AG Refugees

marichiko • Mar 28, 2006 2:11 pm
Why don't you children just come on down here and post away at each other and leave the rest of us old farts in peace? (see the "This is not porn" thread for an example) :neutral:
Flint • Mar 28, 2006 2:29 pm
:::CBOL:::@"children"

Is this a mature and dignified declaration of internet forum war?
Kitsune • Mar 28, 2006 3:26 pm
For those of you Cellarites needing translation, "CBOL" is "Chuckled Briefly Outloud" or it could be "Consortium for the Bar Code of Life", depending. This is just in case you didn't know.
ferret88 • Mar 28, 2006 4:04 pm
Thanks, Kit. That was a new one to me. Either I'm that old, or that new to this.

I like the well-considered responses that in general show up around here. Though I'm not averse to the one-line shot in response.


The ... uh ... refugees seem to be either trying to take over or trying to incite verbal violence.

What's up with that?

It's freaking me out. I thought I was posting a lot lately (it's been slow at work.) But this is ...
Flint • Mar 28, 2006 4:07 pm
it's okay, baby, it's okay, ssshhh now

::: pats ferret on head ::: ouch! it bit me
Kitsune • Mar 28, 2006 4:09 pm
It happens every so often. Take a coffee break until it subsides, or maybe even get some work done if you feel inclined.
Flint • Mar 28, 2006 4:10 pm
Right, because who wants actual posts on a message board? Message boards are for looking at, not posting on.
Kitsune • Mar 28, 2006 4:17 pm
Flint wrote:
Right, because who wants actual posts on a message board? Message boards are for looking at, not posting on.


Whoa -- it's okay, baby. I'm sorry for the "rapid fire" comment. Maybe you'd like to share a little bit about yourselves? What kind of refugees are you? Do you seek political asylum?
Flint • Mar 28, 2006 4:21 pm
"political asylum" like the Puppet Master in Ghost in the Shell?

I have a boring job. You'll get to know me, I'm pretty great.
Kitsune • Mar 28, 2006 4:23 pm
Flint wrote:
I have a boring job. You'll get to know me, I'm pretty great.


Yeah? Interested in sharing anything about your job?
Flint • Mar 28, 2006 4:26 pm
I would, but I'm kinda busy right now. Not kidding.
ferret88 • Mar 28, 2006 4:33 pm
But, Kit, I don't drink coffee.
ferret88 • Mar 28, 2006 4:34 pm
Flint wrote:
it's okay, baby, it's okay, ssshhh now

::: pats ferret on head ::: ouch! it bit me



Serves you right. :rar: :yum: :lol:
Don't call me "baby."
Flint • Mar 28, 2006 4:36 pm
It's Janet? Ms.Jackson if I'm nasty?
ferret88 • Mar 28, 2006 4:36 pm
Clever. But no.
Trilby • Mar 28, 2006 5:02 pm
Ahhh--flint lists one of his (her?) occupations as (ahem) 'geeking'.

That sooooo puts things in perspective!
Flint • Mar 28, 2006 5:06 pm
my Cellar profile doubles as a resume'
SteveDallas • Mar 28, 2006 5:08 pm
Kitsune wrote:
For those of you Cellarites needing translation, "CBOL" is "Chuckled Briefly Outloud" or it could be "Consortium for the Bar Code of Life", depending. This is just in case you didn't know.

Thank God. I thought we were facing an influx of COBOL programmers who couldn't type.
thrillhouse • Mar 28, 2006 5:43 pm
along those same lines. . . .

how could you abbreviate/speak online for "guffaw." which often happens to me after reading a good posting, which then caused the reader to exlcaim, "that [blankety-blank] just made me spit my coffee/beer/vodka/red bull on the keyboard. ROFL"
Kitsune • Mar 28, 2006 5:47 pm
Flint wrote:
my Cellar profile doubles as a resume'


Can you explain the concept of "geek drumming"?

