling out for proof of facts, reasons behind opinions etc. it taught me to think before i post as well as check my facts before i open my big mouth. it also taught me that it would be painfully obvious if i didn't. now i feel confident enough that i decide to start posting, and some of those that i would have enjoyed intellegent debates/discussions with are jumping ship. i agree the aprils out there are annoying and bring this place down a bit but like in 'real life' if you just ignore them they go away on their own. every open sandbox gets a little catshit in it once-in-awhile.
I kinda torn on this, the cellar is only a reflection of what we each put into it. I was real close to bagging it, maybe six months ago. We haven't had a really powerful thread here in a long time, no lightbulb moments just the usual left /right rhetoric. I know, I have not brought anything to the table lately, that is certain. When we come back around in the fall, I suspect we won't recognize the joint. But that's probably ok.
Originally posted by LabRat
now i feel confident enough that i decide to start posting, and some of those that i would have enjoyed intellegent debates/discussions with are jumping ship.
don't worry. at most, jag will be gone for a couple of days. pretty quickly some event will occur that will cause jag to make a few more jabs at america and everything will be back to normal.
this has been kind of fun. i haven't seen any real go-arounds in the cellar for awhile.
another thing you will figure out is that there are 1 or 2 (dozen) people that enjoy trying to push buttons.
Originally posted by ladysycamore
Basically, I have an average IQ (120's) and I take that to mean that I am an average person, and for the most part, my responses to things are probably going to be...average. It has worked in pretty much every other avenue in my life, and it should be good enough here.
Don't be so modest, LadyS. 120 is well above average. See this
page.
Originally posted by LabRat
some good discussions due to 'giants' calling out for proof of facts, reasons behind opinions etc.
Well you're the second person (at least) to mention the "giants". And I'll tell you, as far as I'm concerned, the "giants" don't exist. You could have called out for verification or held somebody's feet to the fire about elucidating their opinions just as much as anybody else could. Any newcomer who walks in off the street (so to speak) has just as much of a chance of posting something interesting or entertaining as any of the rest of us. And as we have seen, anybody who is considered an old-timer or a fixture can just as easily get the hell out of dodge, for reasons the rest of us may or may not consider warranted, and be gone overnight. So, my advice is to get over any feeling you may have that there is some uber-class of Cellar Dwellars, and just say what you've got to say.
Originally posted by dar512
Don't be so modest, LadyS. 120 is well above average. See this page.
*sniff* Ok, I feel better now:
*120-129 Superior 6.7% of the population.
*120: School Teachers; Pharmacists; Accountants; Nurses; Stenographers; Managers.
Heh, well I *do* "manage" a website and chatroom. :p
"An IQ of 120 therefore implies that the testee is brighter than about 91% of the population, while 130 puts a person ahead of 98% of people. A person with an IQ of 80 is brighter than only 9% of people, and only a few score less than 60."
Thanks dar12. :D
*still smarter than the average bear...*
God damn, these johnny-come-lately-shit-stirrer-uppers, got nothing on you, Hubris Boy.:haha:
Nobodies going anywhere, 'cause I locked the door.
Now everybody take your clothes off and let's get right to the make up sex.:angel:
Don't tell me you guys didnt have the big orgy Saturday?!
i left at 11:30, and there had been zero nudity, and very little lesbian activity. bummer
Jeez lets just all relax our Sphincter Muscles a little, take a deep breath and chill a minute.
W T F.all these so called Giants of the board having Hissy Fits Hubris Boy, Dagney Jag all throwing the toy's out the pram stomping off in a fit of pique.
Whats wrong with a bit of levity? now and again even in a serious post a smart or funny comment can enhance the argument or position you are trying to put across.
I don't post much but I read and follow most posts to their natural conclusion and a few of the so called "Great Weights" of this board have their heads so far up their own arses and the posts are so predictable you can guess the reply to the question.
But thats what great of being in this community everyone's opinion is different but equally valid
I think that this board is one of the best I've come across.I should know Ive lurked on a few,Ive been around this board about a year and its opened my eyes to differing opinions,some I agree with,some i don't but hey, thats life.
Nothing stays the same its called evolution, we all get teary eyed for the good old days.But take a good look and then think back just how good were them good old days???? If you think the Board is not what is was contribute,Show us young un's whats what but dont just bitch :D
FWIW I don't think (but maybe I'm wrong) Hubris Boy was complaining about humorous things as much as he was complaining about the abundance of posts that don't add anything at all, including humor--posts which say things like "right on!" or "yeah, what he said!" or "OMG that was so funny!"
guys, the phrase "Giants" is getting a little old.
You can just use my name, I won't be offended.
-sm
Originally posted by Clodfobble
FWIW I don't think (but maybe I'm wrong) Hubris Boy was complaining about humorous things as much as he was complaining about the abundance of posts that don't add anything at all, including humor--posts which say things like "right on!" or "yeah, what he said!" or "OMG that was so funny!"
Hey, I represent that.:)
BeBop, well said, except Dagney's absence is for personal reasons. Life intrudes.:(
FWIW I don't think (but maybe I'm wrong) Hubris Boy was complaining about humorous things as much as he was complaining about the abundance of posts that don't add anything at all, including humor--posts which say things like "right on!" or "yeah, what he said!" or "OMG that was so funny!"
oh, yeah, well....that part i agree with.
so, lets get it straight:
conversation is ok
omg, rofl, lmao is not
deep thought good, confirmatory responses bad
is confirmatory a word?
where does senseless ranting fall?
how about generalized negativity?
when i read the original post in this thread, my first reaction (as i'm sure is true of many of you) was to apply what he said to my own personal habits. I see that sometimes i post a response like a quip or a pun, and for the most part, that does not have any real worth. yet, if i was standing in a room talking to you folks, thats what i would say.
the other thing i thought was that if we all took great care in replying, and never shot from the hip like many of us do, we'd never get to know one another. i could if i chose, write verbose and melodic prose that sounds like it belongs on a greeting card, with perfect punctuation, and grammar, but that is not me. you want that shit, go read a fucking greeting card. We could all concentrate on composing one well thought out post per week complete with research, supporting facts and links to more information, but i doubt that it would be very exciting.
i have an idea. and i dont mean this sarcastically at all.
HubrisBoy, you have a point. you also have a standing offer of a user based forum. ask UT to set it up for you, and have rules. moderate it. only allow well thought out posts, and delete the crap posts. if people know going in that there are guidelines, i think they'll respect them. i know i would. that way, you dont have to go start your own site, but you can proudly maintain a higher level of thought within your forum walls.
I sorta look at the cellar as that cool little restraunt that you find on some back street , at first no body but the folks that look for such know about it , then word spreads , then a crowd starts gathering because they have good food , then the old timers can't get tables any more get pissed off and stomp off , and a new crowd of regulars start it all over again .
