DIY Deck
I'm rebuilding the deck at Twil's house.
There had been a deck installed many years ago, set directly on the concrete patio. The patio was (and is) covered by a roof for the first two-thirds closest to the house. The furthest third of the deck was open to the sky (and the trees). No walls, only the house on one side of the rectangle.
We had a lot of good times on the deck, it's a very well used and well loved extension of our living space. We'd eat and entertain out here, work on not-indoor-projects out here; it is lovely and useful.
Well, the deck itself wasn't very lovely. The orginal deck was in very shabby shape. You can see here the extent of the coverage the deck has under the flat corrugated plastic covering.
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You can also see how much more weather-beaten the exposed section was. There were pieces that had rotted away and laurel volunteers growing up through the vacancies. Much of this area was unsafe to walk on and all of it was unsightly and unused. It was time for it to go.
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Since I had no intention of preserving it, I decided to cut it up into manhandleable-sized pieces and manhandle them into the truck and out to the dump. Let the sawdust begin!
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A double chunk, a mess. Careful where you kick those boards out of the way!
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Half a truckload, half a deck gone.
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Here's a big hunk, you can see how well built it is. It was in the exposed area and it's sodden and heavy. Very fucking heavy--it tipped over a little bit and broke my taillight.
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Bit by bit I moved the deck to the truck.
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One last island of deck left anchored to a critical support.
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This section required a more surgical approach, so I got out my tree surgeon tools.
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Freed!
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Gone!
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Found it.
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Like a lot of projects, well, my projects at least, there are changes to the scope of the project that were not anticipated at the start of the project. Sometimes I'm suprised by what I find when I reveal some suspected but hidden fault, a leak, a crack, etc. This project had a lot of surprises.
Here we can see the extent of the first big surprise.
Now that the deck is gone and the patio is swept clean it's clear that the surface is uneven.
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I want the finished deck to be level. Drainage should happen under the deck, so I don't need a big slope on the deck boards. But I want it to be solid, strong, level underneath. This "foundation" is not a good place to start. I decided to think on it while I undertook my first big scope change.
Do you see how flat the roof is, I mean, used to be? In fact, right at the drip line, where the water drains away from the house directly onto the deck, that's where the deck began to get the wettest. What a dumb idea to drain the roof onto the deck. Why not a gutter and a downspout? Why not shed the water and the tree leaves and twigs away from the deck entirely? Well, let's do that. Surprise, more demolition.
Time to tear the roof off the sucker!
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While we're going to the dump, why don't we just demolish those brick planter boxes? Sure!
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This represents something of a turning point, demolition is done, let's start building stuff! First of all, let's get some wood. And a taillight.
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We loved the light let in by the corrugated polycarbonate roof panels, we wanted to keep that part of the design, though with new panels since the old ones are in the garbage. But that flat roof, ugh. I decided to raise the roof. That meant new roof trusses. Since I did not want to reengineer the structure holding the roof up, I had to think about where the load on the trusses would be and where the trusses themselves would bear. I decided to use scissors trusses, a variety of vaulted trusses. I chose these since I knew I could not support them in the middle of the span. I also decided to make them myself.
I spent a *lot* of time researching the designs, watched a hundred videos on their construction, learned a lot, and eyeballed much of the process.
The design and construction of these trusses took a lot of time and energy. Partly because of my ignorance, partly because I was making up things as I went, and partly because they're bigger than any workspace I had, except right there on the patio. Here are the pics to prove it happened.
Measure
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Cut
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Layout (see how big it is? 22 feet across.)
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Tack the pieces together and add the next member
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Dry fit some more members
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See where they need to be trimmed, mark a cut line
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Repeat the process until all the pieces are next to each other
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Cut the pieces using the marks you traced
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The cut's a little wobbly there...
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It's about a two foot cut across a 3 1/2 inch width, and not much wood to support the shoe of the saw
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I used the offcut as a wedge between the two chords, more surface area in the joint overall. Also note that my work area is a couple feet beyond the edge of the patio.
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I was working with not perfectly flat boards on a not nearly flat work surface, the alignment was ... casual util I enforced it with a clamp. Once frozen in position with the clamp, I could connect them permanently with a gusset. Which could only mean more
Clamp, layout, measure, cut, repeat for all joints
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Eventually I got something I could tip up and would stand on its own. Here you can see all the members that comprise the truss.
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Once I knew how it would come together, I got the idea that a saw guide could be screwed to the workpiece to help me make a straight(er) cut.
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Now I had a repeatable process, I worked past sundown to finish enough components for all five trusses
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On the next set of cuts I tried a different strategy. I put two boards on top of each other and set my cut depth to the thickness of the board plus a small amount. This left a "line" to cut along for the next pair of boards. This particular cut wasn't as easy to use a saw guide and was much shorter to let me more easily made freehand.
There were ten trusses, I worked on the last four as a group, some boards had two cuts, so this cut had to be repeated sixteen times. Having a repeatable process helped me be more consistent.
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More posts, more blocks, more wedges, more trusses.
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Measure, measure, measure, cut--gussets.
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Five gussets on each side of each truss, glued and nailed in place. That's over a gallon of glue and over twenty-five pounds of nails.
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This is a gusset at the end, but it shows the nails prominently.
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Hammered in but not hammered down.
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I need to flip them over to get to the other side, here it is mid flip.
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I made five of these, they took up a lot of space, heavy and awkward to deal with.
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The trusses rested on beams that extended perpendicularly from the house to the end of the roof. And by beam I mean one 2x4, twelve feet long. I decided to sister a 2x6, twelve feet long, to the original beam. I had to reconfigure a joist hangar to attach one end to the ledger board on the house (after and before)
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This is where I attached it.
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Then then I slotted in one end of the sister-beam.
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And I was halfway there. Well, a quarter of the way, since I had to do the same on the other side.
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I got it connected on both ends, nailed it to the original along the length, liberally. You can see that they're not level with each other where I'll need to put a top plate for the trusses to rest on.
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I decided to thin down the original (higher) board. I made a number of relief cuts and then knocked out the chunks.
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I applied this technique all along the beam where ever it was higher.
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The board on top perpendicular to the beam will become the top plate for this beam.
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Your doggo is so skinny. Give that girl some treats!
Then topped it with the top plate, and nailed that one down too.
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The other side wasn't nearly as misaligned.
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Top plate (number two) installed.
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Surprise, more nails. Nails through the top plate into both the original beam and the sister-beam.
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Here you can see how the old beam and the new beam were halfway supported by the original post. I replaced this post and all the other two original posts and added two new posts.
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I attached a giant bracket to the top of the new 4x4 pressure treated post.
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I jacked up the adjoining beam
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This relieved the weight enough for me to pry the post from the beam.
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I repeated the process for a post in the center of the beam, and you can see the wider board means the original narrower beam board doesn't bear on the bracket. So I made a couple of wedges and slid them in the bracket under the narrower beam, knocked them together until it was snug.
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I followed this same procedure with the beam across the deck, parallel to the house. This is a long span, 22 feet, so I used two boards, supporting the joint in the center.
In this picture you can see the two new posts.
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And here you can see the first of two reinforcing sister beams across the deck.
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When I got those super heavy duty brackets, I picked them up from the local Habitat for Humanity. I got them for five dollars each, the same bracket at the big box store was about fifty-five dollars. Jackpot! But as you can see, I should have gotten five not just four. This joint could use one but I only had this little sheet metal brace.
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Now you can see the second half of the long beam installed.
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The latticework and beams and posts are all in good shape row. It's time to put those scissors trusses up on the roof.
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This shot is a little out of sequence, one truss is already on top, but it give a good view of the frame of the old roof. All the new trusses are going up here. There are a couple boards laying flat on the roof as skids to move the truss toward the house. There are two board sticking up vertically in the back of the roof where I'll tip up the first truss. It will rest against these backstops to keep it vertical while I get the second truss onto the roof and braced to the first truss.
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You can also see that by now they've all been painted gray.
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The tips of the trusses rest on the top plates of the beams. To locate the trusses neatly on the top plates, a notch is cut, called a "bird's mouth".
