Brexit
I've been avoiding talking about the upcoming EU Referendum, because I find the whole thing deeply depressing. I will be voting to remain in the EU, but I fear that the Brexiters will win the day and we will be leaving the EU shortly. I think this will be damaging to our country in many ways. I also think it will be damaging to Europe.
But that's not really why I'm posting - I don't know if y'all have seen the news about the recent killing of an MP in Yorkshire? The killer shouted 'Britain First' as he attacked. The MP was a 'pro-immigration' MP, by which I mean she was against the anti-immigration rhetoric and was proud of the multicultural nature of her constituency.
It saddens me that this has happened. It would sadden me whatever her political stripe - there is no room for violence and assassination in a democratic state. But it also saddens me because she was one of the good ones. She was a hardworking constituency MP, going to bat for her constituents time and again and always available to them through surgeries and visits. She was a lovely woman.
It is also a shocking thing for it to happen so close to home. Kirklees, the borough in which her constituency sits is one of the neighbouring boroughs to mine. Our two boroughs often collaborate and pool resources on things - there are a number of services, for instance that our two councils share responsibility and oversight for.
It's a wake up call, I think, as to just how deep seated the tensions over immigration and Britain's EU membership run. We are not a happy land right now.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/jun/16/labour-mp-jo-cox-shot-in-west-yorkshireHad she previously ever met with her killer during a surgery?
It's a wake up call, I think, as to just how deep seated the tensions over immigration and Britain's EU membership run.
No reason for emotions over either topic. Neither issue threatens anyone's health and well being. But to gain power, then incite adults who are still children to become emotional. Create problems where none should or would exist.
Brexit makes no sense to an adult. But it makes complete sense when hypes an issue to obtain power. To even lie about reasons for leaving such as money. Incite adults who are still children into an emotional tizzy - to even murder. Its easy especially when so many today only hear soundbytes; do not read anything more than one paragraph long. Become uneducated. And therefore cannot be a moderate.
Extremists know how to obtain power. She is their victim.
I think I would be on the Remain side whilst secretly wanting to preserve what is uniquely British. (Cheddar, Her Maj, and football hooliganism. Well do keep the cheese)
Just browsing around, I found a map of pro and anti MP districts and, interestingly, there was no geographic unity to it, except for Scotland who are firmly Remain.
It fails to explain why they were so interested in breaking off Britain and not so interested in breaking off EU.
Without having a single clue, I'll guess that is because what is Scottish is still firmly Scottish, and nobody is going to threaten that, even if the occasional terrorist needs to be kicked in the bollocks at the airport.
I thought it was interesting he preferred to stab her and only resorted to the gun in his bag when interference from the other guy fucked up his plans.
This poll claims the key to the decision process on Brexit is trust in leadership.
Dana, I don't know if this helps but the referendum is a glorified opinion poll and any decision to leave still depends on parliament which is around 90% remain. Can't remember where I saw this but the whole thing is a Tory smoke screen ...
Sent by thought transference
Of course Limey is correct, as always. :notworthy Being part of the power behind the throne has informational privilege.
What follows any referendum vote next week for the United Kingdom to leave the EU? From a legal perspective, the immediate consequence is simple: nothing will happen.
The relevant legislation did not provide for the referendum result to have any formal trigger effect. The referendum is advisory rather than mandatory. The 2011 referendum on electoral reform did have an obligation on the government to legislate in the event of a “yes” vote (the vote was “no” so this did not matter). But no such provision was included in the EU referendum legislation.
linkDoesn't mean we're not in for a bumpy ride in the case of a No vote ...
Sent by thought transference
So, the killing of that MP was just a confidence exercise in preparation for later?
That is reassuring, Limey. I don't know very much about it all tbh. As I say, the whole thing depresses me no end, so I have avoided reading much about it. The only thing I do know is that I'd rather we remain in Europe than leave. My view pretty much corresponds with UT's: remain whilst maintaining what is uniquely British.
That poll on trust is fascinating.
I thought it was interesting he preferred to stab her and only resorted to the gun in his bag when interference from the other guy fucked up his plans. ...
Probably just wanted to ensure his representative was feeling his pain.
The marked absence of facts has characterised this whole campaign.
In a general election all manner of promises, most of them undeliverable, will be made and the electorate generally accepts that, voting out of political tribal loyalty or simply frustration.
Well, it'll keep the other lot out, won't it?
Given the nature of the question, there should be at least some fairly concrete facts on which to base your voting decision but what do we have?
The Remain camp has issued all manner of dire warnings short of seven days of darkness laying over the face of the land, in the event of a vote to leave and the Leave campaign doesn't seem to have anything coherent to say.
It doesn't help that there isn't even a split along party lines and it has produced some very odd political alliances.
So, what do I do on Thursday? Sit on my hands and blame everybody else when it all goes wrong?
Whatever happens there's going to be some almighty upheaval one way or another in the following months.
Without giving too much away, I'm at an age (don't ask) where the health of my pension fund is becoming something of a concern.
Whatever the result, I've no doubt there will be stock market upheaval from 0830 on Friday morning so that noise you'll hear will be my pension fund heading south at Mach 2.
One of the reasons I want to remain, is that I believe membership of Europe provides a last line of defence against some of our government's most extreme policies. For example, look at what happened with the so-called bedroom tax. It's been a disastrous policy overalll, but some of the worst affected were people with disabilities or long term illnesses. A group of people badly affected by the policy were able to take their case to the high court on the grounds that it infringed their human rights according to european law.
And though our country has opted out of many of the strictures on employment, there are still many employment rights that have come from membership of the union.
I fear the loss of that last line of defence, whether the conservatives stay in power of labour get back in. All the main parties (Corbyn notwithstanding) seem to follow a neo-con path on policies, that are downright damaging to the social fabric of this country.
I also, at an emotional level, still retain a belief in the ideal of European unity. I don't want our country to go back into 'Splendid Isolation'.
Most of all, I think that remaining would not make life noticeably worse than it is now. Remain may well do so.
So - for me it is a mixture of positive and negative reasons for voting to stay.
... Given the nature of the question, there should be at least some fairly concrete facts on which to base your voting decision but what do we have? ...
Circumstances within the EU have changed enough since the last referendum to trigger a new one. There's a Wiki article about it, the tone of which appears relatively neutral. It conveniently outlines many of the considerations in one place. Perhaps it would serve as a refresher and spark greater insight into how the possible outcomes may affect you.