Thats life , ever changeing , allways a challange , most of the time its worth sticking around just to see what happens next .
Personaly I don't have any problem with the way the cellar rejuvinates its self , I find it facanating watching the folks come and go , some assholes , some not . Interesting crowd mostly .
Just my 2 cents .
Originally posted by jaguar
*shrugs*
Outdated is a funny word to use, I assume it means political discussion above the level of fark.com. I fail to see how stating, point blank that there is hell of a lot of crap being posted and putting a little bit of thought it to it, or possibly refraining from pinky and the brain style 'NARF' posts when you have nothing to say is unreasonable. It's not some kind of arcane idea he's made up, it's just general decency. In another era it was called etiquette.
Why bother? It's called a signal to noise ratio for a reason. Look at any major public forum, look at the forums of slashdot, or fark, or any other major site you happen to name, you'll see the same thing, hundreds of oh-so-fucking hilarious one liners drowning out anything worthwhile, after a certain point moderation often makes it worse to boot. Cellar used to have a remarkably high one, it doesn't anymore. People left over time for various reasons, a few in silly spats of one kind or another but most simply flitted off into the ether as the ratio slowly dropped, I assume for greener pastures or simply found better ways to spend their time. Some of us have different tolerances than others and while today there's not tinytits69, the ways things are going it would not shock me before long. If and when there is, dig this out, you might see what I mean after all.
As for ads, I noticed UT has stayed out of this, I assume he follows a policy that new blood will always replenish the forums with new ideas and perspectives, I'm not so sure that works so well but that's his choice, it's his board.
Make of it what you will, I really don't give a fuck anymore.
Well, you sure seem bitter, Jag, what's up with you? I am in the rather ironic position of probably being the oldest one (in age) posting here, while at the same time being a kitten with its eyes barely open when it comes to length of time since I discovered the Cellar. I, too, was enticed here by an ad on another board (it was a slow day and I wondered what the heck all those monkey's on typewriters was about). If you guys don't want new members, you should stop putting out lures for them. I'm sure the ad which brought me downstairs here cost UT a pretty penny since it appeared on a rather glossy "high profile" site. Why's UT throwing his money away if you guys don't want us?
Frankly, I think some people are just upset because they're being forced to adjust their comfort zones. "Good ole Cellar," you could always check in for a few minutes and see the same points of view posted by the same old members. Now all of a sudden you have to deal with the likes of me and LJ and DanaC (haven't seen much of her lately, maybe she got disgustred - a shame), and labrat etc.,etc., and even Tomas R. there for a while.
Well, I'll tell you what, IMO, even Tomas had something worthwhile to contribute. Yeah, he could be an annoying kid, but he was posting in a language foreign to him from a country that has some pretty different values then the U.S. does, and he actually said some interesting stuff (sometimes, anyhow).
And while I know full well that I annoy the hell out of some people around here, in all due humility I don't think my posts (or LJ's or labrat's or DanaC's or most of the other newbies) lack in intelligence. All too often, it's the oldtimer's who will post some trite one line reply about "tree huggers" or how big their wang is or "LOL" or just some stupid emoticon. Go back and look thru the threads if you don't believe me.
Have YOU been in an AOL chatroom lately, Jag? I hope for your sake you haven't. I wandered into one out of curiosity a while back and it was a highly depressing experience. There is simply no comparison. Jag, I agree with you on a lot of things, but not this one. I hate to "pull rank" on you, but the things one believes to be intellectually fascinating at 16 become childishly boring at 19 and not even worth noticing at 21. Did it ever occur to you, that it is you who are developing a keener sense of insight rather than the cellar becoming polluted by an influx of new blood?
Since I consider you a cyber-friend, I'll make you a challenge: Name your issue and I'll meet you with the opposing point of view (whether its mine or not), and I promise you won't be bored by my replies.;)
If you guys don't want new members, you should stop putting out lures for them. I'm sure the ad which brought me downstairs here cost UT a pretty penny since it appeared on a rather glossy "high profile" site. Why's UT throwing his money away if you guys don't want us?
This is UT's board not "you guys" board.:)
I am in the rather ironic position of probably being the oldest one (in age) posting here,
Don't think so.;)
the other thing i thought was that if we all took great care in replying, and never shot from the hip like many of us do, we'd never get to know one another.
Is that what a bbs is for? I thought chat rooms were for getting to know each other and bbs' for the exchange of ideas. The Cellar seemed to be a unique combination of the two. I think it vacillates, but seems to come back to center, repeatedly. I guess in the end, there's enough threads for it to be all things to all people.:)
I think of it as you guys' board more than my board... actually, truth be told it's somewhere in between.
Originally posted by Undertoad
I think of it as you guys' board more than my board... actually, truth be told it's somewhere in between.
I think of it as Bob Dobbs's board, but that's from a prior age.
Actually, I would like to take this opportunity to thank UT for making this board available to us all. While we may have our petty squabbles (or grand verbal wars), the Cellar is all in all, a varied and interesting board with many intelligent and thoughtless posters. Thanks, UT!;)
hip hip... c'mon don't leave me hanging now... HOORAY forUT
The PayPal tip jar is at the bottom of the front page.;)
[COLOR=indigo][size=1]pssssst.... Bruce.... Beestie's name has 2 e in it. [/size][/COLOR]
Originally posted by OnyxCougar
[COLOR=indigo][size=1]pssssst.... Bruce.... Beestie's name has 2 e in it. [/size][/COLOR]
[SIZE=1
]Shhhh! What if Bruce already knows that?[/SIZE] :eek:
[COLOR=indigo]Oh! I get it! It was a test! Yeah....a test... ahem.... *grins and cuddles Bruce*[/COLOR]
Originally posted by OnyxCougar
[COLOR=indigo][size=1]pssssst.... Bruce.... Beestie's name has 2 e in it. [/size][/COLOR]
[SIZE=1]I think it's three.[/SIZE]
[COLOR=indigo]I meant between the b and the s.... *grin*[/COLOR]
Originally posted by OnyxCougar
[COLOR=indigo]I meant between the b and the s.... *grin*[/COLOR]
The only thing between the 'b' and the 's' is 'ull'.
See! This is what HB was talking about.:haha:
My power goes out for a day, and look at the excitement I miss!
"a poster is only as good as his/her last post"...I disagree. I try to look at the person as a whole. While I try to respect everyone, there are some people here whose words I give more thought and value b/c those people have earned it. And if you're nothing but an asshole in my book, but then you start making some really good posts, it may take a while for me to take you seriously.
(Like you need my respect or approval, but that's just how I roll here.)
Shooting from the hip...sometimes, it can be very effective. But as a whole, I don't think people give too much thought to what they say. They just shoot off at the mouth or keyboard, only to sound like a dummy or feel like one later. Sometimes, it can't be helped, but I think it can be more often than not.
My hope is that the Cellar will keep its intellectual edge while not taking itself so seriously. Time will tell...