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Kicking one end up
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then looking for this bit of overhanging top plate.
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I tried sliding them up these skids too, this was harder.
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Here you can see how I put a post next to the house to keep the truss from tipping over toward the house and when I got the second one up, I used a couple of braces with some cleats on them to hold it upright and the right distance from the previous one.
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The bird's mouth notch fit over the top plate.
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You can't see it in the previous picture but the truss is pressed up against a block like this against the ledger board.
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Now a block to be moved against the truss
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and locked in and nailed down. This was repeated for each truss.
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From underneath you can see the unpainted flat boards used as planks to walk on, the gray trusses, the white lattice. The little sections of wiggleboard would eventually be removed, I just didn't know it yet.
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Another shot showing the installed trusses and the perpendicular boards are called purlins. The purlins will directly support the corrugated roofing material.
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Shots of the roof being installed
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also some mostly vertical braces to secure the trusses.
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Now the remains of the fence on one side has to be removed
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fence gone
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and so is that wiggleboard.
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Lattice looks clean now, but needs painting. Look at the roof on the top of the purlins!
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All the roof is on now, and a tidy stack of lumber under shelter!
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Now I only have eight foot long 2x4s for the frame, I decided to make four squarish frames, put them in the corners leaving an empty cross-shaped space in the center.
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A super wide shot of the whole area with one frame laid down and three stacked upright.
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Another frame laid down with some supporting material underneath to make it solid underneath and level on the top
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And another corner frame laid down. I left one side open so it would fit around the pier block post base.
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Here's a look at an "arm" of the "cross" of unfilled space.
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This picture is a little out of sequence, we're clipping the corner off this square, just so it fits better into the flow of the deck. SonofV handling the Hackzall. I love that tool. The saw's awesome too! (j/k son, j/k)
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cut cut cut cut
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separated
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and the wound is covered. It looks better now, doesn't it? You can see all the frames in all the corners now.
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Cutting some pieces to fill in one of the empty spaces
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starting to dry fit the little rectangle
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they all fit, now let's build it
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and drop it in
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So let's talk about the concrete for a minute. There are plenty of cliches about the value of a good foundation. For cause. This foundation has some good points and some faults.
Pros
already in place
strong
waterproof
cheap
Cons
not level
difficult to remove
not level
quite high relative to the threshold of the door to the house
not level
not expandable
not level
I'm sure the balance of these attributes is obvious. This is a poor foundation. Poor maybe unfair. It is a foundation that will be difficult to work with and build on. Y'know, the important parts of a foundation.
I thought of tearing it up, moving it out, digging downward and laying a bed of gravel which could offer good drainage and a compacted solid level foundation. Upon which I could place pier blocks. Upon which I could place and level strong beams. Upon which I could easily place the frame. Upon which the deck boards could be laid. Ah, such a beautiful dream.
But the prospect of breaking up all that concrete and hauling it away, or using it as rubble... suffice to say we did not choose that way. It was easier (at that moment) to just build on it, after all the old deck was built on it. I have come to regret this decision.
The keen observer probably has noticed in some of the pictures pieces of wood underneath the frame. These are shims and blocks and spacers to support the 2x4s that comprise the frame joists.
A word here--the distance between the threshold of the doors to the house down to the surface of the concrete patio is about four inches. I don't have much height/depth to work with. This deck will basically be a floor--very thin.
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The concrete is strong, and there's no way I'm going to crush a 2x4 on edge, but it will sway and bow if I have it suspended between two (short) posts. And if I don't raise the bottom of the joist, I won't have a flat level surface to attach the deck boards to. Do you see my dilema?
This deck will be very thin, and variably so. *sigh* This part of the job will take a very long time, solidly supporting the joists in each part of each frame. I went through a few different versions of how best to accomplish this. I tried fitting the proper thickness of wood (well, really, everywhere this is the ultimate goal) but with different attempts to secure these little posts. Nails. Shims. Construction adhesive. Other blocks of wood.
I have finally settled on friction. The early efforts of this method involved me eyeballing the distance between the bottom of the joist and the concrete, cutting a section of 2x4 the right height/thickness, test fitting it, and if it was perfect, *WONDERFUL*. If it was really loose, maybe find another spot nearby to fit it into. If it was too tight by a lot, I'd have to stand up again and walk to the saw, grip the fragment and trim it a little. Walk back, kneel down, fit it in again.
I eventually learned the hard way that I could not rest on the frame while I did this, screwing up the distance and the level. I could not tap the block into place with a hammer, screwing up the level. I could not shim it firmly with wedges or shims, screwing up the level. It really just had to be finger snug. Scores of times. I started to say thousands, there aren't thousands of these blocks. It felt like it, and I made many more trips back and forth than there are actual blocks. Tedious as fuck. Regret.
What will keep those little blocks in place, you ask? You ask good questions. You will get your answers, stay tuned.
Back to the goddamn frames and blocks and knee pads and ibuprophen and sawdust and colorful language.
[COLOR="Red"]THIS [/COLOR]is what I'm talking about. The board across the gap between the two corner frames, come on. I can't put the deck boards on that!
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Here's the section built and dropped in but not blocked up.
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A closeup of version 1.0 of the leveling blocks. Secured with other blocks and boards and nails.
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Version 2.0, secured with construction adhesive. Both of these sections were really low, low enough to accommodate another whole 2x4 thickness plus another chunk plus some thinner pieces plus some wedge shims.
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Version 3.0, frickin frickshun. The little chunk of cement-board at the bottom center was my marker as I tried to remember where I'd just measured.
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Speaking of measuring, I eventually realized that this eyeballing method was hopeless, and I bought a caliper. It's not designed for this kind of setup, though it did an adequate job of indicating the distance from the concrete to the bottom of the board.
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Not leaning on the board, marker in place
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Carry the caliper to the board to be shortened, line up the end of the caliper with the end of the board, mark where the "upper" jaw hit the bottom of the board, make a mark.
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Extend the mark so I can see it under the saw.
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The mark
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The placement
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The cut
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The result
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One
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Two
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Three
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Times a thousand
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Time for another flashback. As I said, the old deck was old, but ... we used it. We were careful not to fall into any holes, we looked up at each other and not down at the ugly decrepeit deck. It was ok. But Twil decided she wanted a HOT TUB. Oh yeah. To get a hot tub, we needed a new deck. Which brings us to this picture.
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The hot tub will be going in this corner. A hot tub is super heavy so this part of the frame is getting some cross braces to strengthen it. You may notice it's floating in midair! Not really, I just raised it up so I can work on it without kneeling. I can't tell you how fucking tired of kneeling on the concrete I became. So I brought the work to me. Just... so high.
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I decided to work to align all the joists with at least one block, because otherwise I'd just be pushing each bay further out of whack. You can see I started on the side hear the center of the patio and worked toward the edge. Then I realized the trouble I was headed toward and put in a center line of blocks.
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Then I filled it in as I could easily reach. Spoiler--each of these intersections will be getting its own supporting block. Yay, more kneeling.
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All blocked in!
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All dropped in.
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It's not super obvious from here, but you can see the previous center section on the right side of the picture? It's been leveled and supported. The new corner section is just assembled and lying on the ground. My method was to make it, then level very precariously with blocks in corners and maybe a couple midspan, then attach it to the previous section with many nails. This corner section is much lower as you can see in the bottom center of the picture. It will get raised up then attached to the frame on the right. That gives me one solid side as a reference.
Like I said all those intersections get supporting blocks. I eventually caught a break when a family friend came over and we turned last round of these blocks into a two man job. He is young and limber and agile enough to get the measurment while standing, passes the caliper to me, I transfer the measurement, cut the board and hand him the caliper and the block, repeat, repeat, repeat.
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The last section of the open space is filled with a frame.
We measured and cut the pieces
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Then we dry fit all the pieces.
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We lifted up the joists and locked them all up with a crosspiece so we could nail one end, repeated on the other end.
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And dropped it into place. After dark. Still not blocked up.
