Quick, everyone change positions.

Griff • Nov 20, 2018 6:13 pm
Emails don't matter!
Emails matter!
Undertoad • Nov 20, 2018 6:16 pm
Wait let me try

Emails matter!
Emails don't matter!

got it
Griff • Nov 20, 2018 6:22 pm
See, that wasn't so hard.
Undertoad • Nov 20, 2018 6:27 pm
Emails kinda matter like you are supposed to wear your badge on display at all times while in the building and official policy is everyone is supposed to report you if you don't but the loose defacto badge policy is some people give a crap and wear the badge visibly but others just put it in their pocket and nobody reports anybody because why would you?
sexobon • Nov 20, 2018 7:34 pm
No one wants to be badgered.
tw • Nov 20, 2018 8:53 pm
Honest people post openly. Emails are for the many who fear to admit their conclusions. Or are trying to form one.
xoxoxoBruce • Nov 20, 2018 9:17 pm
Griff;1019278 wrote:
See, that wasn't so hard.

Hard doesn't matter.
No, hard matters, actually hard is crucial. :yesnod:
Griff • Nov 21, 2018 7:15 am
tw;1019290 wrote:
Honest people post openly. Emails are for the many who fear to admit their conclusions. Or are trying to form one.


No. I'm just noting the way the wind is blowing.
Hillary's email matters and Ivanka's email matters or Hillary's email doesn't matter and Ivanka's email doesn't matter.
Griff • Nov 21, 2018 7:19 am
As someone who has shitty email at work I get the frustration with using crap systems. As a rule follower I use the crappy system. If I were engaged in corruption like rigging elections or taking bribes, I'd have another reason to use an outside system
Undertoad • Nov 21, 2018 7:44 am
Next level, level 2

Free trade between nations enriches both sides
Trade protectionism saves jobs

your turn
Griff • Nov 21, 2018 7:47 am
Trade protectionism saves jobs
Free trade between nations enriches both sides

ouchie bro
Undertoad • Nov 22, 2018 12:39 pm
People are all the same
Diversity is our strength

this is not really the same sort of point though
tw • Nov 22, 2018 6:02 pm
Griff;1019312 wrote:
Free trade between nations enriches both sides


Free trade gamefully employs and enriches custom officers. With the current president, customs are only getting richer. Or playing more games.
anonymous • Nov 22, 2018 6:29 pm
Sometimes you want to go. Where everybody knows your name.


(no one said the change had to be entirely articulated)
xoxoxoBruce • Nov 22, 2018 10:23 pm
Clever. ;)
Griff • Nov 23, 2018 8:24 am
How's about
Executive Orders get things done.
Executive Orders subvert Congressional powers.
monster • Nov 23, 2018 6:12 pm
disappointed. Thought this was going to be an orgy thread
sexobon • Nov 23, 2018 10:34 pm
At least Naked Twister; but, noo[SIZE="3"]o[/SIZE][SIZE="4"]o[/SIZE][SIZE="3"]o[/SIZE]oo.
Griff • Nov 24, 2018 10:16 am
Nobody enforces a no drift rule here, have at.
monster • Nov 24, 2018 8:34 pm
Right boob or left ball on red
Griff • Nov 24, 2018 11:22 pm
Tongue on blue.
sexobon • Nov 24, 2018 11:24 pm
Cock or couter on yellow.
Gravdigr • Nov 25, 2018 3:53 pm
Griff;1019543 wrote:
Tongue on blue.


You mean pink.:eaty:
BigV • Nov 26, 2018 9:35 pm
Yes, PYNK.

[YOUTUBE]PaYvlVR_BEc[/YOUTUBE]
BigV • Nov 26, 2018 9:35 pm
Griff;1019543 wrote:
Tongue on blue.


ya might want to loosen that strap...
Gravdigr • Nov 27, 2018 7:06 pm
Big Bad Wolf reference @ 1:02!!!!!
sexobon • Dec 16, 2018 2:54 pm
He's a hero
He's not a hero
He's a murderer
He's a hero

Oh, the complexities of war.

The government keeps changing its position. What say the governed?

[SIZE="3"]Trump says he’ll review case of Matt Golsteyn, a Special Forces veteran who faces murder charge[/SIZE]

… President Trump tweeted Sunday … “At the request of many, I will be reviewing the case of a ‘U.S. Military hero,’ Major Matt Golsteyn, who is charged with murder,” Trump tweeted. “He could face the death penalty from our own government after he admitted to killing a Terrorist bomb maker while overseas.”