[COLOR=indigo]You know, what some guy I've never met and never will meet thinks about me, or my intelligence or my weight or anything else has NO bearing on who I am, or who I want to be. So if I want to go around posting like an AOL-er, I will. And if HB or anyone else (barring the moderator) don't like it, they can use ignore or they can leave. Pretty simple, really.
Personally, I'm tired of people I don't know and will never meet trying to tell me how to behave, and what is and is not correct and polite. I don't care what they think. It is a non-event in my world horizon.
So lurkers, take heart! Don't let HB or anyone else tell you who to be or scare you off from posting!!![/COLOR]
I've been looking at the Blog view of the IotDs for about 5 months now and lurking around the forums themselves for about a month. A couple of weeks ago I went ahead and joined for one main reason: This place looks like a FUN place to spend my time (especially at work...shh! :angel: )
What pulled me in (aside from wanting to contribute to the IofD posts) is the fact that there are so many varities of topics and threads on this forum. Most forums I frequent are geared towards something specific. Here, anything and everything goes.
To add to that, I really liked reading the posts. I liked the mixture of really smart posts and cute posts and funny posts... Half the time its the really simple "AOL" type posts that are the most enjoyable and humorous for me to read. A prime example: this thread itself. HB did the first post, presented in all its splendor et al. The very next post was nothing but "lol". That cracked me up.
See, I'm all for intellegent discussion. I enjoy intellegent discussion but I also like to laugh at silly stuff, too. Intellegent discussion doesn't always give way to humor and when it does it's usually dry, chuckle, in-the-know kind of humor. Not to say that's bad, it's just not the same as belly-laugh kind of humor. I like to laugh loud and hard. It's good for you, besides.
I'll grant y'all, I'm quite new here. I haven't read all of the threads in all of the forums all the way through so I really can't say I know what anyone means when they talk about how it used to be. But the way it sounds to me is that before, this forum was much like a group of professors standing in a little huddle in Prim And Proper University and speaking in a hushed polite murmur. In contrast, the way it seems to me now is this forum is more like a university Common Building, where people come in and out, hang out for a while, talk about important things or spread urban legends and gossip. That's what I like about this place, that Commons feel it has to it. It made me feel comfortable.
oh shit, who let a commoner in here?
Originally posted by lumberjim
oh shit, who let a commoner in here?
Hey! After they let you in, they probably just figured they might as well let the rest of the hoi polloi come along, too. So now you're stuck with people like me and Cyberwolf.:D
You know, I have the same problem here in my neighborhood... it used to be that my neighbors and I would gather for large barbeques, pinics, and other worthwhile get-togethers all the time, but these days so many people just want to visit briefly out on the front porch, or to chat for a few minutes in passing on the street. Sure, occasionally I'll chat for a minute out by the mailbox, but most of the time, if my neighbors want the pleasure of my company, they'd better get the steaks and grills out!
I think it's because of a bunch of new people who have moved in recently... they don't always want to come to barbeques! They may not like barbeques, but I don't give a fuck.
I've been away from the neighborhood on vacation for a few months, and that's what I come back to? Sure, they all seem to enjoy it just fine, but it just doesn't suit me. I could move away, and find a community that fits me more closely, but I think instead I'll send a message out to the whole neighborhood... I'll tell them that I liked things better the old way... MY way... and that the neighborhood is now a waste of time. Maybe if I can get some of the other long-time residents to back me, we can straighten out the new people, and force them to come to our barbeques.... and any who won't, we can eventually drive out.
Oh wait... that would be whiny, self-absorbed, and a tad conceited. Silly me.
H_P... all i can say is wow.
sorry if that low level of sophistication offended anyone.
hmmm... Barbeque sauce, anyone? It's raining here and has been for days. I can't BBQ a thing! (sniffle).;)
just in case you wanted to know, here are ALL of HB's posts for 2004: ( apart from the 2 in this thread, of course.
Originally posted by Hubris Boy
Dude.
That mod_rewrite stuff is just this side of being voodoo as far as I'm concerned.
You are, like, s00p3r-3|33t!
Signed,
<VirtualHost> Sissy
Originally posted by Hubris Boy
Perhaps our casualty rates would decrease even further if we simply stop taking prisoners?
Originally posted by Hubris Boy
I don't recall it ever being /.ed, but it's definitely been Farked.
Originally posted by Hubris Boy
Just out of curiousity.... are you suggesting that happiness and success are rights, and that The State is obliged to provide them?
Goodness. "Heavy handed state intervention" indeed.
Originally posted by Hubris Boy
I think I stumbled over one of Tony's posts on /. and ended up here.
Originally posted by Hubris Boy
</cloaking device>
Gad, don't people read anymore? The Supreme Court decided this one waaaay back in 1927. As far as I know, <i>Buck v. Bell <a href="http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/cgi-bin/getcase.pl?court=us&vol=274&invol=200">(274 US 200)</a></i> has never been <i>explicitly</i> overturned.
Even today, after almost 80 years the simple, eloquent words of Justice Oliver Wendell Holmes ring true:
<blockquote>"It is better for all the world, if instead of waiting to execute degenerate offspring for crime, or to let them starve for their imbecility, society can prevent those who are manifestly unfit from continuing their kind. The principle that sustains compulsory vaccination is broad enough to cover cutting the Fallopian tubes. Three generations of imbeciles are enough."</blockquote>
<i>*sniffle*</i> They just don't write 'em like that anymore, eh? Brings a tear to my eye...
<cloaking device>
Originally posted by Hubris Boy
</cloaking device>
I still have the original Photoshop .psd files of the monkeys and the typewriters... ummm... somewhere around here.
*rustle rustle rustle*
You can have 'em if you want, rather than be messin' around with copies of copies of copies of copies...
<cloaking device>
one wonders whether hb, who seems to have gone back to cloaked mode, posted this thread in despair of his own drop off in quality content.
HB, for the record, i never had any problems with you, and you seem like a nice enough person. but this thread has chafed my ass for days since i read it. i understand your intent, and appreciate the message. i agree to a point, even. but the result has been that you've offended a lot of folks who dont deserve it. I enjoy a good insult. I like to argue. I really like flame wars. this, however makes me want to turn my back on the whole enterprise. I know you're a squeaky wheel at this point, and your views are not upheld by the majority. so, i won't leave. it has, however taken some of the joy out of it for me.
listen to me:
the cellar you described in your first post no longer exists.
this is the current cellar. had you been more active, and led by example, perhaps it would be closer to your fond memories, but you didn't and it's not. None of those that you derided have the experience of
that cellar, so it is monumentally unfair to expect them to hold to a standard that they have no knowledge of.
I resent this thread, this discussion, and your attitude.
for everyone(including HubrisBoy):
i enjoy your company. say what the fuck you want to say, be it a little or a lot. shallow or deep. pass the beer nuts.