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There were sections around the perimeter that still needed a little frame building. Because I needed to put them in around the posts, that left some parts unbuilt so they could fit. Now I made some boxes and nailed them to the existing frames which were solid and level.
111823
111931
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before
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after (reverse angle, next night, at night)
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Some places got extra reinforcement like more cross braces
before
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after
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This edge, which is the path to the side of the yard, lots of traffic here.
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How will I keep those friction fit blocks in place? I'll surround them with a bed of this.
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I figure I'll fill the frames with gravel, locking EVERYTHING in place. I'll screed it level and it will lend even more support between the supporting frame members. There are no pictures of this because my truck still has this first load of gravel in the bed.
Why is it still in the bed? Because I'm not done overengineering this frame. I thought, what will keep the gravel from leaking out under the edges of the frame? Luck? My good looks? Hahahahahaa! Um, no. This hardware cloth will though. Just enough to pin the bottom to the concrete and a couple staples into the wood, that the weight and jaggedness of the gravel will lock itself in place.
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I then noticed that the blocks on the edge of the frame would not have the benefit of being surrounded by gravel. What would keep them in place. I felt the vertical movement would be secured by gravity, and they're definitely not going to move inward toward the gravel, but out toward the yard? Yeah, that could happen. I was going to put a little steel strap on it just to tack it in place, but then Twil saved the day by suggesting that the skirt/frame around the edge of the deckboards be wider so as to cover the deckboards, all of that 2x4, and the top section of the blocks on the border of the frame. [SIZE="4"]EXCELLENT suggestion![/SIZE]
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There will be more pics to come. I took a bit of a construction break to compose the text and select the pictures for the story to this point. I've been thinking about you, my friends, throughout this project. Many times I wish I'd had the opportunity to consult with you as I worked through this ordeal. And it has been a labor of love, but still an ordeal. I started in April / May of 2017, just about the time I went to the hospital for trouble with my congestive heart failure. And in June 2017, I offered to help my unemployed friend replace the clutch in his only vehicle so he could search for a job. That's another thread, but it definitely took up a huge amount of time and energy after work when I could/should have been getting the deck done.
Anyhow, here's where we are now. The frame is 98% done. I only have a few places to install those screens. Then I can unload the gravel. I drive by the place where I get the gravel on my daily commute, I'll wind up getting a load the day after I empty the truck, maybe one a day (hahahaha, riiiiight).
Once the deckframe is packed with gravel, then the deckboards. I have lots of ideas on that phase of the work. More to come! I welcome your input so, don't be shy. Don't be mean, but .. don't be shy.
Your doggo is so skinny. Give that girl some treats!
Awww, thanks Clodfobble. You're right, Jack is super, super skinny. Was skinny, he died a few months ago, these are some of the last pictures we have of him trotting around doing dog work.
We loved him very much, I
absolutely promise you he was not deprived in any way of any food or love or attention.
[strike]Did you have to[/strike] Were you supposed to get a permit for this job?
Chisel off the mismatches in the concrete, fill the cracks, and astroturf. Walking, it would undulate like a real lawn. :lol:
This change in roof design will dump water off both sides instead of the back, isn't that where the foot traffic is?
Lots of stone to avoid pinning the blocks.
Man, that's a lot of work and expense... and you haven't even got the wind chimes up yet.
You Sir, are a glutton for punishment.
Or, this is what the motivation of putting you and your woman into a hot tub on the regular will do. :D
Permit will probably be required for the electrical work to bring 220 V out to the deck, probably will also bring a couple 120V accessory circuits..
I will do whatever grunt work is needed for the electrician.
Or, this is what the motivation of putting you and your woman into a hot tub on the regular will do. :D
This.
The change in roof design will shed the water to the sides. One place we walk under every day, and I already have a gutter below the eave and above our heads in that area. Pics of that later
Stone, blocks, pinning... Man I have spent a tremendous amount of time and thought on this issue.
I absolutely must have the frame solidly supported. If the blocks shift or slip out that would be bad under thousands of pounds of water and electricity. I could pin the block in place with a piece of sheet metal I guess.
The gravel is cheap though and not especially inconvenient to acquire. That truckfull cost 16 bucks. Haven't worked out how many trucks full I'll need though.
Plus I do really like the vertical support the gravel provides. Ffs I drive on it in the driveway. That's reassuring. Seems solid.
Thinking thinking thinking....
When I said pin them I meant an angle nail or straight down.
You might want concrete blocks directly under the tub, they're super heavy, as you know.
That stone may hold moisture but the concrete should at least help keep it from coming up from the ground.
Around the 500th photo of cutting the supporting blocks, I wondered if it would have been easier to just order a load of gravel, rake it out level, and build on top of that? And then I saw your picture of the gravel load. LOL.
That's a huge project! Lots of work, and I see SonOfV in some of the photos. Isn't he in NYC now? It takes forever to do projects in your spare time.
Looking good. I'll be interested to see the final product.
Awww, thanks Clodfobble. You're right, Jack is super, super skinny. Was skinny, he died a few months ago, these are some of the last pictures we have of him trotting around doing dog work.
We loved him very much, I absolutely promise you he was not deprived in any way of any food or love or attention.
Bummer. At least he was able to supervise some of the early work, make sure you did the job right! :thumbsup:
I will file this under; Go big or go home!
This is easy, cut down a tree, carve a frame, then buy the ugliest fabric you can find.
A fabric that will make your carving look good. ;)
Sorry man, put it in the wrong thread. :o
I can't delete it, have to get one of the people with the power.
JUST KIDDING!
In other news...
I filled a few of the bays in deck framing this weekend and I *love it *. It is absolutely solid. Bombproof.
The screens at the bottom do their job perfectly,.... Where I put them in, that is. I found one small spot, a inch across or less that I'd overlooked. Sure enough, gravel was leaking out. It'll work out OK though.
I managed to unload about 3/4 of the truck before I had a little accident with the wheelbarrow. I had a heavy full load and I crashed it, broke the handle, went ass over teakettlle into the grill and hurt my hands. I hyper extended my thumb enough to bruise my palm. Hurts like a bastard. Pics later.
I have a replacement handle set and hardware in the car and once I have the wheelbarrow repaired, I'll be able to unload a truckload in one night.
V,
What kind (species) of wood is that? you're laying it right on the concrete. I'm skeert.
why not say fuck the concrete, dig a few footers and put posts up and hang it like a normal deck?
The wood is I don't know, probably fir or pine or hemlock, but it's rated for ground contact, Copper Azole pressure treated.
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The superstructure is just regular premium 2x4 material, picking the straightest each time I went shopping.
As for digging and posts and footers.. good question.
The short answer is I could only have the top of the deck about 3-6 inches above the height of the concrete. Otherwise I'd have to step down from the deck to get into the house. I didn't have room to build a deck that "thick".
Here's the post with a longer explanation and a picture for reference.And here's a post with a better view of the step in front of the door to the house. It's a chunk that's almost level with the threshold of the door to the house. At the very beginning of this project, I thought about taking out all the concrete, digging down, laying some gravel and making room for piers and posts and beams like you describe. Then the prospect of taking out all that concrete made me achy and tired. Noooope. Plan B was born, and you're lookin at it.
Ok, some updates:
So, here is the first wheelbarrow load of gravel I dumped into the frame. I want to offer a word of thanks to xoB for helping me with the idea of the blocks as a ramp. I got the idea from his help on an old thread about my car ramps. Still, I hadn't forgotten. Thanks xoB!
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Anyhow, DUMP!
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More dumping.
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Lots more dumping and screeding and tamping. Looks good doesn't it?!
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This is what remained in the truck by the time I'd broken the wheelbarrow. You can see the bucket; it took about four buckets to make a wheelbarrow full. I don't remember exactly, but I might have loaded five buckets into the wheelbarrow--not sure--might have just been tired and frustrated. That ramp, ingenious though it may be, is not a smooth run up to the top of the frame.
No pictures of the crash or the cursing. The wreck of the wheelbarrow is on the side yard, waiting the installation of the already purchased replacement parts.