The main article:
United Kingdom European Union membership referendum, 2016
The pertinent considerations subparagraph:
Hypothesised results of a withdrawalWhatever the result, I've no doubt there will be stock market upheaval from 0830 on Friday morning so that noise you'll hear will be my pension fund heading south at Mach 2.
Those silly little blimps are how adults make money at the expense of the emotional. Those blimps do not define market growth.
But leaving the EU will result in less UK growth - in the long term. Whereas markets will still grow, that growth will be stunted. Nothing good is provided by Brexit. Emotions that justify Brexit even murder politicians. That says much about the intelligence promoting Brexit.
That subjects like DanaC feel they need the EU to protect them from their own government says more.
Ahem - citizens not subjects.
[SIZE="6"]Ahem![/SIZE] 
[SIZE="6"]You beg my pardon[/SIZE].
Nope. Legally we are citizens. There's a very small number of people who are legally 'subjects'.
On 1 January 1983, upon the coming into force of the British Nationality Act 1981, every citizen of the United Kingdom and colonies became either a British citizen, British Dependent Territories citizen or British Overseas citizen.
Use of the term British subject was discontinued for all persons who fell into these categories, or who had a national citizenship of any other Commonwealth country. The category of British subjects now includes only those people formerly known as British subjects without citizenship and people born in Ireland before 1949. In statutes passed before 1 January 1983, however, references to British subjects are interpreted as if they referred to Commonwealth citizens.
British citizens are not British subjects under the 1981 Act. The only circumstance where a person may be both a British subject and British citizen simultaneously is a case where a British subject connected with Ireland (s. 31 of the 1981 Act) acquires British citizenship by naturalisation or registration. In this case only, British subject status is not lost upon acquiring British citizenship. The status of British subject cannot now be transmitted by descent, and will become extinct with the passing of all existing British subjects.
British subjects, other than by those who obtained their status by virtue of a connection to Ireland prior to 1949, automatically lose their British subject status on acquiring any other nationality, including British citizenship, under section 35 of the British Nationality Act 1981.
In 2010, around 3,500 British Subject passports were issued each year, with the number steadily declining over time.[10]
Though the term British subject now has a very restrictive statutory definition in the United Kingdom—and it would be incorrect to describe a British citizen as a British subject—the concept of a subject remains in the law, and the terms the Queen's subjects, Her Majesty's subjects, etc., remain in use in British legal discourse.[11]
Incidentally, here's John Oliver's take on the matter:
[youtube]iAgKHSNqxa8[/youtube]
the concept of a subject remains in the law, and the terms the Queen's subjects, Her Majesty's subjects, etc., remain in use in British legal discourse.
It's not what you think you are, but how the government views you in legal dealings. You are still subjects of the powers that be. Off with their heads! :p:
And I repeat:
and it would be incorrect to describe a British citizen as a British subject
;p
It would be incorrect to put Pug pee in your tea, but when the Queen says you must, the government says you must, the power says you must, you must.
I think she's saying that as of 1 January 1983 it's PC to say BC and that's no BS.
We'll I'm a strange beastie, I vote SNP but will be voting out in the Ref, why because the EU has morphed into a many headed monster and it is not what we voted for in the 70's.
Then it was about economic union as a trading block against the economic giant the USA, not as it's turning into a united states of Europe with Germany and France calling the shots.
Despite what the official SNP stance is there are many in the party against the EU but they may toe the party line in the hope of another independence ref.
There is also the immigration issue, now before I'm shouted down as a racist please hear me out I have no qualms about any creed colour of anyone wishing to come to the UK to better themselves work and contribute, but successive governments have not funded public services to cope.
Where I live it take on average 3 weeks to see a Doctor that's how I ended up in hospital with a pulmonary embolism recently and nearly died, just because I couldn't get a doctors appointment to check me over early enough.
Is there an issue with Eastern Europeans taking up immigration slots in GB that would have been Pakistani or Indian? I heard someone selling the idea that British Curry was suffering from a lack of knowledgeable cooks. Is Britain losing its Britishness?
This whole mess exists because David Cameron did not even have balls to take on the issue. As a result, his own party and their coalition partner are fractured. He created this mess by not acting as a leader.
Moving on, irrelevant to what happens tomorrow, what will happen to Britian's leaders? If Brexit is approved, will Scotland withdrawal from the UK? That is likely.
A problem directly traceable to so many Britains who do not even know who represents them in Brussels and have no idea how the European Parliament works or is even structured. Ignorance means emotions create decisions.
Fuck me, tw, not one mention of children ;p
I jest - and very much agree.
personally, I don't see that this referendum was necessary or desirable. This was something that required leadership. The public are being asked to vote on something that is so mired in decades of misinformation and propaganda, even many who are relatively politically engaged have very little understanding of the facts of EU membership.
All I know is that the EU has too many regulations that mention the word pillow!
A steady trickle of needy underclass could break Socialism once the masses realize their cut is being taken... how quickly things are changing
The US has managed it all along as a wholly immigrant nation; the immigrants become successful in their second and third generations, and assimilate, so they're productive and no longer needy. This will happen in Britain too, if the economy and the people accept this fate.
The tweaker said this about his illegal Mexican: "His kid went to American school, now he's an American."
As goes Rolls Royce, so goes the nation.
There'd an element of that to British society as well UT. Some of the biggest voices against the current immigrants are the children and grandchildren of yesterday's immigrants. Complaining about immigration is practically a national characteristic.
But they were mostly immigrants from the empire. They had already been schooled to accept British superiority and prepared to adjust their lives to the British norm as best they could. They were not coming in demanding the locals bend to their culture, adjust to their aspirations, accept them on their terms.
Not one major business group or financial organization approves of Brexit. If facts are that overwhelming, then why do so many want Brexit? A perfect example. Many adults still think like children (for the same reason so many also knew Saddam had WMDs). If thinking logically, then Brexit is clearly undesirable.
Why do so many want Brexit? Because brainwashing works on those who make decisions based only using emotions. Those are adults who still think like children.
Again, not one valid fact justifies or says Brexit is desirable or good. Virtually every major business and finance organization says Brexit is bad. How many bothered to even learn that fact before making a conclusion?
That is a difference between a moderate and an extremist (active or potential). Moderates learn facts with numbers before making a conclusion. Extremists entertain their emotions - somehow know immediately what to believe. Brexit demonstrates how many adults are still children.
Not one major business group or financial organization approves
And if we know anything, we know those folks can absolutely be trusted and want only what is best for all.
(he said half joking)
Business groups and financial organizations are usually run by top management...