Originally posted by lumberjim
listen to me:
the cellar you described in your first post no longer exists.
this is the current cellar. had you been more active, and led by example, perhaps it would be closer to your fond memories, but you didn't and it's not. None of those that you derided have the experience of that cellar, so it is monumentally unfair to expect them to hold to a standard that they have no knowledge of.
I resent this thread, this discussion, and your attitude.
for everyone(including HubrisBoy):
i enjoy your company. say what the fuck you want to say, be it a little or a lot. shallow or deep. pass the beer nuts.
Wow you really are S U R L Y. :D
where do i sign up for "LJ" lessons.
Originally posted by lumberjim
this, however makes me want to turn my back on the whole enterprise. I know you're a squeaky wheel at this point, and your views are not upheld by the majority. so, i won't leave. it has, however taken some of the joy out of it for me.
You're being a bit overdramatic, don't you think?
I wasn't trying to be humorous.
Maybe we should open up another forum just soz you two can slug it out somewhere more fitting than threadriftland.
:zzz:
I asked Jim a serious question, and he's chosen to ignore it. *shrugs* No big deal.
sorry, syc, i'm still at work. last day of the month, don't ya know.
i thought it was funny because I made a comment just to express how i felt about hb's post, and you said i was being overdramatic.
it reminded me of when you and UT had a disagreement and you felt the same way, but stronger. strong enough to shut down the mainfestos and go your own way with them. ironic. i'm not making fun of you, and my brevity was just becasue i was in between printing forms for a deal, and didnt have time to expand upon what i was saying. you were justified in doing what you did if your feelings were real about what happened back then, and i am justified in saying that HB cost me some joy.
You're certainly entitled to your feelings, but I really don't think HB's comments are worth getting jacked up over.
Yeah...and....I believe the proper phrase is "chapped my ass". Get yer shit togethor eh?
Originally posted by blue
Yeah...and....I believe the proper phrase is "chapped my ass". Get yer shit togethor eh?
no, i said chafed, not chapped. chapped infers cold weather, and exposure to wind. while you are fond of exposing your ass, i am not. chafed means rubbed raw by something abrasive. like sand in your vagina.
oh yeah, and it's togeth
er, wisenheimer. or is that just your accent coming through in text? ;)
Originally posted by lumberjim
no, i said chafed, not chapped. chapped infers cold weather, and exposure to wind.
You'll have to forgive blue - he's been wearing chaps to Packers games for too long. Did I say Packers? Oops. :)
Well when do you use togethor then Einstein? It is a word right?
I don't have an accent, we talk normal here eh?
I'll have you know I wear an apron to Packer games Beestie....and yes the back is open, like a hospital gown...some Sunday, when you least expect it...yeah that'll be me ;-)
from dictionary.com:
No entry found for togethor.
did you mean together? or are you on crack again?
Suggestions:
together
gether
tether
tother
goethe
teether
tkoth
topheth
tiger
coauthor
toothier
geth
teth
togo
toth
teethe
tighar
tither
t'other
doeth
gthoh
teeth
tooth
ttcor
tyger
toged
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nice try.
arse is, though. as in, talking out your....
Well.
After creating an original and compelling thread, one is always gratified to see a spirited response from the community for which it was intended.
Of course, only the Giants<sup>™</sup> among us will understand what I'm talking about; most of the Tards<sup>™</sup> will never be able to experience the sensation. Sad, really.
Originally posted by marichiko
Sometimes brevity is the soul of wit.
How would you know?
Originally posted by ladysycamore
You also said that there is a time and a place for everything.
Where did I say that?
For some things, there's NEVER a time or place.
Three-quarters of the responses in this thread have been people chattering about what HB said. Problem is, HB didn't say most of the things that people are complaining about. Most of the Tards<sup>™</sup> who have responded in this thread aren't interested in addressing the point I was trying to make; they're just offended that somebody might dare take them to task for posting crap.
Well ya know what? To hell with them, and all the rest of the Lowest Common Denominator. They're the same people who are to blame for 'reality TV,' Ebonics, and warning labels that read "Do not use toaster in or around a bathtub."
The law says that I have to send my kids to school with their kids. And I have to sit next to them in restaurants. That's okay. But I don't have to tolerate their behavior here, and I won't. So if I see Tards<sup>™</sup> drawing a mustache on our copy of "The Flaying of Marsysas," or tethering a goat in the flower bed next to Current Events, or trying to leave their '75 Gremlin up on blocks in front of Home Base, I'm gonna call 'em on it.
This shit has been going on -and getting worse- for over a year. Enough.
Originally posted by ladysycamore
And now I see that you are going to just poof go away and not try to turn the ship 'round.
This ain't a chatroom, you know. I'll respond when I have a chance. If that's not quick enough for you, too bad. Deal with it. I don't have as much free time as... some people.
Originally posted by lumberjim
i post a response like a quip or a pun, and for the most part, that does not have any real worth. yet, if i was standing in a room talking to you folks, thats what i would say.
That's just it:
YOU'RE NOT standing in a room talking to folks.
If I were sitting on a toilet, I'd probably take a shit. But if I'm sitting in a crowded theater, I probably won't. You really oughta learn to be more aware of your surroundings.
Originally posted by lumberjim
it wouldnt even bother me if he had pointed to a particular instance of ;chaffing; and said, " hey, put some freaking thought into a post before you post it" or even saying to one person in particular that they are chatting too much. but to comment on the general malaise he feels and in a way that creates apprehension in some users to post at all for fear of being talked down to.....?
I kept it as general as possible precisely to
avoid pointing fingers at specific people.
But since you bring it up, Jim... you -and a few others- post too damn much, and much of what you post isn't very interesting. So I'd appreciate it if you'd rein it in a little.
There. Is that a more acceptable way of dealing with chaff?
Originally posted by lumberjim
HubrisBoy, you have a point. you also have a standing offer of a user based forum.
Really?!? Wow. That's mighty generous of you, Jim. But I think I prefer to impose my own outdated standards on the community as a whole. But you also have a standing offer to download AOL Instant Messenger, and ROFL with others unimpeded. I think people would respect that. I know I would.
Originally posted by be-bop
W T F.all these so called Giants of the board having Hissy Fits Hubris Boy, Dagney Jag all throwing the toy's out the pram stomping off in a fit of pique. Whats wrong with a bit of levity? now and again even in a serious post a smart or funny comment can enhance the argument or position you are trying to put across.
Huh? Where the hell did
that come from? Please show me where I suggested that there's anything wrong with humor. Heck, I've even been known to inject a little humor into my own posts from time to time.
Important safety tip: Read first, then respond.
Originally posted by lumberjim
Just in case you wanted to know, here are ALL of HB's posts for 2004
Yep. Ain't much there. I tend not to post when I don't have anything to say. You should try it.