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This bay shows the little patches of hardware cloth I tacked to the inside of the frames to hold the gravel inside the frame. I feel gratified that my intuition made real performed so well. It does exactly what I intended.
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So here is another shot at a different section (and a wider shot of the same location) that shows how well the wire mesh works. When it's installed, that is. The little section on the left I'd overlooked an it's about an inch wide, I didn't see it from the inside, didn't cover it, and look, it leaks. I think once the gravel is tamped solid and locks in place the leak will stop. This sharp edged gravel does lock in very, very nicely.
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Ok, a couple pics that are not strictly images of the construction.
This hurts.
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This is a sketch I used to try to figure out if 8 ft boards will suffice across the width of the deck.
Turns out, math says it will. Yay!
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No pics tonight, you're welcome.
What's making me happy tonight?
I installed the first seventeen deck boards tonight.
I just finished, good night now.
oooo nice bruise
heh, thanks. That's a little reminder from the crash of the wheelbarrow. The wheelbarrow was a write-off, I have a new one already. The right hand was repaired and is back in regular service.
As for tonight, I'm still installing deckboards. I'm really, really stoked. I'm having another episode of moving my construction materials out of my work area to install the same materials. It's raining now, but not cold, so I'm working working working. The more deck boards I install the fewer I have to keep moving around. And the next batch will have clean dry DECK to rest on while I install them one by one in the uncovered part of the deck.
I'm only here because I came in to plug in some rechargable electronics I use out on the deck for entertainment while I work.
Anyhow, more pics later, after the boards are installed!!
eleven and a half more boards installed.
good night. I have to be out of the house in seven hours.
11 and a half?:eyebrow:
Ain't that twelve boards, Precious?
Well Gollum, I'll tell ya.
I got eleven full length boards installed and the next board required some cutting. Specifically, I had to notch it to fit in under a post. I *did* notch it, but not quite enough. I needed to enlarge the notch, but by that time I was out of patience, energy, daylight, and gumption.
Half a board it is.
The following night only ten and a half boards, then Friday night, none.. I'd burned my candle all the way down. Saturday was a daylight working day but lots of rain, so I got stuff done, but minimal boards installed. I did buy another fifty or so.
Those all had to be unloaded and trimmed to length and stacked.
Today's work is measured in half decks.
I have installed boards across half the deck.
Pics later.
Well Gollum, I'll tell ya.
:D
Half-a-board it is, then!
Daylight, clear skies...means motive and opportunity....
I'll be out on the deck.
TTYL
Well, that update from a week ago turned out to be optimistic.
This weekend I have done what I'd intended to do last weekend. All the full length boards have been installed. All that's left, decking-wise, are partial boards, installed, measured, uninstalled, cut, reinstalled, rinse, repeat. There are four triangular sections left to fill in. Then lots of boards to trim flush at the edges of the deck. Then a skirt of sorts to hide most of the framing and to corral the spacer blocks at the outermost edges. Then a picture frame wrap around the edges of the deck boards, and a seam of silicone caulk between the end grain of the deck boards and the picture frame wrapper to keep the end grain from staying wet when it rains.
Then..
Scrubbing with TSP and a stiff brush, as much air drying as I can get, then a coat of Penofin tinted translucent stain.
quick update.
I have daylight and clear skies. Out to the deck I go. It *is* cold though.
How cold is it? It's 33 here.
Yeah, winter has shown up here as well. How'd you make out?
Hi guys.
I wanted to answer Griff's question with a couple pictures and realized I am way, way behind in my workflow maintaining the continuity of the pictures. So no pictures, sorry.
The answer is that I have all the deck boards installed and about two out of three sides trimmed, one side out of three still wild. I started on the wrong side, wound up realizing I'd be sawing backwards to progress, stopped, moved to the other side of the deck and began again now each cut leads forward to the other. Basically I'm sawing around the perimeter of the deck in a counterclockwise fashion. Before I would saw right to left, then resetup the guide board behind me... ugh. Wrong!
Ran out of daylight, Twil said she was ready for dinner and I leapt at the chance to call it a night.
There will be pics, there *are* pics, but I'm still downloading them from the cloud to the computer for editing and organization and resizing, etc. etc. And captioning. There is a story here, and I want to tell it.
Work always.
Though, it's a little misleading to just flatly call it work. It is work, sure but it's also relaxation and investment and creation and recreation... So much more than merely work. I know you know...
And each session ends with, It's WHAT time??
It's fucking snowing.
*Not* the Polar Vortex--not a competition.
Still my dexterity with the hand tools is dropping faster than the temperature.
:cold:
Too easy to get hurt when it's cold.
When I was wiring the barn in the cold/dark, I bled a fair amount and didn't know it until I came inside...
People who haven't done wiring have no idea how much it tears up your fingers. Thick snipped wire is sharp.
Too easy to get hurt when it's cold.
Stuff breaks in the cold. Mechanical stuff...Bones...
That's true, I think cold stiff muscles contribute to that because they are less bouncy.
Thick snipped wire is sharp.
So is that little ground wire, and I was surprised how sharp the leading edge of that cold plastic insulation can be. It won't stab you through the heart like copper but don't use any Purell. :sniff:
I've pulled insulation from speaker wire outta my fingers a couple times.
It's fucking snowing.
*Not* the Polar Vortex--not a competition.
Still my dexterity with the hand tools is dropping faster than the temperature.
:cold:
Still cold
Still snow on the ground
New flurries
:cold:
Stained the deck today.
I didn't want to change the color of the wood, it's so beautiful just natural. But, I defer to Twil on the aesthetic decision. She wanted gray, the color the untreated cedar would become after years of unprotected exposure to the sun and elements. We found a color she liked in a product I liked and I applied it today. We'll give it at least 24 hours, then I'll take another panorama for you. And posterity.
You're gonna finish that deck if you're not careful...
Will require much furniture, shade, bbq,.. he never actually has to finish
Rainy and dark when I got home, so no panorama, sorry.
Breaking News
The electrician has just left the premises. He and I had a very thorough walkthrough of the site and a detailed plan to get power to the location of the hot tub was developed. A quote for this plan will be forthcoming this week.
Just put a large microwave transmitter in the window and that tub will be lobster cookin' hot in no time.
This thread.
Put some fucking pictures up or change the title to IIY.
Imagine it yourself
Here ya go.
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That's about right. Thanks
If you're not going to put pictures up, you need 1000 words when you bump it.
I'm back. *This time* I have the pics to prove it.
When we left our hero, he was breakin' rocks in the hot sun, makin' little ones out of big ones. No, that's not right. He was haulin' rocks in the cool pre-dawn light, makin' home ones out of store ones. Yeah, that's better.
I lined up before they were open (technically I'm in front of the BIGger truck to my left here). When they open the gate, I drive onto the scale in my little truck. I get weighed unloaded (click!), get loaded (ooooof!), get weighed again (pay the man!).
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That's all for tonight. I have many more to share, but not tonight.
Couldn't you have found prettier stone? Some cool bold colors, no pastels. Oh, and sparkly bits, quartz, gold flakes?
They'll have little truck-colored flakes when he gets it unloaded...
...whoop, wait. Bedliner. Ya get rock-colored rocks.
As you can see (GVWR), I was pushing it. Spoiler alert, truck lived.
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Up the ramp, dump.
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See how it fills in under the bottom edges of the frame?
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The last shot shows a couple deckboards (and a lot more gravel) laid in place as gangplanks, also to give me a visual frame of reference how the deck boards will look when I install them.
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before
(load, unload, rinse, repeat,
emphasis on repeat)
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*SNAP*
after
DONE!
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Plus a 360 degree panorama at the link.
https://panoraven.com/slider/V2gkGBNNoRHere we see a little fix I had to engineer. The nailing surface for most of these boards has included an edge of one of the frame members that would align under the ends of the deck boards. But not in this corner. This is where the hot tub will live, so we'll never see this again once its installed. But I didn't want to have a section of deckboards that didn't have their ends securely fastened to the frame.
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So, here are my additional boards, laid in place across the blocking in this section of the frame.
