Posted by Elspode on a thread far from here:
Am I the only one here who believes that what comes around, goes around?
What an excellent question. I, for one, don't believe so. That's right I don't believe in karma, nor divine judgement. In my life I've not see the universal scales balance themselves to give anyone their what they deserve, good or bad. In fact, I've mostly found that the line "No good deed goes unpunished" is more accurate than Ep's quote above.
Sound kind of bleak? It's not. Two things make the differnce to me, pride and principle. My principles make me pretty damn honest and protective of the weak, as well as preventing me from doing harm in all but self defense or defense of others. While pride locks me on to my principles with no room for error.
Another thing that brightens my life, seeing decency and kindness in others. Especially when they don't believe they'll get anything from it other than self-satisfaction. It's beautiful to see in people. It does exist, even if it's not as common as it should be.
None of that is the point of this thread. I was hoping that many of you would share your views on the subject. That's the point of the thread. I just wanted to throw mine up for review before I asked anyone else to. So, tear up my veiws and/or give your own. Either way I'm good. Just don't stay silent, please, I'm really curious about this issue.
One of the things about karma, is that no one knows where the balance sheet stands ... karma is not an instant quid pro quo of rewards and punishments. Stuff is worked out over lifetimes.
Having the car break down, the wife leave you, and a tree fall onto your uninsured house may be hardships you face because of something your soul did several lifetimes back rather than that time day before yesterday you pinched the waitress' ass and didn't tip her.
karma. It's what's for dinner.
I do believe in karma. But in a kind of different way. I think we magnetize ourselves to certain types of karma. I dont think there is a literal correlation, like do something bad, somthing bad will happen, but i do think if you feel you deserve bad things to happen, and you expect them, you're more likely to experience them. self fulfilling prophecy.
with a proud and honorable self image, and enough confidence to not beleive in karma, you exemplify the positive swing on that pendulum, whit. You attract positives with your energy. You see opportunities for positives, and are more likely to reach for them because of your confidence that they will work for you. A loser would see the hazards and not notice the opportunity; or if he did see it, try so timidly that the opportunity passes and they miss it or botch it.
use the force, whit.
Wolf, yeah I know karma is a long-term thing. I've just known/known of a few complete rat-bastards that died pretty happy. I acknowledge that I have no idea what happens after death, just don't have any reason to believe things'll be all that much different.
Jim, gosh, between you and Elspode I'm ready to blush. Heh, on subject though, I'd like to think I turn things to a positive, likely though I'm just bulling through on sheer stubbornness. Can't let a little things like pain and/or failure bother you, after all.
I view karma as essentially the golden rule. If you make a habit of hurting other people, eventually someone will get you back.
I believe the "over a lifetime" balance of things, but...
hardships you face because of something your soul did several lifetimes back
...that just sucks. Thanks, I'm all bummed for the day now. :p
Originally posted by Happy Monkey
I view karma as essentially the golden rule. If you make a habit of hurting other people, eventually someone will get you back.
I'm with you on this. To me it's a slightly more esoteric version of "Do unto others...."
Originally posted by Happy Monkey
I view karma as essentially the golden rule. If you make a habit of hurting other people, eventually someone will get you back.
That also jibes with the well-known "tit for tat" rule of psychology. Hurt other people, cheat them or let them down, and they are more likely to do the same to you later.
Of course, this may no longer apply in the days of huge, soulless corporations and Big Brother government. They have no memory and no concience.
- Pie, who does not believe in karma, just human nature.
Karma? A catch- all phrase for random acts of senseless ________.
Could be good or bad like receiving a DoDad out of the blue or blue ice from above.:cool:
DoDad? blue ice? anyone with me in my puzzlement?
Welcome Funky. No, you're the only one.
thanks blue! well, any chance of an explanation?
Dodads are covered in the Quality Images forum, and I just assumed blue ice was airplane pee.
That would be a good assumption.
Originally posted by novice
I'm with you on this. To me it's a slightly more esoteric version of "Do unto others...."