I think it would be safe to say, HB, that the Cellar is no longer the place you knew, and it never will be again. But it is still enjoyable and valuable to the people who spend some of their time here. You haven't been an actively participating member lately, so any clout you may have possesed has largely evaporated. Lumberjim is a well-liked, respected member of this community, and from your recent posts, you're coming off as a crotchety, conceited whiner who stumbles in from time to time, and who is about as much fun as a carpet burn to the groin.
I'd take ONE of Lumberjim's posts over a dozen of yours. And I don't think I'm the minority. So, you can A) adapt to the community and be happy, B) continue whining and be ignored, or C) find someplace else to be intellectualy stimulated (and rest assured that whatever smarmy comeback you may imagine to be clever regarding the "intellectually stimulated" bit is painfully predictable and unfunny).
You like blunt? There it is.
[size=1]edit: fixed a spelling error[/size]
[COLOR=indigo]The bottom line here is that you don't make the call who posts what. Trying to belittle or categorize people into groups isn't going to bring about your desired effect. In fact, it just may have the opposite effect.
[/COLOR]
HubrisBoy,
I feel your pain. no, wait. I don't .......that was gas.
Listen, I'd like it if you posted more. You're pretty damn funny and smart, and your smile is amazing. If you can get your average up over 5 per day ( starting today, 7/1) I'll keep mine under 10. sound fair?
and thanks, H_P. That means more coming from you than it would from most people. ~sniff~ I promised my self I wouldn't cry. ~sniff~ Damn. I'm ok, I'm ok. let me just get my self together here aminute. ~sniff~
yeah, ok. so, ehem.....I love you guys. ~sniff~
LJ, you just don't get it do you. OK, I'm gonna give it to ya straight:
[FONT=courier new][French accent][/FONT]
You are inteeellectual pond scum
haugh, haugh
no, (self-congratulatory smirk) you, sir, are BELOW pond scum!
**sips wine - takes bit of brie - mumbles something with mouth full - picks food from beard- waves wine glass through air**
Noaux, I have eet now, you, how you say...LumberJeem are a Tard! Yes!! That eeees it! You are a Tard!!
[FONT=courier new][/French accent][/FONT]
Now, DON'T make me talk down to you a-gaine!
:rolleyes:
ah, oiu. eees tru, aye yam zee Taaaerdd. haungh haughn.
and yu aarrrre az welll. ees a shem zat we aaallllgh canno be so breelliant and astoooot az zee ubrees boweey, no?
passez le wine, pleeyayze
a question for sycamore:
jag has apparently bailed on the cellar. at least for the time being. why did you have nothing to say to him about it, but you tell me i'm overreacting? is it different because he agrees with you and HB, or just that you enjoy breaking my balls more than his. Or did you take him to task privately?
ok, that was more than one question.
Originally posted by lumberjim
If you can get your average up over 5 per day ( starting today, 7/1) I'll keep mine under 10. sound fair?
I'd like to see more of HB but nobody can average 5 posts a day without a poor signal to noise ratio.
Originally posted by Griff
I'd like to see more of HB but nobody can average 5 posts a day without a poor signal to noise ratio.
Profile For lumberjim
Date Registered: 10-08-2003
Status: dumbass savant
Total Posts: 3709 (13.89 posts per day)
You trying to say something here? :p
SSCREEEEEEEEEEEEE! WEEEEOOOOO WEEEEEEOOOOO WEEEEEEOOOOOOO BONK BONK BONK SCREEEEEEEE CHCHCHCHCH CK CK CK CK SSSSSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHHH
can you hear me now?
Originally posted by lumberjim
jag has apparently bailed on the cellar. at least for the time being. why did you have nothing to say to him about it, but you tell me i'm overreacting?
You answered your own question here. Jag has apparently decided the Cellar isn't for him right now. If I see him online over the weekend, I'll give him some shit for it.
He overreacted...so did HB...so did you. I can understand why some of you newer folks might be pissed, but it just ain't that serious. Really.
Originally posted by lumberjim
Listen, I'd like it if you posted more. You're pretty damn funny and smart, and your smile is amazing. If you can get your average up over 5 per day ( starting today, 7/1) I'll keep mine under 10. sound fair?
You would have to stop posting for 3 1/2 months before you would drop under 10/day average.
Originally posted by Griff
I'd like to see more of HB but nobody can average 5 posts a day without a poor signal to noise ratio.
Bullshit. :)
static to noise is largely unquantifiable, no?
first of all, 'static' in the sense you refer to is subjective. second, who's to say that of my 13.89 posts per day, that X amount of those posts are noise?
I'm not saying that every one of my posts is gold, but i would say that at least half(6.945) of them are more than just chit chat. the missing ingredient is time spent reading other posts. there are no statistics for that. I'd bet my wallet that I spend more time reading than most of the folks here, so it's only natural that i will have more to say in response. In addition to that, the 'good' posts that i make certainly number more than most on sheer statistical odds. The 'bad' ones too, if we assume a 50/50 split of good/bad posts..... ( most of you have averages below that 6.9 mark)
All of this focus on post quality will probably be good for us in the long run, so you could say that HB is doing us a service by taking the role of watchdog here, and sacrificing some good will he has surely earned over the years. Either, HB cares so much that he is willing to take one for the team and not back down, or he doesn't care much at all for the people behind the posts and therefore risks nothing in offending them. (which he said himself that he expected) If I had to bet, i'd go with the former.
And yet, it is natural for people to react when they are rebuffed by someone they feel some amount of respect for. For the newbies, we look over there and see a registration date in 2001 and must assume that that person is one of the 'giants' that HB has exhalted. I still think that if you're going to dump the post count, you should dump the reg date, too. I mean, is the date that you discovered the cellar more indicitive of talent than post count? or is it equally irrelevant?
Originally posted by sycamore
You would have to stop posting for 3 1/2 months before you would drop under 10/day average.
and hb would have to post like 30 per day to get up to 5 based on his date of reg...i did say going from 7/1 forward. i know there is no way of tracking that, and i was just making a point anyway:
I could berate people to post more like I do, but I don't .....so he shouldn't.
From the American Heritage Dictionary:
Hubris: Overbearing pride or presumption.
During his long tenure in the financial world, Friedman has watched dozens of his competitors' businesses killed by hubris born of success rather than by unsound business decisions or adverse market conditions.
--Lisa Endlich, Goldman Sachs: The Culture of Success
This is the actor's hubris, to imagine the world possessed of a single, avid eye fixed solely and always on him.
--John Banville, Eclipse
With dizzying hubris, Shelley elevated the vocation of the poet above that of priest and statesman.
--Peter Gay, Pleasure Wars: The Bourgeois Experience
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hubris comes from Greek hybris, "excessive pride, wanton violence."
If the shoe fits... That brief enough for you, HB? Patient DOES show a certain level of self-awareness...