:::LSHITU:::
funkykule • Mar 28, 2006 6:13 pm
thrillhouse wrote:
along those same lines. . . .

how could you abbreviate/speak online for "guffaw." which often happens to me after reading a good posting, which then caused the reader to exlcaim, "that [blankety-blank] just made me spit my coffee/beer/vodka/red bull on the keyboard. ROFL"


I think fnarr would work here. I use it alot on messenger and its my favourite for getting that snorting sound across!!
Don't know if its what you're lookin for, as it's not much shorter than guffaw....oh well..:rolleyes:
Kitsune • Mar 28, 2006 6:17 pm
funkykule wrote:
I think fnarr would work here. I use it alot on messenger and its my favourite for getting that snorting sound across!!
Don't know if its what you're lookin for, as it's not much shorter than guffaw....oh well..:rolleyes:


That works better than my "Laugh So Hard I Threw Up". Thank you.
marichiko • Mar 28, 2006 6:21 pm
Flint wrote:
:::CBOL:::@"children"

Is this a mature and dignified declaration of internet forum war?


As everyone here knows, I am neither mature nor dignified. I have been known to declare war, but only on opponents whom I deem worthy of my time.

Since you seem to require a translation of my OP, it means, "Why don't you children run along and play now and leave the grown ups alone."

Flint wrote:
my Cellar profile doubles as a resume'


I'm sure this greatly amuses your fellows in crime as you all sit around in detention hall after school.

:::FMDIDGAD:::
Kitsune • Mar 28, 2006 6:25 pm
marichiko wrote:
I'm sure this greatly amuses your fellows in crime as you all sit around in detention hall after school.

:::FMDIDGAD:::


Mmm, yes, I do agree. I'll give this little episode of amusement a "3/10". Now excuse me while I swirl my snifter of 7 and Seven and relax in my Posting Chair.
funkykule • Mar 28, 2006 6:26 pm
Kitsune, fnarring involves no throwing up whatsoever. its more of a snort. different times call for different measures.;)
Mrs. Parker • Mar 28, 2006 6:58 pm
marichiko wrote:


Since you seem to require a translation of my OP, it means, "Why don't you children run along and play now and leave the grown ups alone."


Mari, I've been so enjoying this place --- how long before these people go away?
ferret88 • Mar 28, 2006 7:18 pm
Mrs. Parker wrote:
Mari, I've been so enjoying this place --- how long before these people go away?


Indeed.
Happy Monkey • Mar 28, 2006 7:27 pm
The ones who can't adjust to the style of this board will get sick of it and leave. Whoever's left will become fine upstanding Cellarites. They're just having a bit of culture shock at the moment.
Flint • Mar 28, 2006 7:56 pm
ahhh I must "pay my dues" before I can be "accepted" into the "clique"

I don't fault you for protecting your colony from percieved threats...
Elspode • Mar 28, 2006 7:56 pm
Guys, guys...we just suck, but don't know it. The AudioGalaxians are here to show us what *real* message boards are about...which is, apparently, typing as fast as possible, leaving very brief and hopefully witty messages. You know...like IM'ing, only permanent.

Unless your board ceases to exist, in which case, well...its gone!
Elspode • Mar 28, 2006 7:58 pm
It isn't threats, man. More like irritants. I mean, flies aren't terribly threatening (well, maybe in the Congo), but they get tiresome buzzing around your head when you're trying to do something.
thrillhouse • Mar 28, 2006 8:02 pm
Image

i get perturbed when grown-ups argue. stopitnow.
Flint • Mar 28, 2006 8:09 pm
It's funny how subjective things are, experienced, as they are, through the filters of past experience that each of us, as human beings, are designed to wear. Isn't it? Each of us struggles to discern an actual person, from the scantest of evidence, bits of text with very little nuance.
busterb • Mar 28, 2006 8:17 pm
Someone send me an email when this shit goes away. What's the max for ones ignore list?
Trilby • Mar 28, 2006 8:24 pm
Flint wrote:
It's funny how subjective things are, experienced, as they are, through the filters of past experience that each of us, as human beings, are designed to wear. Isn't it? Each of us struggles to discern an actual person, from the scantest of evidence, bits of text with very little nuance.


Trying to wade thru the many threads you and 'Stevebsjb' is irritating in a very objective way. You two have not been giving anyone any 'actual human being' stuff--just a lot of junky static. I can say that if you let me get to know you--as an individual--I would be into that. To come here and start bullshit threads about less than nothing...not so much.
xoxoxoBruce • Mar 28, 2006 8:25 pm
Give peace a chance. :eyebrow:
Happy Monkey • Mar 28, 2006 8:28 pm
Flint wrote:
ahhh I must "pay my dues" before I can be "accepted" into the "clique"
I don't know whether you were responding to me in particular, but that's not at all what I was saying. There are plenty of people whose first post fit right in. Others need some time to adjust to how this site's culture works. If someone can't adjust, they don't get the type of conversation they were hoping for, and get a bunch of talk about them instead of with them. If this lasts too long, most people get sick of it and leave on their own. A very few start to get resentful, and become abusive and nasty, and have to be removed. This story happens a couple of times a year, which explains why a number of regulars are so quick to get annoyed.

