Down Home Terrorists
I heard the Air Force is getting low on smart bombs, but I'm sure they have a couple left.
John Wayne syndrome, they forget when Rooster Cogburn clamps the reins with his teeth and grabs his Winchester, they went to the men's room. So they missed the carnage of Cogburn and his horse run down by an M-1 Abrams.
Obviously they have visions of "real Americans" streaming to join the cause. So does ISIS.
and wasn't Cogburn was a Sheriff like the one whose family the interwebs say these guys threatened?
Nope. He was a U. S. Marshal. Like Matt Dillon on 'Gunsmoke'.
I think those Hammond (another article referred to them as having the name Hammonds) boys are getting the royal treatment. They're getting screwed by a gov't that's too damn full of itself.
I think those Hammond (another article referred to them as having the name Hammonds) boys are getting the royal treatment. They're getting screwed by a gov't that's too damn full of itself.
Ironically, it sounds like the government got too damn full of itself here because of the "get tough on crime" mandatory minimums set up by mainly right wing politicians. That's why the Hammonds are going back to prison.
I am personally against mandatory minimums and it sounds like the mandatory minimum here really are unfair, as they so often are. The courts' hands are tied though. If a person is found guilty of violating a law and there is a mandatory minimum, then you have to follow the minimum.
I hope the lesson that conservatives learn from this is that mandatory minimums are dumb. But I think they will choose to learn the lesson they already "know," which is that Obama and his administration are the devil.
I was sentenced below mandatory minimum for my offense(s) by a federal judge.
If another judge in another court decides he doesn't like the cut of my jib...
Does that mean I can be re-sentenced, and sent back to prison?
For a crime that I've already been convicted/sentenced/served my time for?
and wasn't Cogburn was a Sheriff like the one whose family the interwebs say these guys threatened?
The sheriff was threatened in Oregon, I posted a picture here somewhere, but the locals tried to keep it peaceful, knowing full well that the only hope of being successful was negotiating. Whereas Rooster Cogburn(Ammon Bundy) came up from Utah with his gang, and thinks confrontation will win the day.
Asked how he would respond to law enforcement, Bundy played down the prospect of a confrontation, saying he and the other men posed “no threat to anybody”. “This facility is owned by the people, and so if they come to bring physical harm to us, then they will be doing it only because of a facility, or a building. And I don’t believe that warrants killing people.”
That tells me his head is up his ass. What he's doing may not warrant killing people, but what he does when they say GTFO, could be interfering with law enforcement, resisting arrest, and that whole slew of catchall charges, they throw when you make them late for supper. We've already seen that can get you seriously killed, not mostly dead, and the Feds have orders of magnitude more firepower than any police department. It's not a protest like the Wall Street occupiers, it's an armed insurrection which is a whole new ball game. Wounded knee, David Koresh, Ruby Ridge, Philly's MOVE, etc,etc,etc.
...Wounded knee, David Koresh, Ruby Ridge, Philly's MOVE, etc,etc,etc.
I'm not sure Wounded Knee or Ruby Ridge are on the same planet as the Bundy/militia/Oregon/webeindisbuilding thing, other than a fucked up gov't being involved.
MOVE, I don't know from.
Whereas [Ammon Bundy] came up from Utah with his gang, and thinks confrontation will win the day.
I'm don't think he's planning on 'winning'.
Wounded knee and Ruby ridge were both making a stand against the government. That didn't work in the whiskey rebellion or any time since. Subversion, dirty politics, any number of ways around them, but public defiance can not be tolerated, the government can not afford to lose face.
Oh I think Bundy plans to win, surely his gazillion facebook fans/email buddies, will pick up their ARs, and join his stand for the god fearing farmer/rancher, being downtrodden by the east coast eggheads/liberal media, who control the government. Just as surely as the government will cower in fear, when confronted with armed patriots defending the constitution because god is on their side.