And while I'm at it, if HB's arrogant attitude and sophmoric power of intellectual thought, combined with his excessively self-indulgent style of writing, is an example of the "old" Cellar, I would think that most people would welcome its disappearance rather than mourn it.
:p
Oh, I think he's weel aware of the implications of his chosen title.;)
LJ, why on earth are you taking this so personal. You act like it was Undertoad attacking you personally, when it was just another Dweller stating his preferences. It's a windmill.:)
Remember what I said about rules? That goes for HB and everyone else, also.
Originally posted by blue
Well when do you use togethor then Einstein? It is a word right?
Merriam Webster online doesn't recognize it. What do you think it means?
Well I for one believe that the REAL problem is not really one of quality over quantity. It's that, at a certain point, there are so many quantity of posts and threads that it's just impossible to keep up.
I took a look at the stats from the past, and we do generate about twice as many posts as what HB might call a golden era - and three times as many as just half a year learlier. But we also see an increate in the number of threads, a similar increase too.
LOL - oh wait, i can't do that. i can tell you that i had seen HB signed in a couple of times without posting so i was really looking forward to what he would have to say. although i did laugh while reading his post, it was sad... i had to wipe the tear from my eye.
i don't believe in giants around here, but i would have thought HB would have been able to come up with some better sort of retort.
unfortunately, i think we can now give him an honorary french accent, he can wear it like a medal. in my eyes what little weight i did lend to HB's thoughts is gone. his last post, if indicative of the man, would show him to be a self-impressed prick who is probably just a too tightly wound because his poor social interaction skills have prevented him from getting laid for the last oooh, lifetime? and in wonderful form he fires off some insults about our intelligence that he probably had to borrow from a book anyway. so, HB, if you meant to ruffle some feathers with the last post i think you missed the mark - you are just a write-off. sorry if i didn't use enough big words to be deemed worthy of your attention.
i think the point the rest of us stand on is that we enjoy the cellar, we thank tony for all the time and energy he puts into this so we may enjoy it. we make of it what we want - until the great and gloriousUT comes out from behind the curtain to tell us to reel it in. until such time - enjoy yourself - and i'll see if i can find a ladder to help you down from that damn pedastal.
Originally posted by lookout123
until such time - enjoy yourself - and i'll see if i can find a ladder to help you down from that damn pedastal.
Nah, let him stay up there. That way he can't inflict himself on the rest of the human race.;)
[COLOR=indigo]I'd suggest wings.[/COLOR]
Originally posted by OnyxCougar
[COLOR=indigo]I'd suggest wings.[/COLOR]
:D Icarus, right?
I do take it personally, bruce. as for why?
it's like this:
the way HB stated his initial point was a trap. he said so himself. He made a shoe. Now, if you respond to it and argue with him, the shoe fits, right? that makes it personal. I post more than anyone here (since dana evaporated, at least) and have always been concerned that I post too much. This strikes a particular nerve for me then. There is enough truth to what HB said to make it sting a little. So I feel like I should stand up for those he accuses of being Tards.
It would be pretty cool if every post was enthralling. I started the creative writing forum in an attempt to encourage that kind of thing.
The problem, as i see it, with being overly careful of making your every post deeply meaningful and well composed is that there are not enough active posters here to do that at a pace which will keep people interested, and coming back every couple of hours or so like they do now. People would eventually drift away, and forget about the cellar. ( how many interesting people came and went before I got here? how many of them would have stuck around longer if they knew they could count on at least 2 or 3 giggles a day in my posts?)
There are people who post drivel more often then not. Fortunately, they don't tend to stay very long (free aol discs do eventually expire) but even they have a value in that they make excellent targets for insults and firm talking down to's. I see myself as someone who's posts are well recieved by most people, so to equate the high post average with a high crap ratio concerns me. At first I tried to not take wht he said personally, but the more I thought about it, the more clear it was that he was speaking to me. Maybe I'm just being self centered, but his last post seems to have confirmed that suspicion. Now, If it was some asshole that said that, it wouldn't bother me nearly as much. I would be just as concerned if you, or Elspode, or UT, or HP, said it. And yes, what griff just said gives me a bit of a pause, too.
But you kow what? fuck it. I'm going to do as I do. it's who I am. if you think it's static, change the channel, or just tune me out. you're right bruce. you're right hubris, you're right onyx, you're right, beestie, UT, lookout, marichiko. we're all fucking right. so goddamn right it should be wrong.
and don't get mad at hubris, he obviously cares. it's just tough love.
now, let's have make up sex! :doit: :doit: :doit: :doit:
I see how a reg date might imply some kind of tenure on this board, but the reality is there are lots of names registered from long ago that in the past 3 years haven't made many (if any) posts. Now, in all of this...bruhaha, it's been implied several times that an old reg date + low low number of posts = low signal to noise ratio/higher intellegence/more meaningful posts/insert your own glorifying conclusion here.
Is that REALLY so? Can that be said without actually looking at all of the posts of such a user? Just because SomeNickname is 4 years old and has 10 posts registered to it doesn't make that person anymore intellectual, any more intellegent, any more a "Giant" than OtherNickname, 1 month old with 40 posts.
HB puts me in mind of a older gent sitting on his porch, grumbling about how things were better in the day, when kids respected their elders, dadgumit, and there weren't so many people around here making noise and there used to be a big beautiful field over there, all built up now, and why can't kids wear their pants where pants go, goin' around with their draws showing, yep things were MUCH Better back in MY day.*spit* *gum gum* Yep.
quote:
Originally posted by ladysycamore
You also said that there is a time and a place for everything.
Where did I say that?
For some things, there's NEVER a time or place.
HIS quote, not
YOURS:
http://www.cellar.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=6167&perpage=15&pagenumber=3
I believe that I
clearly stated, "jaguar said" when I quoted that post:
http://www.cellar.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=6167&perpage=15&pagenumber=4
Scroll down the page and see for yourself that I was speaking directly to jaguar.
Originally posted by ladysycamore
And now I see that you are going to just poof go away and not try to turn the ship 'round.
This ain't a chatroom, you know. I'll respond when I have a chance. If that's not quick enough for you, too bad. Deal with it. I don't have as much free time as... some people.
Again, I was responding to jag who clearly said that he was going to disappear for a while:
http://www.cellar.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=6167&perpage=15&pagenumber=3
Your own words:
"Important safety tip: Read first, then respond."
Now, you have made it obvious that you are dissatified with the way things are going here on this board and you have also made it clear that you don't give a damn how you project your dissatifaction to others. The level of utter and complete disrespect is appauling, to say the least. Calling people "tards" isn't going to get you what you want (unless alienating posters and hoping they would leave was your goal). Just because you are well read and speak well and can converse "properly" doesn't make you any better than anyone on this board. In fact, that last post of yours made you look like the biggest assfuck in human history...but hey, you don't care so what does that matter, right?