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They obviously sit up too high, so I cut some giant dadoes to set the nailing surface flush with the rest of the frame. I measured them in place and made a number of relief cuts to the proper depth with the circular saw, then knocked out the pieces with a hammer and a chisel.
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In the last picture you can see the new boards fitted, flush with the rest of the frame.
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I had to take the boards back out as I filled this last section with gravel as it was much easier to fill underneath them when they were not in the way. When I had it mostly filled and tamped down (see my sledgehammer in tamper mode?) I put the boards in again and filled it in the rest of the way. In the last picture you can see how the line where the ends of the deckboards carries along from one frame to the other.
I believe this will be a very, very solid base for the deck. Enough stonework. Let's install the deckboards!
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Now that I have a level, flat, solid surface upon which the deck boards can be affixed, let's get started. I knew I wanted cedar as the deck material. I love cedar. It's a dream to work with. Straight grained, easy to cut, rot resistant, fragrant, lovely grain patterns... yeah, I'm a fan. There are plenty of dimensions to choose from, we picked 5/4 x 6, mostly 8 footers. Back at the beginning of this process we saw the old deck had 2x4 material as the deck material. Super strong, but needed to not deflect across the very wide spans of the sleepers they laid as a "frame". This frame is a lot more substantial and has much shorter spans so a thinner deck board is sufficient. Now that I've been able to walk on it I can say it's solid--no deflection.
I wanted to have a different design from the standard straight boards, laid out straight--boring. Also, I knew there would be seams since getting boards that were long enough to span the whole deck, even across the short axis would be extra expensive. I have more time than money (boy does that come into play a lot...) so doing something beautiful and interesting with the shorter, less expensive material was the option I chose. There are a lot of stunning deck designs out there. I spent a lot of time looking at pictures of different decks and this basic design caught my eye, basketweave.
There are a number of advantages to this design. Minimal cuts, no miter cuts (though I did have to trim the ends at 45 degrees where the board extended beyond the edge of the deck), unusual, makes efficient use of 8 foot boards, plus I like it. Here we go.
I tested the pattern with a few fence boards and 2x6x12s I had laying around. Gorgeous, as you can see. This is the center of the deck, right in front of the doors. I like the image of having the arrow the boards create draw you out onto the deck and into the yard.
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So I bought a stack of real deck boards and pinned them in place.
I started with the centerline. That post is in the center of the roof, and close to the center of the deck. Close, only because some of the edges of the deck got built around the immovable, roof supporting posts. I wanted the center of the deckboards to line up with the center of the deck. On my first attempt I put the leading corner of the deckboard on the center frame member--bad idea. You can see I put extra frame members on each side of the center to provide nailing surfaces for the width of the deckboards. I spaced them apart by the thickness of the fence of my speedsquare, both the ends and the sides. I also have a nice digital angle finder I used to precisely line up the boards. Once lined up I used two single nails to layout the boards. I did several this way to find out how they would look and to see how they'd affect the outer sections. The "arrows" will all be parallel to each other, but if the first "arrow" isn't parallel to the centerline of the deck and the edges of the deck, by the time I'm out at the corners, one side will be long and one side will be short.
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This Western Red Cedar is beautiful wood. I didn't have room to in my truck or room to store all I'd need for the whole project, so I got a batch at a time. Mostly 8 footers and a few 10 footers (for those places where the deck was wider to accommodate the posts).
I stacked it up under the roof out of the rain. I chose the wood carefully, but there were still things to look out for. This grade of decking had only one side graded good, and you can see the edges of some of the boards are quite rough. Those are the down sides, obviously. And there were several places where the protective plastic covering the bunk of boards at the lumberyard where the staple was still in the board. I pulled out a couple, I sawed through a couple, I snagged my hand on a couple, then I decided to stop production and take them all out.
This Western Red Cedar is beautiful wood. I didn't have room to in my truck or room to store all I'd need for the whole project, so I got a batch at a time. Mostly 8 footers and a few 10 footers (for those places where the deck was wider to accommodate the posts).
I stacked it up under the roof out of the rain. I chose the wood carefully, but there were still things to look out for. This grade of decking had only one side graded good, and you can see the edges of some of the boards are quite rough. Those are the down sides, obviously. And there were several places where the protective plastic covering the bunk of boards at the lumberyard where the staple was still in the board. I pulled out a couple, I sawed through a couple, I snagged my hand on a couple, then I decided to stop production and take them all out.
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Not only did they have one rough side, they weren't all exactly 96" long. This mattered because of the geometry of the layout, a longer board meant the next rank started in a different position. The length of the board had a direct effect on the spacing of next rank of boards. So I setup an infeed table from one of the 10 footers and a stop block and cut them all to the same length. I tried to cut several at a time with mixed success. The saw motor bottomed out on the stack before the blade cut through the bottom board completely. It was a minor inconvenience.
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You can see in the wide shot how my workflow went from left to right, from stack to saw to stand.
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I told you this wood is beautiful. Let's just look at some wood, in some cases beautifully figured, such varied and subtle shades, interesting grain patterns... I love this stuff.
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I think that last one might a piece of dogwood.
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Back to getting laid. The deck, that is.
I started by carefully pinning the boards down with just two nails each,
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then in the next shot you can see I screwed them in with deck screws. I predrilled the holes before I drove the screws home. I took care to space them as evenly and carefully as I could, by the width of the fence of the speedsquare you see here, about an eighth of an inch. It was convenient to slide it along the length of the board to make sure the gap was consistent when I put the second and subsequent screws in.
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I'd hand selected all the boards, but some of them weren't completely straight, like this one. I noticed it when I spaced the one end and then noticed the other end was not spaced the same. I resorted to moderate force to bend some of the boards into submission with prybars and progressive fastening.
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After a careful start, I made good progress in these wide open areas of the deck. Eventually, I reached then point where I could start on the next direction but my stock of boards was in the way. This was the beginning of a process that lasted most of the decking phase. I had limited amount of cover from the roof and moving the boards out of my work area happened over and over. At this point, it's fair to say I have a lot of experience handling my wood.
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That bunch in the last picture, they're about to be in the way.
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I started the next section in the reverse direction and installed as many of the boards as I had free space. The stock of boards stored under the roof I let them stay in place until I coudn't deck around them any more. You can also see in this picture the result of the deck extending beyond the eave before the gutters have been installed. Time to restack them.
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Then they were out of the way again. I wouldn't need to work on that exactly spot again for awhile. Progress on the second section resumed.
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It resumed until I ran into some wood I couldn't move, namely this post. I made a note of where to notch this board and carried it to the chopsaw. I veerrrryyy carefully cut away most of the notch... and broke out the waste piece. Ta-da!
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Then sadness. I couldn't fit it in place, under the post. Gravdigr, this is the [SIZE="2"]half board[/SIZE] we spoke of. It was dark, I was tired, good. night.
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Post too big? Nope, notch too small. But not any more. You can see the little bits I took out and the saw marks their removal left. ONWARD!
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I made my way outward from the house until I was working close to the edge of the roof. Then I decided to turn my attention to the side of this section closest to the house. You remember I cut the frame to match the line from the corner of the house to the corner post. Now I had to match that arbitrary cut with some custom deck boards. You can see in the foreground that obtuse triangle of exposed framing.
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I laid the a board down and marked a line on top of it where the framing ended underneath, then cut it with my hackzall. Then I used that cutoff to transfer that angle to the board that would be one away from the edge of the deck. I didn't want the edge of the deck to be a thin sliver of a board, I'd rather have more "meat" in that high traffic spot and make up the angle further in from the edge.
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You can see the board that has the sharp angle with a deep notch that fits on either side of the bolt between the concrete pier and the post bracket. I slid it into place and used the triangle template to transfer the angle from the board in place. You can see it's been cut to a point but not installed.
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Now that the thin one's installed, it leaves more room for a much wider board to be installed at the edge of the deck here. I feel this made the edge of the deck much stronger. Those spots required some specialty cuts and slowed me down considerably. The obstacles to deckboards still ahead of me were only posts/piers. This meant I could really increase my output.