Former Army Maj. Mathew L. Golsteyn was notified Thursday by the Army that he will face one charge of murder, his attorney and the Army said. The military has been investigating him since 2011, when Army officials said he confessed during a polygraph test as part of a CIA job interview to killing the suspected bombmaker in February 2010. …

… The service dropped its investigation in 2014 but reopened it in 2016, after Golsteyn said during a Fox News interview that he had killed a bombmaker who had been held as a detainee for fear that he would target Afghans helping U.S. troops if he were let go.

Golsteyn, a 2002 graduate of the U.S. Military Academy at West Point, N.Y., was lauded for his performance in Afghanistan as the commander of a team from 3rd Special Forces Group in the Battle of Marja. Some 15,000 coalition troops fought to take back a poppy-laden section of Helmand province that was controlled by the Taliban and laced with explosives.

On Feb. 20, 2010, Golsteyn repeatedly braved enemy fire after watching a Taliban sniper nearly hit a nearby Marine, launching a mission to kill the insurgent and coordinating numerous airstrikes, according to a military summary of his actions. He was later awarded the Silver Star for valor, and the Army was considering upgrading the award to the Distinguished Service Cross — one step down from the Medal of Honor — when the allegations against Golsteyn emerged.

The accusations center on actions two days earlier. Two Marines — Sgt. Jeremy R. McQueary, 27, and Lance Cpl. Larry M. Johnson, 19 — were killed and others were wounded by a garage door booby-trapped with explosives, prompting a search of nearby homes in which Golsteyn’s unit found bomb-making materials and a suspected bombmaker, according to results of an investigation released to The Washington Post through the Freedom of Information Act in 2015.

Golsteyn later recounted during his CIA job interview that the U.S. troops detained the man and brought him back to their base, who unexpectedly crossed paths with an Afghan tribal leader with whom Golsteyn’s team was working. When the leader expressed fear for his life, Golsteyn said he grew concerned about the consequences of letting the suspected insurgent go, Army documents said.

“CPT Golsteyn stated he had no qualms about what he did because he couldn’t have lived with himself if [the suspected bombmaker] killed another Soldier or Marine,” an Army investigator’s summary of Golsteyn’s polygraph test said.

The Army dropped Golsteyn from the Special Forces in 2015 and stripped him of the Silver Star, but ultimately dropped the criminal investigation against him and let him leave the service with military benefits. The service accused him in a June 2015 administrative hearing of violating the law of armed conflict, but a panel of officers determined that was unsubstantiated. It instead recommended separating him from the military for conduct unbecoming an officer with a general discharge under honorable conditions. ...
xoxoxoBruce • Dec 18, 2018 1:58 am
I suspect he's not the first or last to have exceeded his authority doing what had to be done.
Griff • Dec 20, 2018 7:12 am
I'm with Trumpy on Syria. He's likely dead wrong and doing it for the wrong reasons but someday we have to pull back, Forever War is not an actual functional foreign policy.
Gravdigr • Dec 25, 2018 12:29 pm
Forever War - sounds like a Shatner novel.

Or the new store in the mall.
Griff • Dec 25, 2018 1:04 pm
Joe Haldeman actually. Definitely worth a read.
Gravdigr • Dec 26, 2018 12:50 pm
No shit? I'll look into it.


From wiki:

Haldeman received a letter from Robert Heinlein congratulating him on his Nebula Award, which "meant more than the award itself". According to author Spider Robinson, Heinlein approached Haldeman at the awards banquet and said the book "may be the best future war story I've ever read!"


Dayum.
glatt • Dec 27, 2018 9:06 pm
I've read it. It's good.
Happy Monkey • Dec 29, 2018 12:35 pm
Another +1 for "Forever War".
Gravdigr • Dec 29, 2018 1:16 pm
I guess it's done then. I was gonna use my library more this coming year. This might be my next library book.
Clodfobble • Dec 30, 2018 12:46 am
Do it. I, too, enjoyed it, and I'm picky about my sci-fi.
richlevy • Jan 2, 2019 11:24 pm
Great book. I love the part where due to relativity he would travel forward in time and experience the social evolution on Earth. Picture a soldier from the Revolutionary War mixing with soldiers from the Vietnam War.
Gravdigr • Jan 11, 2019 11:59 am
Damn, it's Rich Levy!
Griff • Jan 18, 2019 2:36 pm
Okay folks let's all change our positions on impeachment articles.


The president obstructed justice in an effort to delay, impede, cover up and conceal the existence of evidence related to the Jones case.
Gravdigr • Jan 22, 2019 2:21 pm
I'm feelin it.
