And yes, as a matter of fact, I *do* have quite some time on my hands, and not by choice as you are well aware. My time
IS valuable. Therefore, I don't have a whole
lot of time to debate with you the ins and outs of a messageboard. The internet, as a whole, is
NOT that serious for me personally. The only thing basically that matters to me at this point are the people on my dialysis board and helping them deal with chronic illness, which is ten million times mother fucking
INFINITY more important than worrying about how people post on a board. :rolleyes:
Bottom line: you are
NOT the owner of this board, and gee whiz, guess what? You don't get to decide who posts and who doesn't. Until UT decides that certain folks are not wanted here, I
will continue to post
however and
whenever I like, just as I'm sure you will (and just as YOU HAVE!).
So if you don't give a fuck, then neither the hell do I.
GOOD DAY!
Originally posted by marichiko
Nah, let him stay up there. That way he can't inflict himself on the rest of the human race.;)
Nah, let him fall the
fuck right off. On his head. :mad:
Originally posted by Cyber Wolf
HB puts me in mind of a older gent sitting on his porch, grumbling about how things were better in the day, when kids respected their elders, dadgumit, and there weren't so many people around here making noise and there used to be a big beautiful field over there, all built up now, and why can't kids wear their pants where pants go, goin' around with their draws showing, yep things were MUCH Better back in MY day.*spit* *gum gum* Yep.
[COLOR=indigo]Now YOU are interesting, CW. Stick around, youngster!! This just might get good....[/COLOR]
Originally posted by lumberjim
The problem, as i see it, with being overly careful of making your every post deeply meaningful and well composed is that there are not enough active posters here to do that at a pace which will keep people interested, and coming back every couple of hours or so like they do now. People would eventually drift away, and forget about the cellar. ( how many interesting people came and went before I got here? how many of them would have stuck around longer if they knew they could count on at least 2 or 3 giggles a day in my posts?)
I prefer a slower pace and a personal connection. I could drop in once a day and see what was up. Many days I'd check in quite often but if I didn't, I could get up to speed in a few minutes. I'm not wired for new cellar. Summers used to be really slow here but now if we drop out we'll find a pile of folks we don't know when we get back. It was a cool experiment in community, while it lasted, but my time here as a regular poster is pretty much over. I don't know and can't get to know you people so why stick around? I'm still here but its no longer important to me to be involved.
that's nice.
happy, hubris boy? jag, griff...who's next?
I take back what I said about having some respect for you. i told you this thread sucks. fucking shit.
no make up sex for you.
you tell us about pissing in the fingerbowls, and then you go pissing in the soup.
jerk off
Originally posted by lumberjim
that's nice.
happy, hubris boy? jag, griff...who's next?
I take back what I said about having some respect for you. i told you this thread sucks. fucking shit.
no make up sex for you.
you tell us about pissing in the fingerbowls, and then you go pissing in the soup.
jerk off
Okay...what is this rant about?
Christ I wanted to stay out of this thread.
I think Hubris Boy had a good point, and I see where he's coming from, he made a good (if holier than thou) post that laid it all out pretty clearly. I'm a newbie but even late last fall there was a different atmosphere.
I was drawn to it then, like it even a little better now...there is more clutter for sure, but it still has the same overall character....just with a bit new spice.
I think the Giants should stick around and talk. What HB maybe forgot is for every post I make, I'll read probably a couple hundred. I personally seldom like to engage in really heavy stuff, its too time consuming, and after watching the evening news every day I've sorta had my fill.
I do however find many deep threads that I never participate in fascinating. And since we're arguing the same thing over and over, let me repeat my sole contribution to this thread:
Who gives a shit really?
If you're not plannng on sticking around please tell your close friends, but don't bitch and whine to the masses. We really don't care THAT much. I'll miss Jag for example, even tho I disagreed with the majority of his posts I always read them when I saw his handle.
But the whole "it ain't like it used to be" crap, I'm gonna leave...so be it....fucking leave already. I hate to see good posters go but it's a fucking BBS. A cool one at that, 14 years? Seems like it's evolving and sustaining quite nicely.
We do need the Giant NBN to get back to posting more cheesecake.....I do miss that.
Originally posted by lumberjim
the way HB stated his initial point was a trap. he said so himself. He made a shoe. Now, if you respond to it and argue with him, the shoe fits, right? that makes it personal. I post more than anyone here (since dana evaporated, at least) and have always been concerned that I post too much. This strikes a particular nerve for me then. There is enough truth to what HB said to make it sting a little. So I feel like I should stand up for those he accuses of being Tards.
Do you post too much? I'd say yeah. But...is it really that big of a deal? Seriously.
The problem, as i see it, with being overly careful of making your every post deeply meaningful and well composed is that there are not enough active posters here to do that at a pace which will keep people interested, and coming back every couple of hours or so like they do now.
How much of the Cellar prior to your arrival have you read? Not every post was deeply meaningful and well-composed. Believe me.
People would eventually drift away, and forget about the cellar.
The Cellar is a revolving door...people come and go all the time. It's been like that since I've been here. It will probably continue to be that way.
how many interesting people came and went before I got here?
Lots.
how many of them would have stuck around longer if they knew they could count on at least 2 or 3 giggles a day in my posts?
Are you being facetious or are you serious? Not to mention, your question is unanswerable.
I see myself as someone who's posts are well recieved by most people, so to equate the high post average with a high crap ratio concerns me. At first I tried to not take wht he said personally, but the more I thought about it, the more clear it was that he was speaking to me. Maybe I'm just being self centered, but his last post seems to have confirmed that suspicion. Now, If it was some asshole that said that, it wouldn't bother me nearly as much. I would be just as concerned if you, or Elspode, or UT, or HP, said it. And yes, what griff just said gives me a bit of a pause, too.
Jim, you are starting to sound as bad as HB on the other side of the spectrum. What the hell do you care what this guy thinks of you? All you're doing now is playing into him. Let it go.
it's about the fact that just when i thought we were somewhat assuaging the negative sentiment that hubris created, we lose another respected giant. Griff. did you not read the thread?
or are you too cool to care again? now that you're the calm and collected sycamore. i think you just like to freaking heckle me. why dont you ask rho what she's ranting about. she seems to understand whats going on here better than you do.
Originally posted by lumberjim
i think you just like to freaking heckle me.
Didn't you two make nice at forks?
Originally posted by sycamore
Jim, you are starting to sound as bad as HB on the other side of the spectrum. What the hell do you care what this guy thinks of you? All you're doing now is playing into him. Let it go.
i was answering bruce's question about why i take it personally.
Are you being facetious or are you serious? Not to mention, your question is unanswerable.
serious. but i was just using myself as an example. if i see a new post by someone i think is funny, i read it first. or if its a topic i'm extra interested in. what i was saying is that more activity breeds more membership, breeds more content, breeds more activity, breeds more content. more content = more good and more bad. ignore the bad, enjoy the good.