Not a sermon, just a thought.
Kitsune • Mar 28, 2006 8:29 pm
I- I just wanted to know what "geek drumming" was. Not that I was interested in it, or anything...

Honestly, I don't fit in with "the clique". I also don't feel the need to "pay my dues", either.
Flint • Mar 28, 2006 8:29 pm
We've been going light by AG standards. We are used to alot of board activity, IE the unpopular threads will go away by natural selection when they are "bumped down" by the threads that are democratically preferred. I couldn't have predicted that the "bad threads" would stay at the top so long.

And, I don't think you can "know" somebody in the span of one day, from a few text blurbs. It's something you come to, in time. Maybe we'll get there, if y'all don't run me off. Whatever happens, happens.


At any rate, thanks for the feedback.

Human feedback is what we are all here for, right?
Kitsune • Mar 28, 2006 8:36 pm
Flint wrote:
We've been going light by AG standards. We are used to alot of board activity, IE the unpopular threads will go away by natural selection when they are "bumped down" by the threads that are democratically preferred.


This sounds very "wakachan"-esque. Bumping, sageing, etc. Activity determines what threads continue, what gets buried, kind of like how you can "dig" on Digg.

The Cellar? Everyone here drinks, everyone moves slowly.
Flint • Mar 28, 2006 11:03 pm
I don't know what "sage"ing is...
...or what "wakachan"-esque means.

I am a sys admin, and I goof off all day, mostly. Unless something gets broken, or somebody Fs something up, or somebody doesn't know how to do something. I don't get paid to work, I get paid to be there and know stuff. My concept of a message board is that, ideally, there are alot of people making substantive posts, enough that the board moves, IE there are always new things to look at.

The only thing the ignore function is for, in my opinion, is to filter out non-substantive flooders. So, it is actually amusing to see my own posts percieved as such. You see, in my experience, posts that are unwanted simply go away off the bottom of the page, poof. It's all democratic and automatic. No snap judgments and name-calling necesary.

Mostly what I amused myself with here, today, was hamming up to the quick label that was slapped on AGers. You'll find that is not a great way to invite people to be themselves. But you know that, apparently, as I've read here that you periodically run off new users by being overly clique-ish. But that's human nature, I guess. Like I said, I don't fault you for it. You'll get to know me, if you give me a chance, and if not, then that's your choice. I hope everyone enjoys the time they spend here. I plan to.
Kagen4o4 • Mar 28, 2006 11:46 pm
thankgod they havent got onto the word ass thread.

cellar topics last if they are good topics. not if they are at the top of the page. a good conversation can last quite some time. but a thread about soccer and watching paint dry wont last long.
Flint • Mar 28, 2006 11:57 pm
As I said, the dropping of unwanted threads is an automatic, democratic process.
Flint • Mar 29, 2006 12:30 am
"A free society is one where it is safe to be unpopular." --Adlai Stevenson

(Quote obtained from the bottom of the main page of The Cellar website)
zippyt • Mar 29, 2006 12:33 am
so chill sit back and watch the culling process , it happens ,
if'n you aint got nuthen to say you will be culled !!!
unless you are a lurker or a linker .
Such is the Cellar !!!
So sayth Zippyt !!!!
Flint • Mar 29, 2006 12:37 am
Sounds perfectly reasonable to me, zippyt. :::is and always has been chilled:::
marichiko • Mar 29, 2006 12:39 am
Yeah, we have lots of quotes down there. Here's one:

He who shits on the road will meet flies on his return.
--South African Saying
Flint • Mar 29, 2006 12:43 am
ha ha ha

dueling quotes in a callout thread
zippyt • Mar 29, 2006 1:31 am
Sounds perfectly reasonable to me, zippyt. :::is and always has been chilled:::

Then have a drink on me , and relax , all is cool , this IS a cool place to hang out , just relax and let it flow , realy cool stuff is discussed here , ideas happen and are disscussed and are ruled in or out ( but with intelegence , NOT speed of postes (generly ) ) just chill ( and tell the folks from your board to chill as well ) All is well !!!!! and YES this post is fueled by JB and Coke !!!!!!! ;)
Kagen4o4 • Mar 29, 2006 1:38 am
flint. try the "eat cookies" link at the bottom of the page. plenty of quotes to wade through.