[size=1]Not reeeally.[/size]
sexobon • Jan 26, 2019 10:54 am
A purveyor of fake news has changed its position:

[SIZE="3"]British paper apologizes to Melania Trump, pays 'substantial damages' over article[/SIZE]

London's Daily Telegraph apologized to first lady Melania Trump on Saturday and said it had agreed to pay her "substantial damages" for publishing false statements regarding her family and her modeling career.

"We apologise unreservedly to The First Lady and her family for any embarrassment caused by our publication of these allegations," the newspaper wrote Saturday. "As a mark of our regret we have agreed to pay Mrs. Trump substantial damages as well as her legal costs." ...
Undertoad • May 7, 2019 9:30 pm
Russia must be prevented from using social media to interfere with our elections
I'm sure glad social media i.e. Twitter banned the Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Parody account
tw • May 8, 2019 10:49 am
Melania Trump did something? Did it involve talking?
Griff • May 10, 2019 12:31 pm
Pompeo is Hillary on Iran, check your positions.
Griff • May 10, 2019 5:03 pm
https://www.upi.com/Defense-News/2019/05/10/B-52s-Marine-expeditionary-unit-head-to-Middle-East-as-tensions-rise-with-Iran/3501557497038/

May 10 (UPI) -- The Defense Department has dispatched two more B-52s and a Marine expeditionary unit to the Middle East amid growing tensions with Iran.
Griff • Oct 3, 2019 10:59 am
The Supreme Court is about to get rolling. It's time to rotate positions on "activist judges" and settled law.
Griff • Oct 25, 2019 7:27 am
"My" GOP representative has rotated to closed hearings are bad mmm..kay. To be fair, he's in a district so red there's always someone worse running a sweep right and he is post-Benghazi.
Clodfobble • Oct 25, 2019 10:36 am
Meanwhile, Jeff Flake claims that at least 35 GOP senators would vote to remove Trump if the vote were made secret. Absolute cowardice.
tw • Oct 25, 2019 11:06 am
Clodfobble;1040370 wrote:
Absolute cowardice.

And absolute honesty. But you are not ready to admit how corrupt this guy has been all his adult life. Again, it is what has changed in America. He insults people. He grabs women's cunts. He can even shoot someone on Fifth Ave and still get elected. Extremism is now so rampant. So what has always been anti-social and corrupt behavior is now acceptable.

Why do you even endorse ethnic cleansing of Kurds? It is what has changed and is now acceptable.
henry quirk • Oct 25, 2019 1:02 pm
I'm offended.

Call them vajayjays yayas, please.
henry quirk • Oct 25, 2019 1:02 pm
:crazy:
Clodfobble • Oct 25, 2019 4:00 pm
tw wrote:
But you are not ready to admit how corrupt this guy has been all his adult life... Why do you even endorse ethnic cleansing of Kurds?


Dude, I say this with all the empathy in the world--you're having a rough week. You either weren't paying attention who you're talking to, or you've completely misconstrued my position in your mind. Take some deep breaths.
sexobon • Oct 25, 2019 7:32 pm
That's not Dude, that's tw. The poor fellow is confused enough without you and your Jedi mind tricks.
tw • Oct 25, 2019 9:59 pm
Clodfobble;1040382 wrote:
You either weren't paying attention who you're talking to, or you've completely misconstrued my position in your mind.

I have read your previous posts - with praise for The Don and for the people who support and praise him.

If you do not condom what The Don does and believes, then post it.

Meanwhile I say again, due to so many right wingers who blindly believe (with anger and threats) what they are told to believe. The Don (and his peers) have successfully even driven moderates out of the Republican party.

That Frontline piece demonstrates it clearly with a backstabbing of Eric Cantor - the House Majority leader. Same later happened to John Boehner. Because the party is now dominated by people who are told who to hate. Use hate to attract supporters. And do so with vindication only because they are told to. Inspired by a leader who is very good at promoting himself using hostility, insults, and constant lies.

(If) That being your other point: as I said, I agreed with the conclusion. But I do not believe (or know) if you believe or understand the reasons why. Since you have expressed agreement with The Don. Do not openly criticize him. And should.
Clodfobble • Oct 26, 2019 10:53 am
tw wrote:
I have read your previous posts - with praise for The Don and for the people who support and praise him.


You're insane. Trump is a misogynist, racist, narcissistic old man who's lost touch with reality both because of his wealth and his declining cognition. I've never suggested otherwise.

Perhaps you're confused because I recently called GOP senators who wanted a secret vote cowards. They are cowards--they should stand up for what they believe in.
sexobon • Oct 26, 2019 11:12 am
What kind of Tomfoolery is this?
tw • Oct 26, 2019 11:46 am
Clodfobble;1040404 wrote:
Perhaps you're confused because I recently called GOP senators who wanted a secret vote cowards. They are cowards--they should stand up for what they believe in.
Well this is a revelation. Since I only saw plenty of right wing recommendations under your name. But then you may have posted those characterizations elsewhere. I don't participate in all boards.