Bundy is delusional. He saw the government treat his old man with kid gloves to avoid a big stink, so now he thinks they'll do the same for him and his band of merry men. Nope. no way, he won't win, and could very well become a martyr, but he doesn't know that yet.
... at least a dozen heavily armed men who seized the headquarters of the Malheur wildlife refuge on Saturday afternoon and said they would stay indefinitely. ...
All the Feds have to do is put a fence up on the grounds around the headquarters building and rename it the Malheur Detention Center (shades of Guantanamo).
The Force is strong with this one.
Certainly they'll box them in, cut off any food, water, power, and visitors until it's time to tell them to GTFO.
That's why they didn't wait longer to do this even though more time would have been useful to cache resources in the vicinity. They realized they wouldn't be able to survive long without air conditioning once the power was cut in warmer weather. :D
Well, that and it's easier to detect intruders in the snow.
They'll probably start shooting each other the day they run out of coffee.
Maybe I'm late to this, but as the traditional news media struggles with how to label these guys, social media steps up with:
"y'all-qaeda," "yee-hawdists," and "yokel haram."
Funny. It's the people whose attitude is "If the government (a cop) tells an unarmed black man to do something and he doesn't do it, he deserve to be shot" now have the attitude "If the government tells an armed red neck to do something and he doesn't do it, the government is evil"
Nitwits.
You can buy a bumper sticker...
http://www.byebyeblm.org/
CATO, yeah I know, but they have very good one page background of this mess called, "
No Good Guys in the West". Definitely worth a gander.
More militia showing up. Don't these people have jobs or do they live off the state they claim to despise?
Farms and ranches are slow in the winter, the hired hands can handle things.
If we put up a Malheur Occupation Memorial with their names on it, maybe they'll be satisfied and go home.
A suggestion for next time, leave your guns at home, find a BLM facility, chain yourselves to it, write a coherent list of grievances, engage with your representatives and the rule writers in the administration. You lost us at armed take-over.
I've seen organized groups of people make incremental change by engaging with their government. It takes a huge shift from where we've been intellectually but a functional democracy demands that of us.
precisely
Nobody is interested in what their beef is or whether it's even logical or reasonable. We do know they made a bigger fuckup of things and acted more tyrannically, more irrationally, and with more planned deadly force than the government did.
A suggestion for next time, leave your guns at home, find a BLM facility, chain yourselves to it, write a coherent list of grievances, engage with your representatives and the rule writers in the administration. You lost us at armed take-over.
I've seen organized groups of people make incremental change by engaging with their government. It takes a huge shift from where we've been intellectually but a functional democracy demands that of us.
Yes, And obey the law until you can change it.
Only if it's an important law. For example, requiring pedestrians to push a button so they can cross at a signaled intersection. I'll push the button, but if the timing is off and I get there just as the lights are changing and I get a green, but no walk signal, there is no way in hell I'm waiting for a full cycle of the lights just so a walk signal will pop up for me 2 minutes later and I can be all legal about it. It's bullshit and I'll break that law in a heartbeat. Fucking prejudiced highway department.
So yeah. Taking over a federal building by armed force is going too far, but crossing a street with the lights is reasonable. Even if both are illegal.
We do know they made a bigger fuckup of things and acted more tyrannically, more irrationally, and with more planned deadly force than the government did.
The Feds learned that it is a mistake to be rocking like Janet Reno.
I don't oppose breaking a law to make a point as long as you're willing to accept the consequences and nobody is injured by your actions.
They should have called it Occupy BLM, never washed and lived in tents. Then that would have been a-okay.
if they left their guns at home
These guys were just
MOVE with a different agenda
They should have called it Occupy BLM, never washed and lived in tents. Then that would have been a-okay.
if they left their guns at home
Pretty much. Considering the big issue is the armed occupation of a building, if they'd lived in tents and not been armed, they would have been fine...
Probably still arrested eventually, though.
And pay a $50 fine instead of prison time.