"The District of Columbia has a law forbidding you to exert pressure on a balloon and thereby cause a whistling sound on the streets."
Stevonez • Mar 29, 2006 5:09 am
:biggrinba
ok... I didn't see this thread earlier today and have read through it... and it seems to me the three of us "ag'ers" have given ya'll something to unite over...

we were left without a place to post... with the demise of "you know where" and had been expecting it really... I mean this place was dying when I got there two years ago... RIA was the main cause of this... the owner pretty much left it for dead... but friendships had been made and so we carried on... new users couldn't come in unless someone gave them a name and pass word they wern't using...this is how I came to be over there... we were a disfunctional family I'll make no bones about that but family we were...

many of us there had been discussing where we could all go when the end finally happened and the cellar was one of the places of option... others are probably watching to see what developes here with those of us already here... a couple have registered but not posted yet... yeah... I checked...

I've enjoyed looking over the member list and seeing peoples pics and date of existence and such... well anyway... that's a condensed version of events that have transpired... :)
Kagen4o4 • Mar 29, 2006 6:43 am
its nice to see that in a day you guys have come a long way to adjusting to the pace here. looking back to my join date. its been nearly a year since i joined and its a very cozie place to be. hope it will be for you too
Stevonez • Mar 29, 2006 7:19 am
Kagen4o4 wrote:
its nice to see that in a day you guys have come a long way to adjusting to the pace here. looking back to my join date. its been nearly a year since i joined and its a very cozie place to be. hope it will be for you too


well I for one appreciate that... but I'm only human and by human natures law... destined to make mistakes... I may even make more than others might... cause I'm a firm believer that doing anything is better than doing nothing... and this is in terms of association by way of a message board...

that's to say... I'll post... even if it's regarded as frivolous by some... ;)
xoxoxoBruce • Mar 29, 2006 11:56 am
[HTML] I'll post... even if it's regarded as frivolous by some... [/HTML] Frivolous posts aren't a problem, anyone reading them can take it or leave it and just move on to the next post.
Frivolous threads, however, make it hard for people that check in once in awhile, to sort out what's happened. If they have to wade through knee deep bullshit to find serious/interesting (content) posts, they'll soon give up entirely. Most of the Cellarites work for a living or have other things to do and can't perch on the board being glib.
You're cool. :D
Rock Steady • Mar 29, 2006 12:26 pm
Dev_of_AG wrote:
:biggrinba
ok... I didn't see this thread earlier today and have read through it... and it seems to me the three of us "ag'ers" have given ya'll something to unite over...

we were left without a place to post... with the demise of "you know where" and had been expecting it really... I mean this place was dying when I got there two years ago... RIA was the main cause of this... the owner pretty much left it for dead... but friendships had been made and so we carried on... new users couldn't come in unless someone gave them a name and pass word they wern't using...this is how I came to be over there... we were a disfunctional family I'll make no bones about that but family we were...

many of us there had been discussing where we could all go when the end finally happened and the cellar was one of the places of option... others are probably watching to see what developes here with those of us already here... a couple have registered but not posted yet... yeah... I checked...

I've enjoyed looking over the member list and seeing peoples pics and date of existence and such... well anyway... that's a condensed version of events that have transpired... :)


In another group, a similar thing happened, the main web site shutdown, and an exile group formed a brand new forum. That forum lasted about four more years before it deteriorated into pig fighting. Now I'm at the cellar.

It's different than my old forum. I did feel heat from The Cellar Neighborhood Association at first. But I adjusted to the new expectations here. It's important to retain the character of this place as newbies join. Otherwise, it'll morph into the other forums we chose not to join.
Stevonez • Mar 29, 2006 4:41 pm
Rock Steady wrote:
It's important to retain the character of this place as newbies join. Otherwise, it'll morph into the other forums we chose not to join.