I got re-mad when griff dumped out ( he also asked me to just keep his tshirts) ...anyone want a couple of black (L) short sleevers? hubris brought this shit to a head, and it pisses me off. i'll miss griff even though he didnt post a whole lot. i dont know why, i just like him.
dont be a stranger, griff
Hey! Quit fucking ignoring ME! ;)
shut up. this aint a chat room
Originally posted by lumberjim
it's about the fact that just when i thought we were somewhat assuaging the negative sentiment that hubris created, we lose another respected giant. Griff. did you not read the thread?
Eh...maybe we're reading the thread differently. The way I read it, Griff is sticking around, but is not really into the board that much anymore. And it seems that you're trying to blame that on HB, though I'm not sure why.
or are you too cool to care again?
???
now that you're the calm and collected sycamore.
I'm the calm and collected sycamore more often than not...there are still enough oldheads on here to back me up.
i think you just like to freaking heckle me.
Well, sometimes it's fun to fuck with you b/c you're such an easy target. :)
But seriously...WTF? You need to relax, man.
why dont you ask rho what she's ranting about. she seems to understand whats going on here better than you do.
I think I understand what's going on here just fine.
I don't know why Rho bothered to respond to him again...she needs to let it go too.
Oh you're just cranky about:
Originally posted by ladysycamore
"Ok so how many ppl would I like to get busy with? Nobody in this town, for sure."
That was some funny shit. ;-)
Ahahahahafuckyourself. :)
Originally posted by lumberjim
shut up. this aint a chat room
Don't make me telephone you in about 6 hours.
Originally posted by sycamore
Well, sometimes it's fun to fuck with you b/c you're such an easy target. :-)
Ain't that the truth. :)
Originally posted by lumberjim
i was answering bruce's question about why i take it personally.
I understand...but why take it so personally? Imagine what you could have done with the time you wasted here...you could have written 30 new posts. :)
what i was saying is that more activity breeds more membership, breeds more content, breeds more activity, breeds more content. more content = more good and more bad. ignore the bad, enjoy the good.
That's not necessarily a good thing though...could result in too many cooks in the soup.
I got re-mad when griff dumped out ( he also asked me to just keep his tshirts) ...anyone want a couple of black (L) short sleevers? hubris brought this shit to a head, and it pisses me off. i'll miss griff even though he didnt post a whole lot. i dont know why, i just like him.
So HB brought things to a head...I don't think that was necessarily a bad thing. I think this dialogue was necessary...now we know where some folks stand. And better now than later, it would seem.
Griff was one of the first non-Philadelphians/non-old-school Cellarites that found the board. He's a good guy, and I hope he will continue to contribute here regularly.
Jim, Syc: Chill already, dudes. As far as I'm concerned you BOTH make very valuable (if very different) contributions to the board. I wish you'd both stop with the quibbling, already. Agree to disagree and move on. I actually like you both and would love to see the two of you move on to better things.
As someone who also posts here frequently, I too felt attacked by HB's posts. But bottom line, his contributions to this board have been as ephemeral as Tomas R.'s - gone when his AOL disk ran out. HB may have registered back before the beginning of time, but has he been a consistent and intelligent member of the board? Not very.
Like Lady Syc, I also sometimes end up with a lot of time on my hands, but like her; it's hardly by my own choice. If any one thinks I'd pick hanging out in the Cellar over running a library, that person is even more arrogant than HB. I like most of you, but give me a break. At least sometimes the Cellar can make up a little for the fascinating discussions I used to have with all those nerds and intellectuals who tend to hang out in libraries. And the reason I'm not staffing the reference desk in one tonight is in part because I've sat here for 10 minutes trying to figure out how to spell "libraries" - Jeez! But I think I sometimes manage a coherant thought or two for all that.
So, HB, go run home to your Mama and complain about life not being fair. She raised you, so she should be the one that gets stuck with your attitude, Dude, not the rest of us. I'm sticking around 'till UT says otherwise or I get too bored or disgusted.
If Jag wants to retreat for a while, that's his loss. I like him a lot and will miss him, but maybe he found a nice Swiss girlfriend to take up his time.
Originally posted by marichiko
Jim, Syc: Chill already, dudes. As far as I'm concerned you BOTH make very valuable (if very different) contributions to the board. I wish you'd both stop with the quibbling, already. Agree to disagree and move on. I actually like you both and would love to see the two of you move on to better things.
Relax, Mari. Jim and I are having a discussion. He gets a little paranoid and cantankerous sometimes, but it's all good. I'd rather him get pissy here and there than go on a murder spree. :)
Originally posted by sycamore
I don't know why Rho bothered to respond to him again...she needs to let it go too.
Let what go? See, already forgotten. :D
Believe me, once I said, "good day!" that was it.
What an interesting thread this is.
I just read through the first few pages and agree with HB overall. How could I agree, being guilty myself of submitting so much goofy content, or outright garbage? Good question. I certainly see his point though, as well as many of the others that have posted?
UT had a good point in there too. The number of members has increased in just the short time I have been here. It is getting more difficult to keep up simply because the membership has increased so much. The cellar is evolving. That might be good or bad news to you, depending on where you stand.
What the cellar is seems to depend on when you joined. It may very well be in decline to some from the beggining, but for others not at all.
What is the cellar to me? A place to waste time? A place to get another perspective? A place to learn someting? A place to post goofy pics? Yes. Many of you I have met in person and that makes being here all that much more interesting. The cellar is real, not just text. A wide variety of people that I have something in common with, a login at the cellar and maybe some interests or views.
There are a lot of different places you can go to bitch and moan about this or that, and a few that you can go to get specific information. You can't be uncensored there though. Maybe that's good, maybe not. The cellar offers acceptance for those tough skinned enough to endure the inevitable flamefest until you get your bearings and settle in with some like minded folks. That's been a good thing for me.
HB's point about content comes in loud and clear for me though. You just know when you have someting real to contribute and when you don't. Sometimes you post if you just have noise at that particular moment. This place is so addictive though. People just don't get along and basically play nice outside of here. People just don't tolerate you.
Do LJ, Syc and Bruce post too much? I don't think so but I think they're funny, interesting people. Do I post too much? I think so. That's why I tend to take a break for a few months at a time. Maybe people can put up with me trying to amuse myself with what I post if I give them a break. I hope so because I really like it here, even when I'm not around much.
So in light of the admitted lack of real content or real funny content, I think it might be time for me to back off. I wont be going away mad or depressed but just with the realization that I am an addict and that if I stay here and dont get anything accomplished, I wont have nearly as much to talk about than if I went out and did *something*. Then I can come back with something new to add instead of trying to make something interesting out of nothing.
I'll be back though, you guys are my only friends, sad as that may be. :biggrin:
What about Jethro* or did the mailorder bride finally do him in?
*Name changed to protect the innocent