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My installation process followed this pattern, one board on the left, then one on the right, left, rigth, etc. Here you can see as I'm progressing from the house to the yard one on my left is fouling against the pier holding the center post.
Time for another notch. Cut, snap, install.
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I was making good progress, but still some things interrupted me. Some were practical, like why is there a waterfall coming down in my work area? Oh. The gutter is a lake.
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*WAS* a lake.
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Some were just w.t.f. I was challenged when I talked about "half a board". Check out "three quarters of a branch".
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When the project surpassed my understanding, I found new uses for my tools. Pop quiz: what do you think is the purpose of this part of my speedsquare?
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A race to the edge!
Yes, it's raining/has rained/will rain. *sigh* I don't really like working in the rain, but I like watching nothing happen even less. Let's get busy.
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BOOM!
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Another day, a daylight picture, must have been a weekend... Let's move those boards to the edge, we're close to the end now (this, this is the lie that I kept telling myself, and kept believing.. d'oh!).
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Anyhow, we're on the fourth of four "rows" and daylight and fair weather. Let's go!
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We're all filled in to the end, with no more fasteners, it's really, really time to stop.
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Supplies replenished, let's do a little catch up. This notch by the hose bib, that needs special attention.
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Done.
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And this board?! You can't see it here but it's split. Out with the divided and in with the whole.
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NEXT!
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This section in front of the doors didn't get the same framing treatment because the concrete "stoop" is in the way. I have a plan for a "door mat", but I need to square up this space first. Some boards had to be cut at an angle then installed.
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Some boards got installed, marked, uinstalled, cut, then reinstalled. Eventually, I had a nice clean, shallow rectangular hole in front of the doors.
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Next is the "door mat". This section is where a concrete stoop is *just* barely below the threshold of the door. My "deck" here is very, very thin. Two layers perpendicular to each other will make cover this area. I'm using fence boards here, 7/16" thick, twice. It gives me the chance to provide a little variety and I'll be able flip this over to spread out the wear pattern.
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DONE!
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I like how it looks.
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Trimming up the ends left some offcuts, some of which got recycled in places where only a short deck piece was needed, like the center of this V as I approached the edge of the deck.
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The corner of the deck where I had to make a number of long angled pieces, that area needs a step. I'm making a simple platform that will be topped with deck boards. The frame will be made from the same pressure treated 2x4s the deck frame was assembled from. Here I'm lining up the cut for the two longest pieces.
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Next shot is a bit of a "What is this?"
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Third shot is a clue. A symptom of "What the fuck this is."
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***
It's a momentary failure of attention and the safety guards built into the saw. I have "chopped" a zillion boards on this saw. Tink bought me this saw--that's how old it is. I have gotten my "money" out of it. It's just a homeowner quality/duty saw. Not garbage, but just adequate. Here's the answer to the question posed in the second pic, the blade guard that normally retracts only enough to expose the spinning blade to the wood when the wood is pressed against the fence. How are you seeing the still blade with the saw in the up position? In the first pic, the guard is covering the blade. Second pic, exposed. Third pic, what happens when you don't notice that the guard isn't covering the blade as it's decelerating. I bet I was more surprised than you are. The mechanism for moving the guard in synchony with the saw's position depends on some cams and levers and guides.... they got a little sticky and stuck *open* this time and that little nick is my reminder.
PAY ATTENTION.
OK, ok, O-K. yeesh.
Obviously I'm not that hurt, really, pfft. But, that saw Does. Not. Give. A. Fraction. Of. A. Fuck. Go on, stick your meat in there. Bzzzzt. Ooooh, damp sawdust? Who the fuck cares? It's red?! Yawn.
Pay attention.
While I'm bleeding down there, up in the roof trusses the birdies are playing house. I found a hummingbird confused and trapped under the bright roof, buzzing and pounding his head on the underside of the roof. This might be his nest, maybe not. I managed to herd him out with the broom.
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Ok, I laid out a piece of cardboard as a template for how I'd like the step to look, for placement.
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Then I made the frame with the blood soaked 2x4s from the previous post.
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Decked.
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You may notice that I used a three six inch wide boards and one skinny one. At the start of this process when we were deciding what we wanted the deck to *look* like, I got some four inch wide deck boards and some six inch wide deck boards. We went with the six inch stock. I used one of the leftover four inchers to fill the frame nicely.
Here's the end result.
A happy step.
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Now over to the opposite side of the deck, I have started the flush trimming of the deck boards. I've put a saw guide in place and trimmed the deck boards. The scrap UNDER the deck boards is how much overhang I wish to leave to be able to apply a skirt of sorts--you'll see.
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Third picture shows the 2x4 (cedar) in place, as does the fourth picture with "skirt" underneath (applied before the 2x4 frame piece.) The 2x4 is the strong piece to catch the impact of people's foot strike against the edge of the deck. The "skirt", really just a 2x6 cedar fence board, extends down far enough to trap the supporting blocks that hold up the frame on the outermost edges.
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In the previous flush trimming pictures, you might notice that my right handed saw was pushing the cut to upwards or to the right.. this is fine, except my next cuts were "behind me". And I had that damn post to deal with, the notch for which you can see in the last pic. So I gave up and moved back across the deck and started there. Now my cuts and my saw guides were moving in the same direction.
Here you can see several boards that are very long. These were ten footers, chosen because between these posts the deck frame was extended and that meant the deck got extended too, so, longer deck boards. Now I had to cut these off flush too. This needs to be a precise cut, so I have to know where the underlying frame member is, and measure from there.
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I used the blade of a combination square to reach through the gaps in the boards and slide it back until it made contact with the frame. Then I made a little pencil mark. I did this on a few gaps and used them to define the line for the saw guide board I'd screwed into the deck.
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At one spot I could easily see the frame member, so I felt ok with the placement of the guide, and I zipped the ends off.
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Before and after.
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You can see this little notch in the layout of the deck--the deck's done here but I confess I still don't have this little spot covered with the same edging treatment. I like how the deck appears to hover over the ground.
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First I trimmed them, I have been using the term "flush" but really they were 7/16" beyond the frame member. Then I used a six inch wide board, 7/16" thick, under the deck, against the frame as a "skirt". It makes for a cleaner appearance, hiding much of the frame, and it also extends beyond the bottom edge of the frame member, trapping the supporting blocks from migrating outward.
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Turned the corner, same process, new side.
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By dark I'd completed the whole side. And turned the last corner, winding up where I began. Cutting forward made a big difference in my pace.
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I thought I'd celebrate my accomplishment with a drink. Turns out the paint I spilled on this folding workbench covered up the "Not A Step" warning. Apparently it's Not A Seat, either. I got the last laugh though. It now has a new prosthetic jaw, this bench-vise. I made it from a cutoff section of deck board!
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Look how fine and straight grained this wood is. This is one of the 2x4s I used as a wraparound frame. After the lower part where the frame was concealed, I added a cedar 2x4 flush with the top of the deck and against the edges of the deck boards, shown here on the north side, west side (pre-installation), and south side.
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The roof is held up by five posts (and one side attached directly to the house). I replaced all the old posts and the new posts are secured to these concrete piers. The old posts just sat directly on the old concrete, that endgrain soaking up the water. We'll be flooded before the bottoms of these posts get wet.
The first one here extends beyond the edge of the deck because the post is directly under the frame of the roof. That frame dictated where I'd have to put the post, though I could have built the deck frame wider like I did on the north side of the deck where corner got nipped off and the ten foot deckboards were used. But I didn't, leaving me with this ... beauty mark. The other posts are represented here.
They're all at different heights relative to the surface of the deck--another manifestation of the unevenness of the underlying foundation. These piers are directly on the concrete patios wherever they needed to be placed and they're all the same height. The frame and deck got made level at the top. This shows the varying thickness of the deck structure.
Now I'm going to hide these concrete blocks.
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Five posts, each cover has two halves. Each half has four parts, 5*2*4 pieces. Fortunately, I'm making only one component, albeit ten times.
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Dry fit.
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Screwed together.
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Tested on the bench.
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Tested on the deck.