I can understand the need to retain the integrity of values already in place...
at the site we came from... there wasn't any such thing...

it lacked much... and wasn't cared for by those that created it...
once the music died there... I firmly believe the site owner even toy'ed with
us by eliminating certain features along the way... it died a slow painful
death... :p
Flint • Mar 30, 2006 12:00 pm
xoxoxoBruce wrote:
Most of the Cellarites work for a living or have other things to do and can't perch on the board being glib


Ironically, I din't post at all yesterday because I took the day off from work. In fact I generally only post while I am at work. Of course I explained this somewhere ^^^up there^^^ so I won't repeat myself. But, it's funny how things are percieved. If you see me posting alot I am actually at work, which is funny, I guess. Or not. Either way. :::backs away slowly:::

*********************************************************

I see things have settled down a little. That's good. I think everyone will look back on this "whole thing" and laugh (of course, I was laughing at the time - but that's just me, I like to have a good time if possible) I won't have time to post much for a while, I'm in the middle of buying a house and having a baby. Well, my wife is having the baby, actually. My house has a 750 square foot detached garage/workshop that I will be converting into a sound-insulated studio for my drums & bass & etc. . . . And I also have to network the house with Cat-6 and Monster Cable. Oh boy.
Undertoad • Mar 30, 2006 12:31 pm
See, it turns out you're an interesting guy with hobbies and a family and stuff, which is what it all boils down to.

Aren't you afraid that when the child comes, you'll have to radically change your life? Won't the studio come second to the nursery? This is the debate that everyone must eventually deal with... and constantly question.
Elspode • Mar 30, 2006 12:56 pm
Much more interesting content! Humanity is a fairly important commodity here, and sharing it works well. For example...I hadn't gotten the idea that you were a musician, and now I can envy the fact that you're going to have dedicated studio space. All my stuff is piled up in the basement under tarps except for the stuff I'm actively using, which is at my partner's place where our band practices and records.
SteveDallas • Mar 30, 2006 1:08 pm
Undertoad wrote:
Aren't you afraid


[Yoda]You will be.[/Yoda]
Flint • Mar 30, 2006 1:18 pm
@Undertoad: You're right, as far as preparing the house, decorating the nursery actually is a priority. But I need to get the garage converted in order to actually move in, IE all my gear needs somewhere to go, and I can't pile it in the house because I'll be trying to paint the nursery before all our stuff gets piled in there. So, as far as that, its a juggling act.

In regards to radically changing my life after the baby comes, I welcome that change. I embrace it. I don't have a flashy lifestyle, I got that out of my system in my 20s. And, I'm not settling, or comromising, either, this is what I actually want. This will be an intellectual source of fascination. My love of music will be something that will be an enriching factor in my relationship with my family (and actually the bass/amp and alot of the gear belongs to my wife anyway). Music is fully incorporated into my perspective, and whatever you could consider my spirituality, so it all fits. I believe all is one, IE the universe, as an equation, equals to one (there is only one thing, and it is everything). Any percieved complications I encounter are hashed in with the big picture.


@Elspode: I told y'all everything would make sense. No problem. Thanks for noticing. Zappa references score big with me, so I wanted to like you. And actually, I am envious that you have a basement. We don't generally have those in Texas, for whatever reason. You could get a real "studio tan" in a basement :::wink:::
LabRat • Mar 30, 2006 1:46 pm
Flint, check out the parenting forum when you've got a chance. There is a lot of good content there. Congrats to you and your wife. When is she due?
Flint • Mar 30, 2006 2:18 pm
@LabRat: Thank you. September. Parenting Forum, huh? Sounds appropriately topical, at this point. It will take me a while, as a creature of habit, to figure out the structure of this place. This appears to be a really happening place, as the old saying goes.
Elspode • Mar 30, 2006 4:27 pm
Flint wrote:
(and actually the bass/amp and alot of the gear belongs to my wife anyway).

What...you've knocked her up and stolen her gear? Dude... :headshake
Flint • Mar 30, 2006 4:28 pm
...she asked for it.
SteveBsjb • Mar 30, 2006 4:44 pm
Hahaha at this thread! (In a good way.) Flint they're trying to humanize ya! Be strong! ::winkingsmilingguy:::

I have a question. How would one know a thread is a "bullshit" thread until one posts it and it's reacted to? You don't like wading through bullshit threads, but I'd say any thread should have a chance to grow and prosper. (You all use the word "wading" a lot here.)
Flint • Mar 30, 2006 4:47 pm
@Steve: "When in Rome..." :::CBOL:::@"::winkingsmilingguy:::"!!!1!!1!1!
Kitsune • Mar 30, 2006 4:50 pm
SteveBsjb wrote:
How would one know a thread is a "bullshit" thread until one posts it and it's reacted to?