But yes. Anyone who disagrees with your accurate characterization must be doing the ostrich thing.

BTW, he never lost touch with reality. He has always been that way. He even trades in used wives when they get too old. And has a long history of doing things to women that Harvey Weinstein also did. Harvey was probably more prolific because he had better access. His business practices have always been to screw his counterparties. So he had lawyers such as Cohen. Even attacks his people that he once praised - once they are also used up or tell him truths.

He was never an honest businessman or safe among women. He did not change. He has always been that way. He could even shoot someone on Fifth Ave - just like any other Mafia Don.

Understand what has changed in the Republican party. A massive misinformation machine exists. See the example of Eric Cantor who should have won his reelection by 30 point. And then this massive Limbaugh, Fox, Hannity, Breitbart. Engles misinformation (propaganda) machine targeted him.
sexobon • Oct 27, 2019 9:34 am
tw;1040408 wrote:
Well this is a revelation. ...
For his next trick, tw will come down from on high and give us ten commandments.
tw • Oct 27, 2019 1:10 pm
sexobon;1040447 wrote:
For his next trick, tw will come down from on high and give us ten commandments.

Already in the mail
Griff • Dec 4, 2019 3:39 pm
Okay so now Republicans support the Imperial Presidency and the Democrats oppose the Imperial Presidency. Interesting times.
Happy Monkey • Dec 4, 2019 7:15 pm
The strong unitary executive theory was first explicitly mentioned by a sitting President by Reagan, and it defined GW Bush's Presidency, and simultaneously GW Bush's presidency solidified the definition of it - it was a particular pet theory of Cheney, John Yoo, and Scalia. I don't think anything has switched.
Griff • Dec 5, 2019 7:24 am
Art Schlesinger wrote the book in 1973.
Flint • Dec 5, 2019 1:24 pm
The book was about Nixon :lol:
Griff • Dec 5, 2019 9:27 pm
and LBJ and Truman and Washington


The Imperial Presidency, by Arthur M. Schlesinger Jr., is a book published in 1973 by Houghton Mifflin. This book details the history of the Presidency of the United States from its conception by the Founding Fathers through the latter half of the 20th century. The author wrote the book out of two concerns: first, that the US Presidency was out of control and second, that the Presidency had exceeded its constitutional limits.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Imperial_Presidency
Urbane Guerrilla • Dec 8, 2019 1:27 am
Clodfobble;1040404 wrote:
You're insane. Trump is a misogynist, racist, narcissistic old man who's lost touch with reality both because of his wealth and his declining cognition.


Demonstrably false on three points, Fobble. (Though all points are very heavily, monomaniacally advertised by the nakedly prejudiced and evilly partisan.)

Misogyny? Last I heard, Trump's empire employs, and evidently quite pays, more women than men -- are they fleeing his employ? An honest reading of the Access Hollywood recording shows it is much less misogyny than it is a remark on the sheer power of celebrity -- and that is not a one-sex thing. You will not get an honest reading from Trump's prejudiced persecutors. They're not in it for the honesty. Have you recently seen any pink pussy hats in public?

Racist? Not at all, except in the unethical minds of the vilely prejudiced, so warped as to hardly deserve the name American. It is never, and cannot become, racist to bar access to hostiles from foreign parts, nor is it so to make barriers against people trying their hearts out to, well, downright break in from south of the border. What we're at now *does* have the disadvantage of not striking at the root problems in Central America those people are flying from -- you feel for 'em in their sufferings, but... well, we're not killing the cartels and hanging the corrupt, are we? Without striking the root, we shall not solve the problem up here.

Narcissism doesn't add up to an unforgiveable thing either. The guy's a billionaire tycoon, FFS. Do you really think successful tycoons are going to be as detached as elderly Buddhist monks? What is this? I see no sense.

Old? Realest thing you said. Experienced would be another word -- Ronnie Reagan used it, to effect. All in all, things came out better than some people would credit Ronnie for. Even Trump's unfortunate and essentially anti-American socialist predecessor had a couple bright spots to his tenure -- that's maybe for another (and brief) post.

Declining cognition? Trump's persecutors, actuated by prejudice only and therefore made vile, devoutly hope for it, but he's been medically proven sharp as a tack, pace yourself. He might have good genetics.