Business groups and financial organizations are usually run by top management...
Some top management is extremely patriotic. They innovate. They empower their workers. Their desire for better products is, for example, why the American economy is so robust and still #1. Those should not be confused with people such as Donald Trump, Rick Wagoner, Carly Fiorina, Dick Cheney, Martin Shkreli, or George Jr whose only interests were self servicing and classic anti-humaity and anti-American. Whose actions did so much harm to America.
And still, not one honest and comprehensive fact (with perspective) recommends Brexit. Vote should be that one sided if enough adults are adult.
Brexit: capable of turning usually humorful and interesting facebook friends into utter wankers.
To my colonial eye, Brexit is not about business. It is about nationalism vs globalism. The EU is a dictatorship, pure and simple. I admit, I have my hands full following our own troubles and have not spared much time for our UK allies' troubles, yet I do kind of read things. Like
this article, by a British citizen who is in a better position to know what is happening there. I believe him, and Boris Johnson, former mayor of London. I have listened to Boris make his case and I think he is right. Leave the EU and let it fall apart. The UK is not the only country that is getting tired of being dictated to by Brussels. Germany and France, among others, are about ready to leave and are probably only waiting to see what happens to the UK first. If the sky doesn't fall in on the Brits, they will likely follow soon after.
In my humble opinion, anything that monkey wrenches globalism is a good thing.
That makes it sound like they're an external power dictating to us. We are part of that power. Brussels is us and we are Brussels.
Of all the EU nations we have less to gripe about in terms of dictatorship than any. We have negotiated so many opt outs, the rest of the EU has bent over backwards to accommodate Britain's individualism. We are not even a member of the eurozone - we kept our own currency.
As for globalisation - Boris is a neo-con. He wants to free up the British elite to be part of a whole different kind of globalisation. Free from EU and its insistence that things like bankers' bonuses should have some sort of limit or that workers' rights should have some sort of protection.
looks like exit at this hour, exit leading by 750k votes
Free Scotland in 5 4 3...
The Markets don't like the Brexit
Analysis of the vote says much about why that decision was made. For example, N Ireland and Scotland clearly did not want Brexit. The young clearly did not want Brexit. A vast majority who voted for it were older, white, less educated, and predominately from the midlands. These people have two gripes: income and immigration.
Brexit is about business and the many other economic and social aspects possible or improved because of business.
Their first complaint is accurate. Incomes have been stagnant. Innovation is the only source of increasing incomes. Britain (like the US) has seen diminishing innovation as more are educated in business rather than in productive disciplines. Voters did not blame the reason or resulting symptoms for stagnant incomes. That required learning facts while ignoring subjective soundbytes. Extremists successfully promoted a 'blame them others' mentality. EU was easy to blame using myths and outright lies such as globalization, people with accents, and European dictatorship. Especially since most Britains could not even name who they elected to Brussels. Extremists survive on myths that promote misdirected hate and fear.
Immigrants are numerous in a nation called New York State. Does NY get upset because so many valley girls from California now live there? Of course not. New Yorkers are not that dumb. Immigrants from other states are essential to growth and wealth of a union, nation, or state. Extremists successfully promoted hate of 'them' to a white, mostly blue collar Britain. Successfully blamed stagnant incomes on what is really a significant reason why their incomes have not dropped - immigrants and foreigners.
Soundbytes are easier to promote than reality. So as one said, "Nobody has withdrawn from the EU. So let's give it a go." Reasoning not based in educated or logical thought. But inspired by blaming others combined with emotion and rhetoric.
British pound has already fallen to lowest levels in 30 years. That will increase cost of living. Brexit supporters will not notice how much damage they have done because significant damage will appear in two and six years from now. We know this will create conflict and stress in culture, employment, trade, and national defense. Virtually every person educated in these various aspects have said so. It is that obvious. The emotional educated by soundbytes tend to forget events even six months ago. So they will not blame themselves.
Questions: should Scotland and N Ireland withdrawal from the UK. No longer any reason for not doing so. Since extremists say this is good; Scotland might. N Ireland probably will not reunite with Ireland. But they should consider it.
Britain may have started a process to become a second class nation. Will not be apparent this year. Because we know a nation's fabric is measured by its product. What is done productively today does not appear in standards of living for typically four or ten years. In twenty years, damage done by so many easily manipulated by extremists rhetoric will become apparent. Destructive Britains will blame other (simplistic) factors rather than the reason why all those degrading factors exist.
Britain's vote is praised by who? Right wing extremists in Denmark, Netherlands, Italy, and France. Extremists (ie Milosevic, bin Laden, Mugabee, and Hitler) need disunity and hate to obtain power. That should have had attention of so many who, instead, voted to do damage. That means learning what makes a productive and safer country.
US works because states, for example, do not stupidly call for NYexit. Now we learn how much damage is created by extremist rhetoric. We know it will be destructive. Only question is by how much. Scotland should withdrawal from a nation that no longer understands a well proven expression, "United we stand; divided we fall."
No surprise. Donald Trump loves Brexit. Resulting hate, pain, problems, and disunity promote extremists (and egotists) who crave power. Only extremists want that and everything else associated with that hate, dictatorship, concentration of wealth and what extremists most love - war.
Who wanted to advance the UK? The young. Scotland and Ireland. Londoners. Who blamed others because extremists (ie Boris Johnson) so easily manipulated them using half truths, intentional lies, and emotion?
Perhaps the masses will learn to vote correctly if the people who are better than them, insult them even harder.
...or will the "betters" will learn that insulting the masses has the opposite of the intended effect.
Trump 2016. Because fuck you.
Voters learn that voting matters.
I wonder if, now that reality is setting in, politicians could win the next election by promising to cancel the Brexit.
Interesting article here, suggesting that Boris and his coterie were actually hoping to lose by a narrow margin. That they would gain the political capital of having stood up for Britain and weakened Cameron and his ilk within the party, without having to go through the pain of an actual brexit.
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jun/24/a-pyrrhic-victory-boris-johnson-wakes-up-to-the-costs-of-brexit
Personally, I find the whole thing thoroughly depressing. The Leave campaign has outright lied to us on so many issues. The Remain camp frankly weren't much better with their scaremongering - but the outright lies from the Leave campaign were breathtaking. They were already distancing themselves from them, less than 12 hours after the polling stations closed. The campaign promise that all that money we've been sending to the EU every week would go to the NHS? No, no that's not happening. And so it begins.
