Kony 2012

No has talked about this yet? tsk tsk.

There's a link in the upsetting me thread posted by BigV.

Most people are aware of the campaign by now though aren't they?

Facebook is dragging us into wars now? I haven't read a lot about it but it seems like there is an evil rebel and an evil regime and this movement wants us to fight the evil rebel?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/michael-deibert/joseph-kony-2012-children_b_1327417.html

I know I said before that I'm glad that this is in the public eye, and I am, but I'd like to add some things to that.
There are several issues with the viral video in the sense that it vastly over-simplifies the issue. This doesn't bother me hugely because it made a big impact and this can act as a trigger to get people to talk about the complex issues. If it was too complicated, it probably wouldn't be the success it is.
But now I have found out that there are serious concerns about the Invisible Children charity... I didn't know that before, not being au fait with US based charities. I don't doubt they do some valuable work, but in my opinion there are better charities out there.
I broadly agree with this article, which raises many interesting points and provides further links.

Funny, I just read where they took in over $8 million last year, only under $3 million went to help.

[ATTACH]37715[/ATTACH]

O.K. let me get this straight, a lot of people want to send me to Africa to get this guy, but 99% of these same people will not volunteer to join me...Hmmmmm...I say go fuck yourselves. And I'll go where the President tells me to go. Still, don't want to join me yet??? Go fuck yourselves.

[COLOR="White"]I've had a bit of an attitude problem lately, I know.[/COLOR]

Aliantha;800533 wrote:

There's a link in the upsetting me thread posted by BigV.

Didn't see that. Apologies BigV.

Blueflare wrote:

I know I said before that I'm glad that this is in the public eye, and I am, but I'd like to add some things to that.
There are several issues with the viral video in the sense that it vastly over-simplifies the issue. This doesn't bother me hugely because it made a big impact and this can act as a trigger to get people to talk about the complex issues. If it was too complicated, it probably wouldn't be the success it is.

I'm on the same page. I tip my hat to them in the sense that their video production and marketing was brilliant and they were extremely successful in putting Kony in the mainstream spotlight. I have never seen such a tremendous response from an awareness campaign. Also, the idea of getting the population to pressure the government into making "ethical" foreign policy decisions is a powerful, unexploited idea in democratic societies.

On the other hand, the more I read about Kony, Uganda, and Invisible Children the more I feel IC has no clue what the hell they are doing. They are great video producers who can create a moving, powerful film about real issues but I agree that they have simplified the issue to a point, not to mention the racist and arrogant overtones of the entire thing, where they will most likely cause more harm than good. They also grossly misrepresented the situation to an extreme where I am guessing they are unwilling to accept how the circumstances in Uganda have changed and how it deviated from their original goal so now they must basically lie to save face.

Freelance Journalist Michael Wilkerson pointed out in a blog post for FP this week that this fear of some imminent withdrawal of the U.S. advisors doesn't seem to be based on any actual statements from the Obama administration.

"So the goal is to make sure that President Obama doesn't withdraw the advisors he deployed until Kony is captured or killed. That seems noble enough, except that there has been no mention by the government of withdrawing those forces -- at least any I can find," Wilkerson wrote.

.....

In a Feb. 22 briefing with reporters, Navy Rear Adm. Brian Losey, commander of Special Operations Command Africa, said that the LRA is on the run and is down to about 200 core fighters.

"Now they are only a small percentage of their former strength," Losey said.

http://thecable.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2012/03/09/state_department_no_reason_to_think_we_are_calling_off_the_kony_hunt

regular.joe;800690 wrote:

O.K. let me get this straight, a lot of people want to send me to Africa to get this guy, but 99% of these same people will not volunteer to join me...Hmmmmm...I say go fuck yourselves. And I'll go where the President tells me to go. Still, don't want to join me yet??? Go fuck yourselves.

[COLOR="White"]I've had a bit of an attitude problem lately, I know.[/COLOR]

Well you wouldn't go there until the President said so anyway. Apparently there is already a small force of US soldiers there acting as advisors.

Aren't most military interventions (or whatever you call them) enacted because people feel something needs to be done? Isn't this just more overt than anything we've seen before.

I'm still reserved in my judgement. I really think it's a UN issue, but what do I know?

Either way, this man Kony is just one of hundreds of others who bring terror to the lives of others for personal gain. It would be nice to see them all dethroned, but I guess it never happens till someone on the outside takes an interest.

Not really my point. I'm saying that a bunch of peacenicks with a whole lot of good intentions really want some one else to go and do the dirty work for their conscience.

Oh, and I've known about the advisors helping to hunt the LRA since they were sent there.

regular.joe;800690 wrote:

O.K. let me get this straight, a lot of people want to send me to Africa to get this guy, but 99% of these same people will not volunteer to join me...Hmmmmm...I say go fuck yourselves. And I'll go where the President tells me to go. Still, don't want to join me yet??? Go fuck yourselves.

[COLOR=White]I've had a bit of an attitude problem lately, I know.[/COLOR]

I don't quite follow, Joe. Are you referring to other military personnel or to the general public?

I think he's saying that if they really were committed could have spent their production money on a rifle and a pocketful of rounds but instead prefer to pressure the US government into sending war weary troops into a situation with no upside.

Kony 2012? The GOP are getting desperate!

I didn't watch the video because I don't drink coffee.

Aliantha;800718 wrote:

Either way, this man Kony is just one of hundreds of others who bring terror to the lives of others for personal gain. It would be nice to see them all dethroned, but I guess it never happens till someone on the outside takes an interest.

True. As long as there is a market, there will always be suppliers, the only way to stop it is to destroy the market.

HungLikeJesus;800790 wrote:

I didn't watch the video because I don't drink coffee.

Can I freshen up your kool-aid?

regular.joe;800728 wrote:

Not really my point. I'm saying that a bunch of peacenicks with a whole lot of good intentions really want some one else to go and do the dirty work for their conscience.

Yeah I realised that.

What I was trying to say is that isn't that the way it always is though. The armed forces are there to follow through with what the general public (or peaceniks) think are important issues? I'm still not getting my message across I don't think, but what I'm wondering is why you're upset about this political action which may or may not become a military operation, when things like this happen all the time. This is just a normal/usual sort of process.

regular.joe;800728 wrote:

Not really my point. I'm saying that a bunch of peacenicks with a whole lot of good intentions really want some one else to go and do the dirty work for their conscience.

Meh. Usually it's a bunch of hawks doing the same thing, but so that they can increase their power/wealth.

I have the same attitude towards a bunch of young republican ivy league students who absolutely believe that we must send our military to Afganistan and fight the good fight but are totally unwilling to volunteer to go themselves.

This has already become a military operation, Special Operations is already deployed and specifically helping in the hunt for the LRA.

To be accurate, I totally believe that we should be helping to fight this type of thing going on in the world. I totally believe that just because we don't have a national interest in the area we should not show some level of involvement, it is in our best interest not to be selfish fucks. But, then again we can't be all things to all people.

My problem is with a group of people who want to send guys like me places to fight, bleed, and die for a fight they themselves are not committed to fighting. It really doesn't matter if it's for their profit or their conscience.

The citizens of this country have an all volunteer warrior class to fight their fights for them. They don't have to care whether you do it for patriotism; or, just a paycheck. They figure that if you take the money, you can do their bidding. They're right, you're just the hired help, don't be getting all uppity now.

regular.joe;800883 wrote:

To be accurate, I totally believe that we should be helping to fight
this type of thing going on in the world. I totally believe that just because we don't have
a national interest in the area we should not show some level of involvement,
it is in our best interest not to be selfish fucks.
But, then again we can't be all things to all people.

My problem is with a group of people who want to send guys like me
to places to fight, bleed, and die for a fight they themselves are not committed to fighting.
It really doesn't matter if it's for their profit or their conscience.

Joe, I'm with you in your first paragraph, but not the second.

Whatever reasons you had for volunteering into the military, such as
patriotism, money, lack of alternatives, family heritage, etc,
they were your reasons and no one can/should quarrel with them.

But likewise, your quarrel with people who have not volunteered for the military are misplaced,
because you can't know their reasons for doing whatever they are doing in life.

For whatever military missions are created by the politicians,
I believe everyone is respectful of what is all to often
a glib reference to as the "sacrifice of our military".
The sacrifices of the soldiers and their families are real, and are truly respected,
even if the political arguments and decisions that led to them are not.

Sexabon has put it harshly, but with a volunteer military, each
enlistee should know and realize what they are volunteering to do.

But, it is disrespectful by someone in the military to denigrate the motives of others,
even when those outside the military are advocating or protesting some decision
by the political leaders (President) to proceed or not, with some particular military action.

I know and realize what I have volunteered to do. Maybe I am being disrespectful, that would be because I have little respect for someone who will stand up, rant and rave for something but not have the wherewithal to do more then spend some money and send someone else to ease their attack of conscience. I wonder if 10,000 people showed up to a make Koney famous rally how many would subsequently volunteer to go and do the job.

I realize it's unfair to hold the military to a "Salute and say Yes, Sir" rule.
So, I guess, that's the rule the military has agreed to follow.

We've had massive demonstrations over the Viet Nam War, the invasion of Irag, the "surges" in Afghanistan, etc.
What would you have people (outside the military) do if/when they have political opinions ?

ETA:
FWIW: I have not seen the KONY movie, so I have no opinion about that issue.

I would have them vote to send a surge of soldiers to Afghanistan, and volunteer to be a part of that surge.

Sometimes I think I really like Starship Trooper model. In the novel, people don't get the privileges and rights of citizen ship unless they have proven their willingness to put the only significant thing they have, their life, on the line in military service. Then you get to vote on policy. Until then, you are a member of society but not a citizen.

OK. I can say I understand your position, but disagree with it.

regular.joe wrote:

Maybe I am being disrespectful, that would be because I have little respect for someone who will stand up, rant and rave for something but not have the wherewithal to do more then spend some money and send someone else to ease their attack of conscience. I wonder if 10,000 people showed up to a make Koney famous rally how many would subsequently volunteer to go and do the job.

I can understand this mindset. On the other hand, IC doesn't seem to be calling for US military intervention, but rather for money, technology, and training for the African soldiers currently pursuing Kony. And the filmmaker, at least, seems to make very regular trips to Africa himself and be personally involved in the work they've done to rebuild schools and communities.

I do find it disappointing that only 37% (according to an interview I saw with the CEO) of their funds go directly to Uganda, but as an organization that has lived thus far almost exclusively on the support of college students, I can understand how their travel and media budgets would need to be larger than other charities'. It isn't hard to find charities with much, much worse overhead cost ratios.

Koney! I'll take a loose burger, no mustard, no onions, and a side of chili cheese fries.

Thank you for the levity HLJ. Lord knows I need it.

regular.joe;800690 wrote:

O.K. let me get this straight, a lot of people want to send me to Africa to get this guy, but 99% of these same people will not volunteer to join me...Hmmmmm...I say go fuck yourselves. And I'll go where the President tells me to go. Still, don't want to join me yet??? Go fuck yourselves.

[COLOR="White"]I've had a bit of an attitude problem lately, I know.[/COLOR]

Agreed.

..

But Joe, I'd just slow you up. :o
It appears the troops Obama sent last fall caused Kony to lay low for awhile, until he recently popped up in the Congo. Haven't heard if our guys will follow him there or not.

R.joe - it sounds to me like you're burned out. Maybe you need to look into a new career.

76 million hits and ten million dollars raised in two weeks. WOW.

HLJ, I have no idea what to do when I grow up. About three more years though and I'll be through. Good on these guys, they are doing what the can with the talents God gave them. It will take some long term engagement in the region and country to make a difference. Maybe I'll get a job doing some of that kind of thing with the Dept. of State since that's my line of work in the Army.

I think that citizens have the right to vote or express an opinion even though they aren't physically involved (at risk).

I know you won't watch this at work, but just in case NSFW for language.


[YOUTUBE]P7NRCkxivwo&feature=share[/YOUTUBE]

Heh heh heh. :thumb:

Sometimes you really have to be careful what you ask for. You just might get it. And then what do you do? Well, aparently you take off all your clothes and celebrate in the streets!

I hope the guy is alright in the long run, really.

I always knew he was crazy but I wasn't expecting that...