He knows the true value of our politicoes, and we do too. It's not as great as they tell us it is. Trump sees pols as essentially a line-item expense in a business model -- unsurprising in a New York real estate billionaire. One who is not enriching himself by the Presidency: Trump's net worth has declined, for reasons well publicized, by 1.2 billion since 2016. He's got it to lose, but the sacrifice answering the country's call is appreciable.

The Trump personal era will span a maximum of eight years. As did those of Obama and Clinton. Thus this Republic allocates spans of power. I consider that the free Republic now needs forty thousand Trumps, greater or lesser, within the Beltway to continue shrinking the Federal footprint and enhance thereby all of the American economy; you know what good effects a good American economy has on that of the world. At least, you should. When the world's making a living, everything else pretty much falls into place. We also want forty million Trumps spread over the American landscape to offset the antilibertarian faction that has grown to infect us. The wannabe oligarchs must fall and be ashes and dust. That way, we get to live. And to love.
Clodfobble • Dec 8, 2019 8:57 am
Cool, cool. How many kids do I have? What do I do for a living? What do you do for a living?
Urbane Guerrilla • Dec 8, 2019 3:59 pm
I sell expensive knives, doing my work in people's kitchens.
That's how I increase the wealth around me -- I sell a knife to make somebody's life that much better. They pay me a commission to sell the knife, but the customer gets to have the knife. They last; people have been known to will their Cutco to a particular heir.
xoxoxoBruce • Dec 8, 2019 7:15 pm
And no remorse over people who bleed to death. Image





Just kidding.
tw • Dec 8, 2019 7:51 pm
You forget what Putin, Kim, Erdogan, and Xi use to so easily manipulate him. His ego.

He left the NATO Summit early like a hurt child because American allies made fun of him. He could not even have enough respect for other waiting leaders. Instead he spend 40 minutes with reporters promoting himself. That is his ego.

The Don routinely insults people. And cannot withstand anything as gentle as criticism even about his massive disrespect for all other NATO leaders - who are suppose to be America's closest allies. That was his ego rather than his adult brain; wasting time in a press conference while 28 other leaders waited for him. That is his ego running home in a huff because other allies criticized him - and rightly so.

Canadian Justin Trudeau, UK's Boris Johnson, France's Emmanuel Macron, Netherlands's Mark Rutte and Princess Anne made fun of a guy whose power and support only comes from constantly demeaning others. It was only chiding. He can dish it out is buckets. And cannot even withstand a teaspoon in return.

Meanwhile Kim is testing long range missiles again because Trump will not do anything. And said that was OK. A brain dead president has no strategy - other than to protect his ego and wealth. And actually said all that illegal testing is acceptable for any nation.

Kim is probably building nuclear weapons. The Don will not even answer that question. American foes and adversaries are the good guys. They praise his ego. American allies do not.

The Don promised trade deals with China last October. Anyone who is informed also know even China did not know what he was talking about back then. The Don is making so many bogus demands that trade talks, months overdue, may be on the verge of collapse. At the start of December, he said a deal was almost done. As usual and because of his ego, again, he lied. He now says that deal might happen after November 2020. IOW he admits there will be no deal.

His lies are constant. And in the first day of that NATO Summit, reality hit. NATO leaders said or implied they cannot trust anything that the egotist says.

So yes, he has long been a misogynist, racist, and narcissist. But he did not lose touch with reality. He never had to. His entire history is defined by his own statements. He could murder someone on Fifth Ave and still get elected. Because what he does is loved by people such as KKK, Nazis, and White Supremacists. That is his reality.

Whether a child or a dictator, then wag the dog. He now imposed tariffs on Argentinian and Brazilian steel and aluminum. What was never a problem suddenly is. Turning more friends into adversaries only for personal gain. Which is what impeachment is about. More American friends he disparages so that he will look good to the least educated - extremists. Suddenly right wing extremists are now calling those nations foes. They never were until Trump needed to invent new evil to boost his popularity.

Another American industry has been punished to make a dumb Don popular. We know tariffs only do bad things to business. The American small farm Apple industry is a latest victim.

A scumbag president walked into that NATO Conference praising himself. He took credit for America's reduction of money to NATO - intentionally ignoring that the deal had been negotiated by Obama years ago. No problem. He is preaching to people too brainwashed to learn facts. He said it is true. That proves it must be.

That first day, almost every other NATO leader was criticizing him. French President Emmanuel Macron accurately accused him of lying about America doing a defeat of ISIS. Reality, ISIS still have some 18,000 soldiers, that war is still ongoing, and the fighting was being done by American allies, such as the Kurds. Who he now surrendered to be ethnically cleansed.

"We have captured 100% of the caliphate." Also a lie as anyone who is informed clearly knows. Meanwhile we did not do the fighting. Does not matter to an egotists who is popular because he lies.

Macron also said, "We find ourselves for the first time with an American president who doesn't share our idea of the European project, and American policy is diverging from this project." When it comes to brain dead, well how does a misogynist, racist, and narcissist do any thinking when every decision comes from his ego? Erdogan literally played on that so that America would surrender the Kurds in Syria. Brain dead - except in his ego.

Boris Johnson, in blunt terms, ordered Trump to stay out of UK politics. Trump has no ethics. It explains his entrenched extremist support. Ethics would get in the way of his ego. And result in less extremist support. Trump's open endorsements of Johnson is threatening Johnson in UK polls. Since two-thirds of Brits have that much contempt for The Don. Johnson even refused to shake hands or have his picture taken with The Don. Doing whatever he can to distance himself from that egotist.

Johnson was careful to not be photographed with The Don. He did not even greet Trump and Melania at the door when they arrived at 10 Downing Street.

George Conway, Kellyanne Conway's husband, described that first day in a tweet. Posting "you are the laughingstock of the planet. The world thinks you are an incompetent, ignorant, dumb, deranged buffoon—and they are right. And you prove it to them every day."

Who is next on a list to be fired. That tweet attacks the only thing that matters. His ego.

NATO nations decided to extend NATO secretary-general Jens Stoltenberg's term by two more years. Reasons clearly stated by anonymous NATO officials: Trump. They worry that any change to its leadership in 2020 would mean Trump would subvert NATO leadership. All across NATO, Trump is a greatest concern. All but tried to negotiate Ukraine into Russian hands. Especially since he recently handed to Russia major victories in the Middle East. Russia has clearly replaced America as a major broker - now that Trump surrendered there and sold out key allies.

More brain dead comments at the NATO conference. When asked about US-Russia relationships, he said, "I think it's a good thing to get along with Russia. I go to big stadiums and people like it." When did Russia become a stadium? Why is his popularity relevant to international relations? Ego.

When asked if he supported ongoing protests in Iran, he said he did not want to comment. Then said "No." And then said that he did, in fact, support the protesters. I guess he was looking for some way to promote himself and could not find it.

For some reason, in a meeting with Trudeau, Trump called Committee Chairman Adam Schiff "A maniac. I think Adam Schiff is a deranged human being. I think he grew up with a complex for lots of reasons that are obvious." Guess what was more important than NATO or American relations with Canada.

Meanwhile, who is now threatening to withhold aid to Lebanon. Just another victory for his close friend Vladimir Putin.

Fundamental to NATO is Article 5. It states that if any member of NATO is attacked, then all of NATO will rush to defend that country. No American President has ever contradicted or even questioned Article 5 - until The Don. He said, Article 5 was merely a "question." Then said he was going to discuss that question in the NATO meeting. Another victory for Putin against those evil American allies. And plays right into Erdogan comments. Turkey might not contribute to the defense of Baltic States should his new friend, Russia, attack them. Article 5 is fundamental to everything NATO stands for. So Trump wants to change it.

It was a bad week for NATO. Much of what was decided was to be put off until 2020. For one obvious reason. The Don's ego is considered a serious threat to NATO.

Only extremists would deny all this.

Meanwhile even American White House advisor's jaws reportedly dropped to the floor when The Don said a next NATO meeting would be at Camp David. Why? He ego was so contained that, like a hurt child, he took his 747 and ran home in a huff one day early.

Cloddfobble, anything less than blunt targeted honestly about the scumbag is support for The Don. You were not specific enough. Please be concise in your every comment about this threat to America. And the just as dangerous supporters in The Cellar. Yes, he is a misogynist, racist, and narcissist, braggart, unreliable, untrusted by allies, self centered egotist, surrenders American interests for his own personal gain and ego, violated Article II Section 1 of the US Constitution, and is maybe mentally deranged (based upon definitions in DSM5).

It was a bad week for NATO. The adult child went running home early because others laughed at him.
sexobon • Dec 8, 2019 8:40 pm
Yet, despite all that, Ivanka is still looking good which will carry the dirty old man vote in the Electoral College and give The Donald another 4 years.
Griff • Dec 9, 2019 7:02 am
Re-election seems more likely every day.
fargon • Dec 9, 2019 8:10 am
I have called every Presidential election since Johnson beat Goldwater when I was in the second grade. And I see four or more years of trump.
I'm Scared.
xoxoxoBruce • Dec 9, 2019 9:25 am
You guys seem to have forgotten Trump lost the popular vote, winning only because of playing the electoral college. It wouldn't take all that many votes to switch, or just show the fuck up at the polls this time, to bounce him out.
Undertoad • Dec 9, 2019 9:58 am
fargon;1042786 wrote:
I'm Scared.


Get a dog.
Griff • Dec 9, 2019 10:23 am
He’s still losing rural PA.
fargon • Dec 9, 2019 10:33 am
Undertoad;1042788 wrote:
Get a dog.


I got two Cats is that worth a dog.
Undertoad • Dec 9, 2019 10:35 am
Are you still scared?
fargon • Dec 9, 2019 11:03 am
See my signature, there is only two things that scare me my Wife , and the government.
henry quirk • Dec 9, 2019 11:40 am
fargon wrote:
I see four or more years of trump. I'm Scared.


What has orange man done in his first four years that has you a'fear'd of orange man havin' another four years?
tw • Dec 9, 2019 11:41 am
xoxoxoBruce;1042787 wrote:
You guys seem to have forgotten Trump lost the popular vote, winning only because of playing the electoral college. It wouldn't take all that many votes to switch, or just show the fuck up at the polls this time, to bounce him out.

And that is the problem as demonstrated by a 2018 elections. Moderates do not vote. So Democrats only obtained a tiny increase.

Every Republican I know who has never (or will not admit to) voted for anything but Republicans, all, voted against Trump. Does not matter. Something like 90% of extremists do vote. So anyone who does not vote, therefore, let's extremists vote for them.

I see no reason why Trump will lose in 2020. Numbers such as in 2018 say he will remain in office. Something extraordinary must happen (ie Democrats find a moderate who can match Trump insult for insult) for Trump to lose. None currently demonstrate that ability or are moderates.
henry quirk • Dec 9, 2019 11:43 am
xoxoxoBruce wrote:
You guys seem to have forgotten Trump lost the popular vote


I predict orange man will take the popular vote in '20.
Griff • Dec 9, 2019 1:59 pm
tw;1042799 wrote:
Something extraordinary must happen (ie Democrats find a moderate who can match Trump insult for insult) for Trump to lose. None currently demonstrate that ability or are moderates.


Insulting trolls is a fools errand. Find someone who excites moderates and progressives alike
tw • Dec 9, 2019 6:08 pm
Griff;1042805 wrote:
Insulting trolls is a fools errand. Find someone who excites moderates and progressives alike

Unfortunately, the most excited voters get excited by insults.

I recall a writer discussing how he wrote jokes that The Don could use at a roast. The Don changed every joke to an insult.

The writer noted that crowd behind Trump. With each insult, would strongly laugh. Insults, to them, was humor.

Unfortunately, cerebral does not work with a majority of people. For the same reason Saddam had WMDs. The emotion, fear, and hate inspired and directed at Saddam was what most all heard. They did not hear the so many facts and numbers (cerebral logic) that accurately define it a myth.

And that is a target audience. Does not matter how good that Democratic nominee is. He must learn to deal with what a majority hear. The guy who insults best is always better respected by so many less cerebral voters. If their guy's insults are accurately challenged (parried), then they do not get so excited.

If the insults are not successfully challenged, then the power of those insults gets amplified by people such as Limbaugth and Hannity.

One expert at this was Reagan. He could insult back and still look fatherly. He was expert at insulting without the associated negative aspects. (ie "There he goes again.") Biden cannot do that. He has always been too nice a guy.
xoxoxoBruce • Dec 9, 2019 11:54 pm
tw;1042826 wrote:

For the same reason Saddam had WMDs. The emotion, fear, and hate inspired and directed at Saddam was what most all heard. They did not hear the so many facts and numbers (cerebral logic) that accurately define it a myth.

I think what the majority heard was the Prez is doing something for some reason like he's supposed to do.
He has the inside poop and gets paid to handle this shit so I'm more concerned with getting the lawn mowed before the BBQ this weekend.
sexobon • Dec 24, 2019 11:13 am
The good news is: how many military personnel we have abroad and where they're operating is being reassessed. The bad news is: it doesn't look like we're going to end any wars, only disengage from some low intensity conflicts. Below is a brief overview. The linked article points out concerns by theater of operations, far reaching ramifications, and mentions countries we're operating in, some of which may not readily come to mind.

[SIZE="3"]Pentagon Eyes Africa Drawdown as First Step in Global Troop Shift[/SIZE]

WASHINGTON — Defense Secretary Mark T. Esper is weighing proposals for a major reduction — or even a complete pullout — of American forces from West Africa as the first phase of reviewing global deployments that could reshuffle thousands of troops around the world, according to officials familiar with internal deliberations. …

... The deliberations stem from a push to reduce post-9/11 missions battling terrorist groups, and instead to refocus Pentagon priorities on confronting so-called Great Powers like Russia and China. ...