They have launched a wrecking ball at our country. They have sold us a lie. Leaving the EU will not fix the things they claimed it will fix. The biggie, the one most people who voted to Leave seem to have taken most to heart is that this will allow Britain to reduce immigration. It won't. There will be no salve to the troubles of the working class from this decision. All it has done and will do is destablise the country and economy even further. This is the beginning of major fragmentation.
I hope I'm wrong - I really do.
This sums up the Leave campaign for me:
This is what did it. Anti-immigration in its ugliest form. It it resonates pretty uncomfortably with a nazi propaganda film in its visual style:
Among lies easily promoted to the most easily brainwash was £20 billion given away to the EU annually. Observe what happened today.
Extremists hate institutions that are essential such as Central Banks. So that Britains will have a paycheck next week, the Bank of England spent £250 billion just today to support the pound. What extremists hate, ironically, saved the pound today and their paychecks this week.
If pound sterling continues to drop (since it is now regarded less stable and less desirable then the Chinese Yuan), then even more money must disappear in UK economy. The naive must deny that £250 billion to deny brainwashing.
Pound will rise some. Either way, Bank of England must spend more to protect the pound at higher costs. Either way, UK lost £billions only in one day because so many voters voted their emotions. Many business deals once done in pounds must be done in Dollars, Euros, Yuan, and Yen. Pound sterling will not longer be regarded safe enough for tranactions without some additional concessions British companies will pay penalties to banks and fat cat financial institutions to complete business deals once done almost transparently when part of the EU.
I was struck by Boris Johnson's contrite speech. He should have been cooing like an egotistical Donald Trump. Maybe he was trying to not alienate most of his party who regard him as Republicans regard Trump. Guardian article makes sense even though some is only speculation that connects the dots. But Johnson's objective was to achieve power at any expense. That is his history.
EU leaders are blunt. Britain must leave as fast as possible no matter how destructive those actions may be to Britain. No mercy. EU leaders have implied Article 50 will be executed vicious - as it should be to avert uncertainty. Expect them to also protect themselves at the expense of Britain. British representatives in the EU Parliament now have virtually no power and have contempt from their peers. Expect Britain to be handled with the disrespect it has earned.
Silver lining - it's probably going to be a very good time to buy stock.
Silver lining - it's probably going to be a very good time to buy stock.
These events are what currency traders dream of. Profit margin on currency trades are typically tenths of a percent. People such as George Soros have made fortunes trading at the expense of a country's Central Bank when that country had contempt for its economy. This is as much as 10% profit margins in only weeks or months - if one understands that market. Plenty of money to be made because the Bank of England has been forced to lose so many billions of pounds to protect liquidity.
Not good. Banking and Financial makes up a huge part of the UK economy; some 10-12% of GDP, from what I understand. One of the reasons is that London is the top trading market for the Euro. Except ... whoops, the only reason that the financial services in London can trade the Euro is because it is part of the EU. That access is going to be cut off now - apart from the natural unwillingness of the EU to make any exceptions for this, there are financial centers in Frankfurt, Paris and Brussels that will gladly take over that business. In addition, the UK financial services will also lose free access to the European market - which severely curtails the usefulness of UK offices.
In short, absent an absurdly unlikely deal for the UK, the financial sector in the country is facing a devastating period of uncertainty, most likely terminated by the loss of tens of thousands of jobs. There is a reason why banking services were hardest hit on the stock markets once the verdict was in and rumors of massive cuts started almost immediately.
In addition, new investments in the UK are screeching to a halt right now. No sane industry is going to spend money in a place where they don't know what the future trading conditions are going to be like, and - absent a truly remarkable deal - the UK is going to be prioritized a lot lower going forward. The UK may be the world's (now) sixth largest economy, but Germany and France are - as of this morning - both bigger, - and for most companies free access to the Eurozone will be more important than free access to the UK.
There was an old joke about "Holy Roman Empire" being neither holy, nor Roman, nor an empire. We now have a new iteration of this joke: the "United Kingdom" is not united. It is split right down the middle, and some regions are poles apart from others (e.g. Scotland vs. rural England).
And yes, all evidence points to the EU wanting to make an example of UK, lest there is a domino effect: "if you vote to get out, we will screw you up royally". Now that just reinforces the prejudice that those Eurocrats are bastards now, didn't it? Well played from both sides.
Dana, I don't know if this helps but the referendum is a glorified opinion poll and any decision to leave still depends on parliament which is around 90% remain. Can't remember where I saw this but the whole thing is a Tory smoke screen ...
Sent by thought transference
I wonder if the Queen, through the new PM, will say no?
The Queen has very little actual power. Or, more accurately, the Queen has nominal powers which if ever used would signal the end of the monarchy. The crown stays aloof from political decisions, they don't even publicly declare positions on anything. They adhere to a kind of constitutional neutrality. It was a potential scandal brewing when it was discovered that Charles had written to the prime minister expressing a view on some minor matter.
And continuing the climb down from all their promises of what Brexit would mean for the UK:
The appearance of pro-Brexit Tory MEP Daniel Hannan on BBC’s Newsnight on Friday night is causing some indignation.
After Nigel Farage’s admission on Friday morning that the official Leave campaign claim that it could spend money recouped from Europe on the NHS was “a mistake”, Hannan told the BBC that Brexit would not necessarily end free movement of Labour. Newsnight presenter Evan Davis was a bit taken aback, given the core immigration message of the leave campaign:
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2016/jun/25/brexit-live-emergency-meetings-eu-uk-leave-vote?page=with:block-576e2c76e4b0be24d34f6017#block-576e2c76e4b0be24d34f6017
All the so-called benefits of Brexit with which they sold the idea to the voters are falling by the wayside already. So what exactly have we, the ordinary people, gained? There won't be additional money for the NHS, the immigration situation won't change. These were the two core planks of the Brexit campaign. Most people I know who voted to Leave did so because they thought the money saved would boost the NHS and other services and because they thought it would end what they saw as an onslaught of immigration.
We've crippled our nation, for what?
... We've crippled our nation, for what?
To make it less attractive to immigrants 'cause many of them are fussy. It's a technique.
I saw it expressed as trading one group of distant oligarchs for a nearer group but I doubt any of your masters were upended. I'd guess that's the last popular vote you'll see related to the EU.
Petition for 2nd EU vote hits 1 million signatures
... 1.2 million people signed a petition on the official government website by late morning calling for a repeat vote -- more than 12 times the 100,000 signatures required for a proposal to be discussed in the lower house of parliament. ...