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It works very nicely, I'm happy with this low profile design. It does the job of hiding the concrete piers and it uses the same size material as the deck, same wood.
Four of five of them turned out as expected, but one... I'll need to trim it. The deck looks good!
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I admired the deck after those installations, super happy with the result.
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Complete deck, before cleaning, before staining:
https://panoraven.com/slider/ZANrIxIOgJ
In the morning, I could see it in a different light, literally. Look how dirty the deck is. We've been walking on it, of course, and it's pretty filthy, especially the high traffic patterns. This has to be cleaned up before the deck can be stained. Clean it to stain it.. heh.
Dirty.
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Dirty.
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Dirty.
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In a five gallon bucket I mixed hot water with about a quarter cup of TSP and used a car wash brush to wash/mop the deck thoroughly. This is a serious cleaning solution but super stealth. No scrubbing bubbles, no mountain fresh scent. I did see a brown wake of muddy water stream from the trailing edge of the brush when I scrubbed back and forth.
I'll tell you something else, not captured in a picture. I was walking around the deck to take some of these pictures and I walked through the wet areas... Well, I slipped, cartoon style, feet and head at the same altitude, legs making a oval blur--blam! That spot was slicker than wet ice. After that I walked like a penguin.
Here are a couple before/after shots.
The observant reader will recall my expressions of fondness for the beauty of this wood. I imagine the exasperated replies "If you like it so much, why don't you marry it?" Whoops, I meant to say "Take a picture, it lasts longer." And so I have. It doesn't look like this anymore.
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Here are a couple more before/after shots.
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Stain and bucket.
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Bucket and brush.
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Deck and stain.
I know it looks shady. It is shady. Those things are "shadows", I remember them from my time in sunny California.
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The wood is really "thirsty", I am working a section at a time, putting on enough to cover it and brushing it until it's well covered.
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As I move to the next section, the first section appears much drier.
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When the third section's done, the first two no longer look that different. There is that one board with the really blue end though. What's up with that?
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Now all four sections have a first coat on them.
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Here is the last little bit of the fourth and final section, all around. Next I'll make a trip around working on the skirt and edges, it's a little drippy in places.
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Oh, here's one side of the "door mat" This side was down since it was built. As a consequence, it's a little wet in spots and it has had really no foot traffic. It did not absorbe the stain as readily as the other side. I can flip it whenever, right now, this is "up".
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The post base covers needed staining too. The wood from these boards also didn't get any traffic, and came out a little lighter than the main span of the deck. It looks ok though.
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See the lighter door mat area?
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After the second coat, now let's walk around it a bit.
The vines going up through the frame are live virginia creepers, seen in several of the early pics. We took out the fence this vine had grown on and I was very careful to keep it as intact as possible. I expect we'll have a living curtain (summer and fall only) with a little doorway sized passageway next to that big buckeye on the right side.
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Moving around, that corner will be covered by the hot tub, and soon!
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Before and after.
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Before and after.
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This little two step construction is for sale at the hot tub store. $499.00 No, not made of SOLID GOLD, just that pvc fakey lumber. The color is about perfect, but we declined. That's... maybe $20 of 2x4s and some hunks of leftover deckboards. The remaining 479 dollars will buy a lot of champagne.
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This is our current (ha ha ha, I see what I did there) electrical panel. The service for the WHOLE HOUSE is the same amount of current required for the hot tub. This will need to be upgraded. We have an electrical contractor already picked out, a new 200 amp service to the house is scheduled, but won't happen until after the hot tub arrives.
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And it will arrive on a rolling rig that has to pass through this area (after I finish moving all this yard stuff) and up onto the deck.
Whew!
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It sure looks better after that second coat.
https://panoraven.com/slider/FW8YYUPfne
PANO_20190326_182259
snip--
That's a huge project! Lots of work, and I see SonOfV in some of the photos. Isn't he in NYC now? It takes forever to do projects in your spare time.
Yes it is.
Yes he is (Rochester, not NYC)
UNDERSTATEMENT OF THE SEASON.
...Looking good. I'll be interested to see the final product.
Thank you sir, I am as interested as you!
Nice job, looks good, strong like Russian woman, should live long and resist the damp.
On the next deck, if you flip it over and make theses cuts on the backside they won't show.
Thank you. :)
You're right, of course. Also, those cuts are covered by the base covers. I'm more of a framer than a finish carpenter. I know this about myself and I am at ease with it.
Your point is well taken, though, don't get me wrong. There are many ways to make this cut invisible; you described one, I described another.
Zooming out a couple thousand feet--- this project had a *lot* of figure-it-out-as-you-go. It was as satisfying and fulfilling of a project/puzzle as I've ever had. The thing you point out, I'd correct that on the next deck, which I plan to make never.
I *DO* have another project on simmer in my brain... an actual workshop in the back yard. More puzzle, more chances to improve my technique as you note here. More pics, more documentation, more sawdust, and finally more indoor space for my poor, poor shop tools. :(
You've dropped so much at one time here. It's gonna take a while to read through.
Seems like you could park a stream roller on it, though.
It looks fantastic!
And your back yard looks like a little oasis. In all those closeups, it looked kinda shitty, with vines and stuff in the way, but the wide angle shots show how it's all tied together and the vines are there on purpose. It's really spectacular with that sunlight streaming in in the morning.
You really did a good job. It looks fabulous.
The one thing I would have a hard time living with is that one base cover that overhangs the edge of the deck by about two inches. I would trim that so it's flush with the edge of the deck, but that says more about my OCD than it says about your deck. And I understand that it covers the concrete base underneath.
Maybe it's in a spot that you would never see it normally.
Now..... Just to pick nits... This is not a deck. This is a patio. Decks are elevated.
That said, it's lovely, and it looks inviting. You'll spend a lot of time out there, hopefully.
Good work!
Thanks very much!
Today the hot tub gets delivered.
Well, today the truck carrying the hot tub is scheduled to arrive in the driveway. I am looking forward to watching their crew of three guys unload it and navigate their way to the back yard and onto the deck. In preparation, I was asked to make a clear path 4 feet wided by 8 feet high from the driveway to the deck. I have done this. There are some branches that will be swept out of the way by the tallest sides of the hot tub, they say that's ok; that part will be ok. There are a few other concerns I have.
The grass is very soft and wheels will sink right in under the weight of the hot tub (830 pounds dry). They tell me they're going to use rollers, like the Egyptians did for the Pyramids. That's pretty ingenious. Of the Egyptians, it's merely observant of the delivery guys.... Also, there are a number of protruding tree roots, a good 4 inches in diameter to cross over. I think with the addition of some planking with a half sheet of plywood, we'll be able to overcome that obstacle. The gate isn't wide enough and the arbor is too low, so I just took down the fence next to the gate making a path around that problem. And then there's the lifting onto the deck, low though it may be. I have some 12 foot 2x6s that could be used as ramps. And since they move it in on "edge", which makes sense, they'll have to tip it back over at the final destination. That's gonna be interesting to watch. The installation spot is uncovered, and will stay uncovered but I just wonder how much tipping over space on the ground they'll need.... I am sure they'll be standing in the yard off the edge of the deck for some of the maneuvering.
Then the inevitable adjustment, to the left, no, no more. Stop, ok, back a little bit... ok. Etc.
There is no power to the site at this time, so no hookup, no filling. The electrician is scheduled to start and finish work the weekend after next. That's gonna be post-worthy fun too.
I have taken the day off to supervise and help. Now I'm gonna go tidy up the path, maybe mow the grass. There will be pix, of course. I'm nervous and excited.
Wow! It could not have come out better.
The deck is sort of the Great Wall of China, and the story "War and Peace."
I'm back. I spent this morning tying back some overhanging branches, raking the path clear, double and triple checking my work. This place is so pretty in the springtime.
The hot tub has landed.
The delivery process was eventful, and ended well. I've untied the branches and shrubs I had tucked out of the way and I reinstalled the section of fence I'd taken down.
We don't have power to the location yet, so no water yet either. But it's in place and level and solid. Next steps include building steps to get into the tub, and a step between the deck and the yard.