There are a couple of things you can check. If it's in 'Politics', a good indicator is often the thread starter, i.e. - "Urbane Guerrilla".

I'm going to run, now, because I'm going to get smacked for that one.

Moscow Merlot!
SteveBsjb • Mar 30, 2006 4:58 pm
Kit... does that say "babies have a soft spot for me"???

HAHAHA!
SteveBsjb • Mar 30, 2006 5:00 pm
For a definition of CBOL, I highly recommend you search here:

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=CBOL
Pie • Mar 30, 2006 5:13 pm
SteveBsjb wrote:
I have a question. How would one know a thread is a "bullshit" thread until one posts it and it's reacted to?

Normally, you want to share things that other people will find interesting, useful, funny... Know Your Audience.
Here are my figures of merit of whether or not I'm going to read a given thread:
[INDENT]Is the title interesting or relevant to me?
Who started it?
(How long it is) / (How old it is)
Who was the last responder?[/INDENT]
SteveBsjb wrote:
...but I'd say any thread should have a chance to grow and prosper.

Every book may be worth reading (to someone, at least), but I'm only going to read the ones that appeal to me in some fashion. It's all about the marketing. The Cellar may be a big place, but it is still a limited market. :rolleyes:
Flint • Mar 30, 2006 5:19 pm
I have a more simple philosophy. I try to "be myself" - that's it.
SteveBsjb • Mar 30, 2006 5:20 pm
You guys are good here. Well thought out answers. I'm not used to it... but appreciate it. I love to ask the obvious on a message board, and see if people come back with wacky answers. So far, no wackiness here. Great answers, great analogies, and some good humor too. It's like the Stepford message board. (Kidding, kidding, I swear!)

On AG all we had were words. No smilies, no quoting ability, no attachments, no real good profiles, just a big blue background, no mods. I'm telling you though, both places have merits.
Undertoad • Mar 30, 2006 5:29 pm
Right, it's partly a matter of reputation. You know on some vBulletin sytems, they actually have a numeric score for reputation.

We kind of operate that way -- but everyone has an individual opinion of everyone else's reputation. Just like in "real life", people treat you differently according to your Cellar history.

People can change, and people can change in anyone's eyes too. I didn't give BigV much time of day, truth be told, didn't think he was saying much, and then he goes down to New Orleans and helps out for a week. Bigger guy than I am, I thought at that point and then I read him more seriously.
justmehere99 • Mar 30, 2006 6:21 pm
Not to hijack the thread......but where IS BigV??
JayMcGee • Mar 30, 2006 6:52 pm
mmmmm.... think he went down on^h^h with AG
justmehere99 • Mar 30, 2006 8:45 pm
I guess I didn't hijack the thread, I killed it. :(
Flint • Mar 30, 2006 8:52 pm
You have to understand, JayMcGee posting on a thread is like the kiss of death.
Griff • Mar 30, 2006 9:16 pm
Is V concentrating on a new gig?
robsterman1 • Apr 22, 2006 11:24 am
LOL@this thread.

I am an AG refugee and this place looks pretty respectable. Just want to let you all know we AG'ers are not trying to take over this fine forum. We ALL should be as one being :)
Kagen4o4 • Apr 23, 2006 3:21 am
robsterman1 wrote:
We ALL should be as one being :)


are you asking me out?
Trilby • Apr 23, 2006 5:04 am
Kagen4o4 wrote:
are you asking me out?


Kagen, you're on some kind of roll this morning! :) Made me laugh three times in a row!
Kagen4o4 • Apr 23, 2006 6:14 am
now comes the point where i just say stupid shit in an attempt to keep being the class clown. something along the lines of...id like to roll on you three times in a row in the morning!
at least you havent noticed the 50 other attempts to be funny that just go by unnoticed because they killed a thread.
Griff • Apr 23, 2006 7:39 am
They were mercy killings man. You did the right thing.