... A parliamentary committee, which can put forward petitions for debate by lawmakers, will consider the proposal Tuesday. ...
... "A second independence referendum is clearly an option that requires to be on the table," First Minister Nicola Sturgeon declared after an emergency meeting of Scotland's parliament, which agreed to start to draw up legislation that could enable such a vote once a decision is taken. ...
Heard, still hearing, a lot on the exit...whole whack of folks for and against...all manner of dire consequence or heavenly reward foisted up as a result of leaving or staying.
Being a horrid, 'does not play well with others', type, I think the UK will (over the long haul) profit from the exit...in the short term, however, Britain will suffer (the EU is gonna try real hard to punish the UK).
Hunker down and wait it out.
CADE
Be brave, then; for your captain is brave, and vows
reformation. There shall be in England seven
halfpenny loaves sold for a penny: the three-hooped
pot; shall have ten hoops and I will make it felony
to drink small beer: all the realm shall be in
common; and in Cheapside shall my palfrey go to
grass: and when I am king, as king I will be,--
ALL
God save your majesty!
CADE
I thank you, good people: there shall be no money;
all shall eat and drink on my score; and I will
apparel them all in one livery, that they may agree
like brothers and worship me their lord.
DICK
The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers.
And yet, at the same time, we non-Britons are not of the culture, and so we are not aware of the nuances of it; I'm sure our thoughts on the topic are rather unsophisticated, compared to those who are in the middle of it and pay rent and use services etc.
I bet they're all peeing a lot (all that tea).
But don't forget we on the outside can observe as rational adults, watching emotional children rant about wants, claiming they're needs. :angel:
And yet, at the same time, we non-Britons are not of the culture, and so we are not aware of the nuances of it; I'm sure our thoughts on the topic are rather unsophisticated, compared to those who are in the middle of it and pay rent and use services etc.
Except for all the Britons
who Googled "What is the EU?" after the referendum's results were announced.
I heard the EU is willing to forgive and forget, let bygones be bygones, and allow the British to stay; but, only if they remove the portrait of the Queen from British coins and currency and replace it with a depiction of the EU flag. Is everyone OK with that?
Except for all the Britons who Googled "What is the EU?" after the referendum's results were announced.
snigger
Good article here
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jun/25/boris-johnson-michael-gove-eu-liars
Johnson and Gove had every reason to celebrate. The referendum campaign showed the only arguments that matter now in England are on the right. With the Labour leadership absent without leave and the Liberal Democrats and Greens struggling to be heard, the debate was between David Cameron and George Osborne, defending the status quo, and the radical right, demanding its destruction. Johnson and Gove won a dizzying victory with the potential to change every aspect of national life, from workers’ rights to environmental protection.
Yet they gazed at the press with coffin-lid faces and wept over the prime minister they had destroyed. David Cameron was “brave and principled”, intoned Johnson. “A great prime minister”, muttered Gove. Like Goneril and Regan competing to offer false compliments to Lear, they covered the leader they had doomed with hypocritical praise. No one whoops at a funeral, especially not mourners who are glad to see the back of the deceased. But I saw something beyond hypocrisy in those frozen faces: the fear of journalists who have been found out.
The media do not damn themselves, so I am speaking out of turn when I say that if you think rule by professional politicians is bad wait until journalist politicians take over. Johnson and Gove are the worst journalist politicians you can imagine: pundits who have prospered by treating public life as a game. Here is how they play it. They grab media attention by blaring out a big, dramatic thought. An institution is failing? Close it. A public figure blunders? Sack him. They move from journalism to politics, but carry on as before. When presented with a bureaucratic EU that sends us too many immigrants, they say the answer is simple, as media answers must be. Leave. Now. Then all will be well.
Johnson and Gove carried with them a second feature of unscrupulous journalism: the contempt for practical questions. Never has a revolution in Britain’s position in the world been advocated with such carelessness. The Leave campaign has no plan. And that is not just because there was a shamefully under-explored division between the bulk of Brexit voters who wanted the strong welfare state and solid communities of their youth and the leaders of the campaign who wanted Britain to become an offshore tax haven. Vote Leave did not know how to resolve difficulties with Scotland, Ireland, the refugee camp at Calais, and a thousand other problems, and did not want to know either.
It responded to all who predicted the chaos now engulfing us like an unscrupulous pundit who knows that his living depends on shutting up the experts who gainsay him. For why put the pundit on air, why pay him a penny, if experts can show that everything he says is windy nonsense? The worst journalists, editors and broadcasters know their audiences want entertainment, not expertise. If you doubt me, ask when you last saw panellists on Question Time who knew what they were talking about.
Naturally, Michael Gove, former Times columnist, responded to the thousands of economists who warned he was taking an extraordinary risk with the sneer that will follow him to his grave: “People in this country have had enough of experts.” He’s being saying the same for years.
If sneers won’t work, the worst journalists lie. The Times fired Johnson for lying to its readers. Michael Howard fired Johnson for lying to him. When he’s cornered, Johnson accuses others of his own vices, as unscrupulous journalists always do. Those who question him are the true liars, he blusters, whose testimony cannot be trusted because, as he falsely said of the impeccably honest chairman of the UK Statistics Authority, they are “stooges”.
The Vote Leave campaign followed the tactics of the sleazy columnist to the letter. First, it came out with the big, bold solution: leave. Then it dismissed all who raised well-founded worries with “the country is sick of experts”. Then, like Johnson the journalist, it lied.
I am not going to be over-dainty about mendacity. Politicians, including Remain politicians lie, as do the rest of us. But not since Suez has the nation’s fate been decided by politicians who knowingly made a straight, shameless, incontrovertible lie the first plank of their campaign. Vote Leave assured the electorate it would reclaim a supposed £350m Brussels takes from us each week. They knew it was a lie. Between them, they promised to spend £111bn on the NHS, cuts to VAT and council tax, higher pensions, a better transport system and replacements for the EU subsidies to the arts, science, farmers and deprived regions. When boring experts said that, far from being rich, we would face a £40bn hole in our public finances, Vote Leave knew how to fight back. In Johnsonian fashion, it said that the truth tellers were corrupt liars in Brussels’ pocket.
But so what? (rhetorical)
Lions never lose any sleep
over the opinions of sheep.
Until they poison all the meat
And see they've nothing left to eat.
Until they poison all the meat
And see they've nothing left to eat.