Or "God don't like ugly". Not that I'm all that religious, but I do believe in karma and retribution.
hardships you face because of something your soul did several lifetimes back
Sheesh, well then I wanna know what the hell I did in another life to be in the situation I'm in! :D
I demand a recount!!! :p
I don't think that Karma just deals itself out over lifetimes. I've seen too many people get their comeuppance for something they've done in this one to believe that.
Of course, there are some that might rack up enough in the red to warrant getting bitch-slapped the next time they come around, but for the most part, I think we get what we deserve in this life, and start over clean in the next.
Even if you don't believe in Karma/Do unto others in a cosmic, it-will-get-you-no-matter-what way, it is difficult to refute the notion that leading a sane and generous life pays some sort of rewards.
You say that rich people are insufferable fucks? Well, then, tell me again why you want to be rich? You say good guys finish last? Yeah, maybe, but they die with many friends.
I'll take being a poor nice guy any day over being a rich asshole.
Nope
There's no way to show a causal link. Just because a shit-bird gets audited doesn't mean it happened because he was a shit-bird.
My brain is tired today, and I am feeling just a wee bit inarticulate, so I'm sorry if I can't communicate my thoughts on this deep subject very effectively. And if it's brevity you're looking for, look elsewhere. :D
I believe that Karma is largely the product of human nature and society. Both tend to be self-correcting to a degree, and I think that's how karma manifests itself. Of course I have seen some things which lead me to believe that it may also be influenced by a cosmic force of some kind, because it is occasionally too poetic to be accidental. Maybe antimatter has something to do with it. Cough.
One of the mechanisms is conscience. If someone does something shitty, it will weigh on their conscience, and erode away at their personal happiness and comfort, and may indirectly impact their life (e.g. depression leading to eventual divorce). The worse the wrong-doing is, the heavier the weight, the deeper the depression, the greater the damage to the person's life. In contrast, if someone does good things for people, they will be happier, and it will have an indirect positive influence on their life.
There's also the direct consequences, the tit-for-tat rule. But that was mentioned already.
Society also has an impact. If I am an asshole, people will react negatively in a general way. People who I am in frequent contact with will react to the behavior by altering theirs similarly. This can have a cumulative effect... if I treat somebody like shit all the time, they may just ignore it most of the time, but one day it may surface as bitterness, anger, and/or hatred towards me. Third parties may also observe that I treat the person like shit, and alter their behavior, and/or make decisions that effect my life negatively (boss may fire me, people may tend to avoid me, etc). Naturally, the same cumulative effect applies to kindness.
I don't think that Karma is ever a perfect balance, because it's a side-effect of human behavior. I also think that sometimes Karma works backwards... if somebody robs a bank and gets away with it, maybe it's because they've been dirt-poor for years, and acted in desparation. They collected the Karma before they did the deed.
I know I'm not communicating my thoughts as well as I'd like. Oh well. I had to suffer through typing it, so I'll make you suffer through reading it. Maybe I'll get hit by a car on the way home.
Originally posted by lumberjim
karma. It's what's for dinner.
I do believe in karma. But in a kind of different way. I think we magnetize ourselves to certain types of karma. I dont think there is a literal correlation, like do something bad, somthing bad will happen, but i do think if you feel you deserve bad things to happen, and you expect them, you're more likely to experience them. self fulfilling prophecy.
with a proud and honorable self image, and enough confidence to not beleive in karma, you exemplify the positive swing on that pendulum, whit. You attract positives with your energy. You see opportunities for positives, and are more likely to reach for them because of your confidence that they will work for you. A loser would see the hazards and not notice the opportunity; or if he did see it, try so timidly that the opportunity passes and they miss it or botch it.
use the force, whit.
I'm with lumberjim on this one. I believe that what goes around comes around because you largely make it yourself, out of your own attitudes and expectations.
limey
Nothing is more inevitable or predictable than that which we bring upon ourselves...
Originally posted by Elspode
Nothing is more inevitable or predictable than that which we bring upon ourselves...
And don't forget recurring.;)
I thought I should stop in and testify to Bruce's ongoing attempts to corner the market on good Karma. Your timing is impecable. :)
Explain, please?:confused: