Mental Illness
My sister, who I love, has a problem. I titled the thread mental illness, but who knows it could be a botfly / T. gondii infestation. I know she has a severe drinking problem as well. I don't know what her problem is, I just know symptoms. I do know what my problem is, she calls me a lot. Sometimes several times a day, at all hours of the day and night.
I want to help her, I feel like there's something she needs and I would like to help her find it, but I don't know what it is or how to get it. Talking with her is an exercise in frustration. She's sometimes speaking clearly, but confusingly. Sometimes she's clearly drunk and I just wrap up the conversation right away. There's a lot of history with her (she is my sister after all) and I love her and want the best for her. But I don't know what to do.
Hell, I don't even know what to ask my friends here. Fuck.
Do you think she is ever suicidal?
:scratches head:
First idea. Could the drinking be a way of self-medicating to suppress/hide from whatever other symptoms/issues she is dealing with?
What do other family members say? In this type of situation, normally a united front is best, and then a family action plan should be put in place. It's very hard for one person to be the support network of someone who is either an alcoholic or suffering from mental illness. In fact, it's almost impossible.
If you don't have other family members to talk to about this, then I'd suggest talking to a mental health professional and describing the symptoms and ask for real advice. I don't know what the rules are where you are, but if the person is violent in any way and the police are called, you can have the person committed for a period of time for assessment. This is obviously not ideal, but sometimes can be a starting point in getting the person to realise that you can't deal with their issues alone anymore.
I would be pretty sure that is the case, Zen
My thought is this: As long as she's not realistically suicidal, set some ground rules about when it's ok to call. Don't answer the phone in the middle of the night. Does she call from her cell or a landline?
You are going to be better placed to help her and understand the problem if you are not burned out and frustrated by too many calls and calls when you are not in your best place mentally (i.e. woken up by the phone....)
I want to help her, I feel like there's something she needs and I would like to help her find it, but I don't know what it is or how to get it.
While this is a noble and normal instinct for a family member to have, it may not be the best choice right now. If the phone calls aren't helping her (and we know they certainly aren't helping you,) it may be time to set some new boundaries. Whether it would be better to couch it in terms of her getting help for her drinking, or for other symptoms she may have, I don't know. Different people would take greater offense at either suggestion. But if you were going to be able to magically solve her problems, surely you'd have done it by now? She needs more than you can give, and she's not going to get it until you convince her to look elsewhere, preferably to a professional.
Wise is Clodfobble. Al - Anon is a good resource,. Naturally if she is
Is suicidal/homicidal you must act immediately but you know
that. My sons OCD was driving me nuts and, for me, I had to
cut him out of my life b/c he refused any and all help.
Ps - docs can't diagnose until she is sober.
How the F is it that Wolf is out of work?? It's not like there's nothing for her to do!
Seriously, homegirl should start an advice column. I know this person whose mom was a syndicated advice columnist and this chick, (the daughter) now in the autumn of her years has been farting through silk her whole life.
Seriously, homes. Start advising.
eta: I meant Clod, but the same applies to Wolf, although Wolf's column would be more like Dan Savage meets Art Buchwald.
Seriously, homegirl should start an advice column. I know this person whose mom was a syndicated advice columnist and this chick, (the daughter) now in the autumn of her years has been farting through silk her whole life.
Seriously, homes. Start advising.
advising == easy
getting paid =/= easy
Oh Zen, you beautiful fool. There,s plenty for wolf to do - its just
That we merkins don't want to pay her! We're just gonna deny them
care and see how that goes.
Oh Zen, you beautiful fool. There,s plenty for wolf to do - its just
That we merkins don't want to pay her! We're just gonna deny them
care and see how that goes.
Hold my meds, watch this!
... I feel like there's something she needs and I would like to help her find it, but I don't know what it is ...
What did she say when you asked her?
Brianna, just use the code-word: community care.
That is what Martin Bryant was receiving in 1997.
Then he went on a rampage and killed 35 people.
I think the biggest part of recovery is admitting you have a problem. Once you accept that you are mentally ill you sort of take you meds and submit to the doctors. Could you imagine someone with cancer saying.. "I'm not sick". Alcoholism is a disease in an of it self. I don't have a problem with it so I don't know. I've been to a few AA meetings for weed but I'm not an addict. My advice get help asap, the longer you go untreated the harder it is to recover.
Has anyone else been wondering if this is Pensive Pams sister?
or brother/mother/father/cousin....
surely no-one on here is naive/stupid enough to pass on the password to a banned user..... oh wait.... :rolleyes:
Huh? You mean I wasn't supposed to post it on FB?
Monster is right about setting boundaries ... sisteranonymous calls at three am because you answer the phone.
Express your concern, certainly, but set those limits!
Talking to a drunk isn't typically productive. Try to call her when you have an expectation of sobriety. If she calls drunk, tell her you'll talk when she sobers up. If she calls drunk and threatens suicide, send the cops to her house.
P.S. Anon, feel free to PM me from your regular account.
wait what exactly are the indicators that she's mentally ill? i've seen way too many people cry wolf over that one...
Well, we've at least established that she is a drunk. And here in America, consistent drunkenness and mental illness are considered two sides of the same coin. Crazy until proven innocent.
Well, we've at least established that she is a drunk. And here in America, consistent drunkenness and mental illness are considered two sides of the same coin. Crazy until proven innocent.
well that's just an addiction... something you might genetically tend towards but not a condition you are stuck with... and most uses of mental illness sort of suggest the later (even if it doesn't always applies).
just a thought - i remember reading that the pill that is useful for smoking is also useful for reducing the affects of other addictions, and its really easy to get a subscription too (by saying that.. well, that your a smoker. whose going to check?). could be better then AA.
also, low-calorie beer... can anything get you off of alcohol quicker?
then there's... you know, AA.
i really don't think there is a point in diagnosing a mental illness until you take the alcohol out of the way, it's like trying to diagnose whether you have ADD when your on weed.
Mentally ill people abuse substances, substance abusers have signs or symptoms of mental illness. Hard to say which is the chicken or which is the egg, even when the individual is sober.
It's hard to fathom, traceur, but Americans have a very different relationship with alcohol than folks in other parts of the world.
It's hard to fathom, traceur, but Americans have a very different relationship with alcohol than folks in other parts of the world.
different how and... from which parts?
edit: i've just learned to be extremely skeptical whenever someone says the words "we are different"
and now you just learned that wolf is a very experienced mental health professional who is known for being spot on.....
Traceur, before you go much further, read these two threads.
Tales from the Nuthouse: Lest You Think I have a Really Cool Job
Tales from the Nuthouse: Lest You Think I have a Really Suck Job
Not only will they establish Wolf's credibility in dealing with mental illness and alcoholism, but they're as entertaining as any thread here.
"Cry Wolf " Bwahahaa.
Actually, I'm curious to know what makes Americas relationship with alcohol different to that of other countries.
If you wouldn't mind wolf. I mean no disrespect at all and I'm really surprised by that statement.
In other countries where alcohol consumption is accepted, it has often been considered to be in the same category as food and other beverages. There's even been a correlation between the types of alcohol and foods for each region. Here, it's mostly been perceived as a drug (i.e. a recreational pharmaceutical rather than a part of; or, extension of meals). In other countries, alcohol may be administered as a medication and adjunct to treatment in healthcare settings. Here, it's almost never used that way which relegates it to the status of an illicit drug (albeit legal). These differences have been diminishing as changing global socio-economic conditions increase the level of alcohol abuse across the board and others (politicians in particular) find out through cross cultural experience that it's easier to do what we here have always done and stigmatize the substance (alcohol) rather than address the underlying causes for its abuse. These relationships are more apparent to healthcare professionals like wolf who deal in part with the ramifications of these issues.
What sexobon said.
I was going to say that we're more uptight about it. I've been drinking with folks from other countries. You seem to do a lot more of it than we do, and are much more casual about it, and have a far greater capacity to tolerate the booze, as well.
Also, there's a "pub culture" that we do not share in here in the colonies.
In other countries where alcohol consumption is accepted, it has often been considered to be in the same category as food and other beverages. There's even been a correlation between the types of alcohol and foods for each region. Here, it's mostly been perceived as a drug (i.e. a recreational pharmaceutical rather than a part of; or, extension of meals). In other countries, alcohol may be administered as a medication and adjunct to treatment in healthcare settings. Here, it's almost never used that way which relegates it to the status of an illicit drug (albeit legal). These differences have been diminishing as changing global socio-economic conditions increase the level of alcohol abuse across the board and others (politicians in particular) find out through cross cultural experience that it's easier to do what we here have always done and stigmatize the substance (alcohol) rather than address the underlying causes for its abuse. These relationships are more apparent to healthcare professionals like wolf who deal in part with the ramifications of these issues.
hmm.. i'd actually say that israel is moving more towards the american attitude in recent years. the minimum age has being changed from 18 to 21 (to my little sister's despair), and the old jewish rituals of passing the wine now commonly include a "special wine for kids" which is really a glorified and expansive grape-juice in a wine bottle...
i've also read that "drunk and disorderly" charges got someone fired even when they did on their free time (over the weekend), and the court ruled in favor of the employer, so not being allowed to get drunk as a company policy might become more common, apparently its something to do with employee health insurance policies.
still, at least we can still buy beer in the supermarket. in canada it's much worst - you have to go or order from special alcohol licensed stores which usually sell nothing but alcohol. your also not allowed to drink in public (restaurants and bars being the exception).
in america i've noticed it's different from state to state. in Philadelphia you can buy alcohol wherever you want to (and weed... and coke... really i guess i didn't live in the best part of town), while in Washington you need to go to special "alcohol and smokes" store.
No no, the weed and coke you can get anywhere in Philly, but the alcohol is weirdly regulated. booze and wine is only sold in state-owned shops, pubs/bars/taverns can only sell you up to 12 beers at a time, cases of beer are only sold at licensed "beverage distributors".
You can only buy booze from licensed premises here in Australia.
I remember when I went to Bali a few years ago thinking how awesome it was that I could go buy beer from the supermarket.
Japan. Supermarkets, 24 hour convenience stores, vending machines.
I went to two festivals where sake was given out free. Hic.
They really only do one drug, but they do it very enthusiastically.
Japan. Supermarkets, 24 hour convenience stores, vending machines.
I went to two festivals where sake was given out free. Hic.
They really only do one drug, but they do it very enthusiastically.
This is true. My ex was the bar manager at the country club and the japanese members (we have a lot of Honda plants and a warehouse in the area) could put some beer away!
They'd smoke powdered badger testicles if ya told 'em to.
Well who wouldn't? You holding? :lol:
Yebbut, I ain't giving it away.
pssssst. how much for the badger balls dude?
This is true. My ex was the bar manager at the country club
and the japanese members (we have a lot of Honda plants and a warehouse in the area)
could put some beer away!
I don't know if this applies, or even true, but we thought we saw
it actually happen during business trips in several cities of Japan.
We were told that "after work" gatherings with the boss were part of normal business,
and excess alcohol was permitted or encouraged because
it permitted underlings to say all sorts of things to their overlings.
On a couple of occasions, I felt there was some "fake" drinking going on,
followed by remarks to the boss that could have otherwise been career-enders.
Custom then required that nothing be remembered or amiss at work the next day.
All was ignored on assumption that any improprieties were alcohol-induced.
I think it was a very good system for communication with the boss.
pssssst. how much for the badger balls dude?
If you have to ask, you can't afford it.
:D
I gotta go.
'S coming up on powdered badger testicle time...
:joint:
I don't know if this applies, or even true, but we thought we saw it actually happen during business trips in several cities of Japan.
We were told that "after work" gatherings with the boss were part of normal business, and excess alcohol was permitted or encouraged because it permitted underlings to say all sorts of things to their overlings.
On a couple of occasions, I felt there was some "fake" drinking going on, followed by remarks to the boss that could have otherwise been career-enders.
Custom then required that nothing be remembered or amiss at work the next day. All was ignored on assumption that any improprieties were alcohol-induced.
I think it was a very good system for communication with the boss.
I have been told similar things by friends living and working in Japan. When your culture is cultishly devoted to "saving face," you have to have an outlet or nothing will ever get done.
I used to work for Mazda, and I saw this happen on a few occasions.
I dunno how Japanese that custom is, same thing applied at GE BITD. The :bong::beer::doit::boxers::vomit: was real though, no pretended intoxication.
They'd smoke powdered badger testicles if ya told 'em it was an aphrodisiac.
I don't know if this applies, or even true, but we thought we saw
it actually happen during business trips in several cities of Japan.
We were told that "after work" gatherings with the boss were part of normal business,
and excess alcohol was permitted or encouraged because
it permitted underlings to say all sorts of things to their overlings.
On a couple of occasions, I felt there was some "fake" drinking going on,
followed by remarks to the boss that could have otherwise been career-enders.
Custom then required that nothing be remembered or amiss at work the next day.
All was ignored on assumption that any improprieties were alcohol-induced.
I think it was a very good system for communication with the boss.
There's an element of this in the UK. Or at least there used to be. I'm sure it's been tempered by the American influence by now. I used to be Saturday staff in a store and we'd often all go to the pub after work (no Sunday opening then). It's open season on the boss in the pub. And they get the first round. Same when i worked in Market reasearch at Uni and we went away for weekends. Once the day was done Saturday night in the bar the boss baought the first round and heard the complaints and let it ride. Sunday we all went back to work.
Same thing with office christmas parties.
No no, the weed and coke you can get anywhere in Philly, but the alcohol is weirdly regulated. booze and wine is only sold in state-owned shops, pubs/bars/taverns can only sell you up to 12 beers at a time, cases of beer are only sold at licensed "beverage distributors".
what? when did that happen? 4 years ago i remember buying beer at the gas station.
That's been the setup in all of Pennsylvania, for generations. Maybe you were in Delaware?
Or Ohio?
All us Merkins look alike. :lol:
That's been the setup in all of Pennsylvania, for generations. Maybe you were in Delaware?
Def NOT DE. Md perhaps or that godforsaken state of NJ. :rolleyes:
Def NOT DE. Md perhaps or that godforsaken state of NJ. :rolleyes:
No gas station booze in NJ. I've seen that in MD.
This has drifted a little, hasn't it :D.
Here, my favourite off-licence (= liquor store) is also a petrol (=gas) station and DIY [SIZE="1"](Monster! Help! What's the American for DIY?!?!??)[/SIZE] store.
Here, hold my beer, watch this ... boom ... all in one store.
In the US, it would be a drive-thru.
... DIY [SIZE=1](Monster! Help! What's the American for DIY?!?!??)[/SIZE] store.
You mean like a hardware or home-improvement store?
You mean like a hardware or home-improvement store?
That's the one!!
Sent by thought transference
Here, hold my beer, watch this ... boom ... all in one store.
In the US, it would be a drive-thru.
I didn't used to be a drive-thru ...
Actually, there was a drive through beer distributor in one of the towns I lived in. You drove in, popped the trunk, told the guy what you wanted, they loaded the beer into the trunk (must not be accessible from the passenger compartment in Pennsy, you see), and handed the money out the window to the fellow.
We ended up on a campsite next to a drive-up bar on one of our roadtrips. I think it was in Nebraska
I'm just checking in with you for an update. Your suggestions are all helpful and welcome and I'm thankful for them. I did speak with my sister since the episode that prompted this thread and she was completely different, and I attribute the difference to alcohol.
She has her share of problems in life as all of us do. When she drinks, her ability to cope is overwhelmed. Old problems, little problems, non-existent problems loom large and scare her into action. Not panic, but holyshit, what are we going to do about _______. The thing in the blank might be something that happened in our childhood. Or the weather earlier in the week, or some other thing that can't be dealt with, but still freaks her out. She's reaching out to me for... something, but I don't have whatever it is she needs during these episodes.
The answer is to just hang up the phone. That's not too hard, it's good advice and I have a start on this habit. Thank you my friends for your concern and your wisdom.