Seeing the tub in place has revealed some tree pruning that needs to be done.
Hey V, about how many pics does it take to make a pano like that?
Hey V, about how many pics does it take to make a pano like that?
I'll have to count... Be right back.
No biggie. I thought you might know off the top of your head.
Thirty-six individual pictures comprise one 360 panorama. The Pixel I have does most of the work. I hold the camera upright and level and press the start button. It gives me a white dot to encircle with a ring on the screen. There are five horizontal bands of these dots. Twelve around the equator, three at each pole and nine around each band between the equator and the pole. 3+9+12+9+3=36.
The camera takes the picture when I encircle the dot, I don't have to press any buttons. As you get closer to the dot you're moving toward, the dot turns blue. When you have it centered in the ring the dot disappears and the picture of that angle appears. At the end of all the pictures, it beeps and starts stitching them together in the background, leaving the camera free for more pictures.
I usually need a second to recover after spinning around five times in place while looking at my phone.
It's a panorama now, but it takes special software to view it. The phone has it built in, and so does Google photos through a browser. To share it out with you guys, I found panoraven, which you've all seen by now. I use the free version.
For example, I took
this one to count the pictures and to show you the recent progress. Twil bought a table and chairs so we have a place to sit and eat and drink. The deck feels like it is filling up. The black mat is where the new grill will go. And the lights are really pretty down low like this, but I can and do touch them with my head as I walk around. They'll definitely have to be raised up into the trusses. The pattern's good though we might have to set them back a bit more from the edge of the tub.
Another point about the panoramas. The computer doing the stitching presumes you've rotated the camera about the sensor. Good fuckin luck buddy. They make special ball head tripods that do
this... I'm doing these freehand. This kind of subject the deck the trusses all those straight lines are especially unforgiving in the these panos.
Thanks, Big V.
Your description of the process for taking the pics is almost the same as my old camera taking standard panos. Only I line up a plus sign inside a hollow plus sign, the cam takes the pic automatically, and I line the plusses up for the next in the two or three shot series. That camera, a FujiFilm FinePix S3280, took pretty good panoramas.
Trying to remember the dog's name...Is it Jack, or is Jack no longer with us? I ferget.
Jack's his name. He's in a sunny spot in the yard, topped by a halo of blue hyacinths.
ETA...
Jack died awhile ago, but Andy, the Reluctant Outdoor Dog, he's still kickin. He's in some of the recent pics.
Today the electrician comes to upgrade our electrical service.
I'm told this will be a two day process. Originally, day one would have been used to switch meter bases and electrical panels. Plan was to have the power company cut power to the house to make the switch to the new meter safe to do. Turns out, the power company doesn't do courtesy cutoffs/reconnects like this on the weekend.
So the new day one will be *me* crawling under the house in the crawlspace to drag the pair of four conductor (probably AWG 4) cables from the entrance to the crawlspace which is next to the deck under the house to the opposite side of the house where the electrical service, meter, and panel are now. I imagine some kind of hole through the floor and wall will be needed, once located, to run the cable up to where the new panel will be installed. I think there will also be a new panel installed today, but only the new circuit connected to it. Then, back out on the deck, the hot tub sub panel (provided by the hot tub company with two GFCI breakers in it, one 30 amp, one 20 amp) will be installed and connected to one set of four conductors for a dedicated circuit.
The other circuit will have its own sub panel and be available for a one of more accessory circuits on the deck, lights, etc. The rest of the 230v circuit will end in a "stub" for further expansion, notably the workshop to be built beyond the garage.
The electrician and I have agreed to let me help on the job in return for a reduction on the bill, basically, he'll pay me what he'd pay any other helper and subtract my "wage" from the bill. I'd be up in his stuff all day anyhow, might as well get paid.
Now crawling under the house is the least attractive part of this proposition and I might have to subcontract this task to one of the kid's skinny friends. We'll see. And you'll see, I already have pics of the torn out wall, ready for its close-up.
Fun, fun, fun! Do good and maybe he'll hire you for other jobs, you know, the dangerous/dirty ones he won't do. :haha:
When I was replacing my old 60 amp fuse panel with a 100 amp breaker panel I had a small generator for light to see what I was doing. Half way through the motor threw a rod. Sure is dark in here. :facepalm:
Unusual for a guy to let you work for him. You'll learn about it too, which is even better.
If I was an electrician, I would be happy to let homeowners help, but I would charge extra, not less.
Charge by the hour, let him help, if he slows you down he pays more.
Fun, fun, fun! Do good and maybe he'll hire you for other jobs, you know, the dangerous/dirty ones he won't do. :haha:
---snip
You're right!
Unusual for a guy to let you work for him. You'll learn about it too, which is even better.
You're right, too!
If I was an electrician, I would be happy to let homeowners help, but I would charge extra, not less.
You're smart and right.
Charge by the hour, let him help, if he slows you down he pays more.
There's a certain logic here, but it doesn't lead directly to soaking in the damn tub...
Today the electrician comes to upgrade our electrical service.
--snip--
So the new day one will be *me* crawling under the house in the crawlspace to drag the pair of four conductor (probably [SIZE="4"]AWG 6[/SIZE]) cables from the entrance to the crawlspace which is next to the deck under the house to the opposite side of the house where the electrical service, meter, and panel are now.
--snip
corrected.
Let's get started!
First step, open the crawlspace and get in there.
Oh
shit.
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What the ever-flowing fucking fuck?? There is a Lake. of. Shit. under the house???
Stunned. Gutted. Had the shit knocked out of me (which collected in a pool under the house directly at the entrance to the crawlspace). Go on, laugh. All other options are worse.
In this picture, taken a few minutes later, you can see the source of the problem. I have an opening on my main drain, a couple feet from the tub and the toilet and the sink and the main stack from the upstairs bathroom. That big, dark empty circle? That's what the inside of a drainpipe looks like. And if you can see in, water can get out.
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A keen observer of the first two pictures would have noticed a straight line pointing toward the opening in the drain. I wonder what it points to in the other direction?
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Did I says source earlier? I was wrong, that's one source, here's the other. This is the drain from the kitchen, the sink and the dishwasher. Another gaping, gushing black hole. It's uphill from the lake, that's why the put lakes where they put them, duh. I need to get into this "area". What the fuck am I gonna do?
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That straight line is a two inch copper pipe that has FALLEN OUT of its installation between the two fittings at the kitchen and the main drain. How does that happen? I honestly don't know. It doesn't appear to have been soldered in, which is ok, since I will have a clean pipe end and clean (and I use the term mechanically, because, gross) fitting to work with when I reinstall it today.
I'll make another set of pics and notes, probably another thread for this surprise DIY Plumbing Emergency Repair. Meanwhile, if any of you guys have a clue how that pipe fell out, speak up. JFC.
Maybe the weight of the spider webs pulled it down.
I know, not helping.
At least you know about the problem now. I would have thought that there would be an aroma from the drain, if not the sound of water splashing from the sink drain.
YMMV
… That straight line is a two inch copper pipe that has FALLEN OUT of its installation between the two fittings at the kitchen and the main drain. How does that happen? I honestly don't know. …
… Meanwhile, if any of you guys have a clue how that pipe fell out, speak up. JFC.
Some DIYers will leave a loose connection, perhaps just banded together with a collet, and the connector rusts away. It can be done to have a ready access point in which to run an auger to unclog pipes in locations that are difficult (or impossible) to reach from above because of the path to the clog. Evaluate your drain network for that to determine how you want to seal it at that point.
Is it possible that those black pipes are the former system? The white ones look newer. Maybe they just left those parts of what has been bypassed. Or are they vents? Is the ground / shit wet? Get someone to flush while you're down there and listen.
Make sure you don't look into the pipe when doing this...
My God, you've stumbled onto a magic portal to Trump's secret Cabinet Room. You're just lucky the slithery members weren't meeting.
Best plan is to brick it up, run your wiring above ground and enjoy the deck.
I thought you might like to see the next phase of Big V's project...
I hope his neighbors are cool.
Now, that's just fantastic!