Sheep beget sheep
There's always fresh meat
:violin:
Sheeple
Sheeple who beget sheeple
Are the unluckiest sheeple
in the worldAnd yet, at the same time, we non-Britons are not of the culture, and so we are not aware of the nuances of it; I'm sure our thoughts on the topic are rather unsophisticated, compared to those who are in the middle of it and pay rent and use services etc.
Why did “influencers” get it wrong? Maybe because they’re in their own bubbles. They interact with themselves rather than with average people. What does this tell you about the current political debate here in America? - Robert Reich
A lot of the noise makers have convinced me they are "interacting with themselves". :eyebrow:
Twenty children lost in Wales, rescue mission launched -BBC
Lost; or, trying to hide?
Were they all named Jonah?
heh very good.
Many brits are now apparently experiencing 'buyer's remorse'. With one of them being a leading Sun columnist who has been a prominent voice for the Leave campaign:
After Brexit came “Bregret.”
A number of British voters have publicly expressed their regret over voting "Leave" in the historic referendum last Thursday when the majority of voters elected to leave the European Union.
Since then, the British Prime Minister David Cameron has resigned, the Pound has reached its lowest value since the mid-1980s and stocks have been crushed.
Several "Leave" voters have reacted to the turmoil by saying that they wish they could take back their vote. One of the latest to express his regret is Kelvin Mackenzie, columnist for the Sun newspaper, which backed Leave.
“When I put my cross against Leave I felt a surge as though for the first time in my life my vote did count. I had power,” Mackenzie wrote in today’s the Sun. “Four days later I don’t feel quite the same. I have buyer’s remorse. A sense of be careful what you wish for. To be truthful I am fearful of what lies ahead. Am I alone?”
It appears that Mackenzie is not alone. In the Independent, columnist Emily Tierney, wrote Sunday that she “Bregrexit.”
“What have we done?” she wrote. “If I could take my vote back now, I would. I’m ashamed of myself, and I want my country back.”
One voter told the BBC that he was shocked that a majority of voters had voted to Leave and that he didn’t think his own Leave vote was going to matter because he expected most people would vote to remain.
Others expressed their regret on social media.
http://abcnews.go.com/International/brexit-vote-leave-voters-express-buyers-remorse/story?id=40158309
A poll done for the Mail on Sunday suggests that of the 17.4 million people who voted Leave, somewhere around 11 million regret their vote.
I think a lot of people treated this referendum as a referendum on Westminster - a way to say Fuck you to the government and political elite
Even those who genuinely wanted the benefits of Brexit claimed by the Leave campaign have now learned that they may have been missold. The two biggest things that sold Brexit, aside from the rather amorphous claims that we could 'take our country back' were an end to free movement of EU citizens to Britain and the funneling of the money we currently send to the EU into the NHS instead. Neither of those things now look remotely likely.
We've gone from being one of the biggest players and powerbrokers in the EU to a fringe state with no voice and no power in Europe, whilst still heavily dependent on the EU for trade and industry relations. The forecasts for our country's economic future look bleak. The most optimistic is that we can retain access to the single market - but we'll do so with no voice or vote in the shaping of that market, whilst still having to adhere to its rules and strictures.
How likely is the second referendum people are petitioning for?
How likely is the second referendum people are petitioning for?
It would require some politician with balls. Unfortunately those few routinely lie to the public. Cameron could have said either he gets a revote or they must dethrone him. That would require balls to put his entire legacy on the line.
No one wants to set precedence; constantly revoting on any referendum. So Englishmen should suffer economically. Other nations are right to say that is good. Especially since it should be a wakeup call to anyone who votes for Trump - or voted for Berlusconi.
A referendum on condemnation is just as likely (and productive). UK can vote to retract the citizenship of Boris Johnson, Nigel Farage and some Sun reporters who could not bother to learn facts before making conclusions. Apparently a requirement to work for Murdoch.
Of course, that also will not happen. But it should. Since 'leavers' lied to everyone - even themselves. "Send them back to Syria." Since they and not immigrants are the problem.
Not all Britains voted for Brexit. But every British citizen can and should be criticized for stupidity. Feel free to criticize every UK citizen for voting for change: from a biggest player and powerbroker in the EU and world into a fringe state with no voice and no power. Amazing how so many British adults vote like children. How many Americans were just as easily manipulated to vote for Cruz, Fiorina, or Trump?
Not all Britains voted for Brexit
Correct - a little over half of the people who voted, voted to leave.
A little under half the people who voted, voted to remain.
Leaving is the stated will of 17.4 million people. The population of the UK is a little over 64 million.
So fuck you with your 'every British citizen' can be called stupid.
Were they all named Jonah?
Oh, come on. That was funny. ;) Kids lost in Wales? Ba dum dum...
Branyway, I'm getting brannoyed at all the brabrreviations. Not breally, it just seemed a bramusing thing to post. :p:
(probably not called abbreviations? What do you call it...like Bennifer or Brangelina...?)
I don't think such a big change should have been decided on a simple majority.
Some thing like a super majority, 60%, 67%, of all citizens elligible to vote, so not just those who bothered to turn up.
The whole thing was giant cluster fuck
Ha! I honestly didn't get it the first time, infi. You are too sharp sometimes. :)
Branyway, I'm getting brannoyed at all the brabrreviations. Not breally, it just seemed a bramusing thing to post.
[YOUTUBE]XvXGAL5rits[/YOUTUBE]
Oh, come on. That was funny. ;) Kids lost in Wales? Ba dum dum...
Branyway, I'm getting brannoyed at all the brabrreviations. Not breally, it just seemed a bramusing thing to post. :p:
(probably not called abbreviations? What do you call it...like Bennifer or Brangelina...?)
Ahh, the portmanteaux. That's the word. Brut that doesn't brassist with my brantics.
So fuck you with your 'every British citizen' can be called stupid.
Unfortunately that is the nature of an election (or referendum). Everyone takes responsibility (or blame) for the results. We (all Americans) massacred 5000 American soldiers for no purpose in Iraq. Completely irrelevant whether I said George Jr (actually Cheney) was a liar. We all decided to massacre them for no useful purpose. We all take blame because a majority did not try to protect them.
All Britains must now take responsibility for those consequences (or flee to Scotland and demand succession or flee to the EU as an immigrant). You do have options.
Does a UK citizenship still provide some rights or privileges in Canada?
How likely is the second referendum people are petitioning for?
Doesn't it look a little like the astro-turfing we get here when the elite want something so they create the support?
I admit I don't know how a country should be run, but it is very interesting how many people are saying DEMOCRACY has failed.