… With an initial decision about Africa expected in January, the plans are sure to draw criticism from lawmakers, allies and military officials, and could eventually affect most global missions in some way. About 200,000 American forces are currently stationed abroad, similar to the force posture when President Trump took office with a promise to close out the nation’s “endless wars.” …

… Officials say the overhaul of Africa deployments will be followed by one in Latin America, and that drawdowns will happen in Iraq and Afghanistan, as has been expected.

The initiative reflects what has become the defining priority for Mr. Esper: moving away from 18 years of counterterrorism deployments in places troubled by militancy and insurgency where thousands of American troops cycle through in an attempt to maintain minimal stability but without much prospect of definitive solutions. …

… Mr. Esper’s team has questioned the value of those efforts and wants to scale back missions to counter militants who lack the demonstrated ability and intent to attack the United States on its own soil, the officials said. None of the terrorist groups operating in West Africa are said to meet this heightened assessment standard. ...
Griff • Dec 24, 2019 2:15 pm
We've got some very real problems figuring out why we fight and how to leave.The Afghanistan Papers have been quite a reminder of how fucked we are...
Undertoad • Feb 4, 2020 9:39 am
when your favorite candidate isn't doing so well there

Image
Luce • Feb 4, 2020 9:47 am
Even funnier:


Democrats have no Iowa caucus results, blame ‘coding issue’
Happy Monkey • Feb 4, 2020 5:50 pm
Not gonna investigate past the headlines, but something can be important AND not good. Heck, it can be important because it's not good.
henry quirk • Feb 4, 2020 7:27 pm
Anything to blunt Bernie.
Griff • Feb 5, 2020 7:18 am
I didn't watch but I heard Trump's taken care of pre-existing conditions and the GOP cheered. Seems somehow familiar but opposite.

Go Team.
Griff • Apr 10, 2020 1:54 pm
https://news.yahoo.com/gavin-newsom-declares-california-nation-160012325.html?soc_src=community&soc_trk=fb

John C. Calhoun, who used the theory of states’ rights to defend the institution of slavery, is not generally a philosophical lodestar for liberal Democrats such as Newsom. But if Republicans (or foreign friends) succeed in sabotaging democracy in November, Calhoun’s theory of nullification, which posited that states have the power to defy federal law, could be ripe for a comeback on the left coast. With the heirs of the Confederacy now reigning in Washington, turnabout might be very fair play.
BigV • Apr 15, 2020 12:02 pm
Oh! Right, right, that Washington.
xoxoxoBruce • Apr 15, 2020 2:58 pm
The Washington...
Urbane Guerrilla • Apr 19, 2020 7:48 pm
Griff;1050609 wrote:
https://news.yahoo.com/gavin-newsom-declares-california-nation-160012325.html?soc_src=community&soc_trk=fb

John C. Calhoun, who used the theory of states’ rights . . .With the heirs of the Confederacy now reigning in Washington, turnabout might be very fair play.

No wonder a derangement syndrome is much mentioned in certain quarters. How preposterous is it a born and bred New Yorker is some heir to the Confederacy?

I don't believe this guff.
BigV • Apr 20, 2020 12:19 am
He's a a Florida Man now. You've heard of Florida Man, haven't you? Well, there's a new poster child in town.

Buckle up.
Urbane Guerrilla • Apr 21, 2020 1:55 am
I'm just waiting for Sean Hannity to move thataway. Says he's going to. For tax reasons.
Griff • Apr 21, 2020 8:23 am
Urbane Guerrilla;1051185 wrote:
No wonder a derangement syndrome is much mentioned in certain quarters. How preposterous is it a born and bred New Yorker is some heir to the Confederacy?

I don't believe this guff.




Actually Secession was a Northern idea originally. Check out The Hartford Convention. Quick, everyone change positions.
Urbane Guerrilla • Apr 21, 2020 1:41 pm
I don't see a lot of secessionist traction there -- actual secessions being forty-five years into the future from 1814.

The New England states did not support the war. They feared a land invasion and refused to place their militias under federal control. The Hartford Convention resulted in a declaration calling on the Federal Government to protect New England and to supply financial aid to New England's badly battered trade economy.


Which doesn't sound like a secessionist idea for anybody. Note also the content in
connecticuthistory.org. New England's shipping industry had taken a hammering and they were depressed.

And by the date it was read into the Congressional Record, the War of 1812 had been over for two weeks with the Treaty of Ghent, and was moot.