If the vote doesn't go a certain way the most important thing to do is override it. Or vote again until we get it right. Because the people were fooled, misled, and mistaken. Or there weren't enough of them. Or they are too ignorant, in different ways, to be trusted.
I guess I'm with you on this. But I'm not sure how hating on the vote itself, more than the result, is going to work out.
If the vote doesn't go a certain way the most important thing to do is override it. Or vote again until we get it right.
Redoing a referendum is a dangerous precedence. Do other avenues exist in UK constitutional laws (a rather unique expression from UK politicians since the UK has no Constitution)? Is anyone in the UK even discussing this?
Unfortunately that is the nature of an election (or referendum). Everyone takes responsibility (or blame) for the results. We (all Americans) massacred 5000 American soldiers for no purpose in Iraq. Completely irrelevant whether I said George Jr (actually Cheney) was a liar. We all decided to massacre them for no useful purpose. We all take blame because a majority did not try to protect them.
I know - you're quite right. It still rankles with me though :P
All Britains must now take responsibility for those consequences (or flee to Scotland and demand succession or flee to the EU as an immigrant). You do have options.
Aside from the fact all my friends and family are here - and the total lack of anything approaching adequate funds to move house ... Yorkshire is my home. Were I inclined to up sticks once the country runs aground, I'd have done so the moment the Tories got into power. All the shit that has happened to my country - and my class, was depressingly predictable once they were given free reign.
Does a UK citizenship still provide some rights or privileges in Canada?
Don't know. Probably not ;p
I admit I don't know how a country should be run, but it is very interesting how many people are saying DEMOCRACY has failed.
If the vote doesn't go a certain way the most important thing to do is override it. Or vote again until we get it right. Because the people were fooled, misled, and mistaken. Or there weren't enough of them. Or they are too ignorant, in different ways, to be trusted.
I guess I'm with you on this. But I'm not sure how hating on the vote itself, more than the result, is going to work out.
There are several reasons why people are saying that democracy failed. In terms of the people being misled - yes, they absolutely were. The twomain planks of the Leave campaign have been disavowed by the Leave campaigners now that the vote is done. A significant proportion of voters voted without really knowing anything about it. Many of those voters have since declared that they regret voting the way they did, did not expect it to actually turn into a win for Brexit, would like a do-over knowing now what they do.
A large number, possibly majority, of those voting to leave the EU were using this referendum as a protest vote having felt utterly disenfranchised and left behind by successive governments and oppositions. Democracy had already failed them and this was their expression of dissatisfaction at that failure.
There was no need for a referendum. What was needed was an actual conversation about immigration and about investment in infrastructure and jobs. Instead, governments and oppositions have, for quite some time now, used 'standing up to Brussels' as a way to look strong at election time, or 'not standing up to Brussels' as a scourge for the incumbent party. Nobody in a leadership role has been willing to seriously engage with the benefits of EU membership, or tackle the wildly inaccurate coverage of EU matters in the media. The opening to the final act in this particular frenzy, was the Prime Minister promising a referendum on EU membership in order to bolster his standing coming into an election, a promise that it would be a simple 'in - out' question - because, hey, we really don't want to complicate such an important question of our national future with any kind of nuance*, and was then followed up by leading Tories winding up the Leave campaign in order to cause political damage to the current PM and bolster their chances of winning the leadership election that will follow Cameron's demise.
The leading Brexit campaigner - Boris Johnson, has been previously fired from two jobs, one in journalism and one in politics, for lying. He is one of the biggest sellers of tabloid 'EU rules' lies (straight bananas and prawn cocktail crisps being the most well-known) in the game. Within a few days of winning, he'd been ousted by his former supporter, and didn't really put up much of a fight. In fact he's been strangely absent from much of the fuss in the immediate aftermath - he didn't for example attend the commons debate in the wake of the referendum results. Where was he/ Playing fucking cricket.
This small group of men, most of whom attended the same schools as each other, have played an elaborate game of chicken with each other They've shattered our country in order to play their game.
Nobody expected this to happen. The people who put it out to the electorate expected a narrow win for remain. On both sides. It wasn't meant to happen. It was a political football and nobody expected to actually score a goal with it. I don't think many people who voted Leave actually thought we would. We are so jaded as a democracy that we have a default expectation that nothing will really change. So many people have expressed surprise that Brexit won and their vote was a part of making it so, and many of them have also expressed sorrow that such a thing was allowed to happen. because they weren't really voting on the EU, they were voting against the government and opposition - they were voting against Westminster politics and the politicians who have failed them. Actually leaving Europe wasn't part of the plan for a lot of people who voted to leave.
* For something that could have such a profound impact on the country's future there is also a strong argument for a two-thirds or 60% majority required for change.
What was needed was an actual conversation about immigration and about investment in infrastructure and jobs. Instead, governments and oppositions have, for quite some time now, used 'standing up to Brussels' as a way to look strong at election time, or 'not standing up to Brussels' as a scourge for the incumbent party. Nobody in a leadership role has been willing to seriously engage with the benefits of EU membership, or tackle the wildly inaccurate coverage of EU matters in the media. The opening to the final act in this particular frenzy, was the Prime Minister promising a referendum on EU membership in order to bolster his standing coming into an election, a promise that it would be a simple 'in - out' question - because, hey, we really don't want to complicate such an important question of our national future with any kind of nuance*, and was then followed up by leading Tories winding up the Leave campaign in order to cause political damage to the current PM and bolster their chances of winning the leadership election that will follow Cameron's demise.
That right there is probably a best summary of what just happened. I have never heard is summarized better.
They were lied To? They let themselves be lied to because they were too lazy to find out what was really going on. I'm familiar with the problem, we have it big time.
I'm [post=963660]working[/post] on keeping some of you Brits in the EU.
It surely should have required a supermajority. I'm trying to imagine what it would take here. A Constitutional Amendment requires two-thirds vote of the House and Senate, followed by 38 out of 50 states' agreement.
But a treaty only requires two-thirds of the Senate and consent of the Pres. So economic, military, strategic partnerships can happen with a much lower bar to cross.
Like, Canada and Mexico and the US said, "OK now trade is free so bring it on" with just the Senate and Pres. But we couldn't say to Canada and Mexico, "OK, now we are together and just called 'North America' with a new set of rules and people who enforce them", without an amendment at least.
OTOH if they wanted to become US States, and asked nicely, willing to play by our rules, it only takes an act of Congress.
So I guess what I'm saying is, hey Britain, if you really want to play big time... really want to say Fuck You to the frogs in a biiiig way,...and yet still [strike]be non-racist and[/strike] allow a good number of immigrants, State #51 is England and #52 is Wales.
You can change the order if you like. Up to you.
It's been inevitable for a long time. Just finally admit it. We love you, and you love us but kinda not so much. You like us but you don't like like us. We'll be a big dysfunctional family -- which really, we are used to, have you met us?
I know the Scots will not go for it. Not even asking. And Ireland, well, they can either be 53, or 53 and 54, however they want. Of course there will be no official state religion, so might as well go 53.
Hint hint, we would do it just for Bermuda. Have you been? So very nice. So very strategic.
P.S. July 4 is Monday if you can get a vote together by then. Have you tried grilling? Do you have a back yard?
Oh man! Can you imagine Brits having to celebrate their new national holiday, July 4th? I almost think they'd appreciate the self-flagellating irony.
(no special perks for Brits in Canada)
dudes...... a referendum does not create law in the UK. It's just guidance for the government. There have to be politicians in power who agree to act on it. Cameron said he'd push the button immediately if Leave won, but he lied. I think there has to be an act of parliament to push the button. I'd be surpirsed if that happens
Cameron is just a front man for the Silence.
a referendum does not create law in the UK. It's just guidance for the government. There have to be politicians in power who agree to act on it.
Could that be Britain's out?
Cameron said he would not exercise Article 50. Leaving a next PM to implement it in November. Was that strategy to let cooler heads prevail and then ignore the referendum? Interesting comment. They cannot ignore Propositions in California. But they can ignore a referendum in Britain.
Britain cannot be state #51. Puerto Rico has dibs on that number.
Bermuda - the east coast version of Hawaii. And Iceland - the new Alaska. So much work to be done. Where do so many new stars go on the flag?
Pax Americana.Maybe Britain can exit the EU in principle; but, not in actuality and call it "Brexit with Honor."
Is coming out of the EU like coming out of the closet?
Coming out of the closet, stumbling across the hallway, and falling down the stairs.
The Brexiteers are going to need their own nightclubs.
[SIZE="4"]Brexiteers cheer on Donald Trump for promising quick trade deal with the U.K.[/SIZE]
Awwww ... :hug:
LONDON — President-elect Donald Trump has given Brexiteers hope that there will be a bilateral trade deal in the offing as British Prime Minister Theresa May prepares to give a speech expected to signal that Britain is ready to make a clean break with the European Union.
In a wide-ranging interview with the Times of London, Trump praised Britain’s decision to leave the European Union and said that the United States would “very quickly” draw up a trade deal with the United Kingdom once it leaves the bloc.
“I’m a big fan of the U.K., we’re going to work very hard to get it done quickly and done properly,” Trump said in an interview with Michael Gove, a Conservative politician and prominent Brexiteer. Gove is also a columnist for the newspaper.
A speedy U.S.-U.K. trade deal, Trump said, would be good for the United States and the United Kingdom, and he added that he plans to meet with May shortly after he takes office Friday.
“I will be meeting with [Theresa May] — in fact, if you want, you can see the letter, wherever the letter is, she just sent it. She’s requesting a meeting and we’ll have a meeting right after I get into the White House and . . . we’re gonna get something done very quickly,” he said in the interview, conducted at Trump Tower in New York. ...
... cont'd.
“I’m a big fan of the U.K., we’re going to work very hard to get it done quickly and done properly,” Trump said in an interview with Michael Gove, a Conservative politician and prominent Brexiteer.
As soon as those pesky Scots stop fucking with his golf courses. :rolleyes:
edit,
told you so.We have now moved from Bexit to Brexodus. Destruction of the British economy has begun.
We have now moved from Bexit to Brexodus. Destruction of the British economy has begun.
Oh well, bring it on :
https://www.ft.com/content/72a98d1e-e240-11e6-9645-c9357a75844a
:cool:
Oh well, bring it on : https://www.ft.com/content/72a98d1e-e240-11e6-9645-c9357a75844a
:cool:
Financial Times cannot be read without a subscription.
I asked various bank management people where they would move. I expected Frankfort as a most likely center. With Dublin or Paris as alternatives. Some completely surprised me - Belgium will be the new European home of one major US bank.
A banking center in Britain could also service 27 other countries. No longer. Worse place to run operations from will be Britian. To anyone with an education, that was obvious.
GM is continuing to sell off capital assets so that top management can claim big bonuses by creating a (fictionally creating) profit. Next to go will probably be Opel (also known as Vauxhall). Car parts are made throughout Europe. Assembled in Britain. Then sold elsewhere. No longer. Those part both incoming and assembled cars outgoing will be subject to tariffs. So most car production in Britain will close. This is good according to so many Brits; especially in the Midlands.
Best is for Scotland to succeed from Britain before Brexodus happens. Otherwise Scotland will be punished for the stupidity of so many in England. No wonder so many in England like Donald Trump.
Reuters
Earlier this month, PSA Group agreed to buy Opel from GM in a deal valuing the business at 2.2 billion euros ($2.3 billion), helping the French firm to become Europe's second largest automaker by sales.
"This will allow the group to conquer the rest of the world step by step. This remains an important goal for PSA," Jean-Philippe Peugeot said in a joint interview together with his cousin Robert Peugeot.
Detroit News
Ford Motor Co. will invest 600 million euros ($644 million) in its Saarlouis Vehicle Assembly Operations in Germany, where the company will make its next-generation Focus.
I think I would be on the Remain side whilst secretly wanting to preserve what is uniquely British. (Cheddar, Her Maj, and football hooliganism. Well do keep the cheese)
Headline: "
Humble block of cheddar cheese amongst Brexit's first victims" I thought, the fuck! Did somebody read my post or something? Then I noticed:
Irish cheddar. Right, eff them! There's no particular need to import
Irish cheddar is there? No! British cheddar has actually been defended.
And as far as the pull quote "Nobody else eats Cheddar, it can't be diverted off to France," You could leave EU and join with Britain, only then it would be BR/IE... and once again with the cheese...
Scotland will split off and join Newfoundland. They're closer than the US mainland and Hawaii.
You heard it here first... or 5th... or 50th. ;)
Prime Minister May will now demand that Ireland pay for the wall. Did she and Brexit extremists not say that yet?
The second most common phrase in British history is, "We've have finally solved the Irish problem once and for all." The most common phrase is, "What do you mean, the Irish are in revolt, again?"
h/t Mike Konrad
I've frequently hear the Irish are revolting. :yesnod:
