continue Religion debate to infinity here - Page 2

perth · 12-18-2002, 05:09 PM

Quote:

(slang thinks to self: Al Sharpton, Segway vehicles, firearms of any type, and black helicopters are relevant to any topic or discussion.)

yeah but lets see you use all of em at the same time and keep it relevent.

~james

Cam · 12-18-2002, 05:15 PM

I thought this article had an interesting insight on the Segway yeah it's from ESPN but scroll down about half way or just search for segway. The rest of the article is interesting to.

Tuesday Morning Quarterback

jaguar · 12-18-2002, 05:26 PM

Quote:

I just had and idea that solves there problems. The federal government needs to create a tax deduction for the purchase price of a Segway scooter.

But then the concentration of 9/10s of the worlds fat existing in Nth America would slowly change the earths orbit and we'd all sink into the sun, causing the firey demise of the the entire planet.

elSicomoro · 12-18-2002, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by perth

yeah but lets see you use all of em at the same time and keep it relevent.

I wanted to go hear Rev. Al Sharpton preach, and figured I'd use my Segway to get over to his church from the subway. I was going to carry a 9 mm pistol for protection, but then I noticed a black helicopter was following me.

How's that?

jaguar · 12-18-2002, 05:46 PM

I was thinking more shoot him and escape on the segway while being chased by a baclk helicopter but....

elSicomoro · 12-18-2002, 05:52 PM

I happened to be thinking about God today, and for some reason, the NIN song "Heresy" came to mind.

"God is dead
And no one cares
If there is a hell
I'll see you there."

Mean-spirited as can be, but truly a classic set of lyrics.

perth · 12-18-2002, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sycamore

I wanted to go hear Rev. Al Sharpton preach, and figured I'd use my Segway to get over to his church from the subway. I was going to carry a 9 mm pistol for protection, but then I noticed a black helicopter was following me.

How's that?

yes, but is it relevant?

~james

elSicomoro · 12-18-2002, 06:03 PM

I say it is relevant as it refers to religion (Al Sharpton being a Pentecostal minister).

(Look...it's a fucking stretch...gimme some damned brownie points here.

)

wolf · 12-19-2002, 08:17 PM

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
And, as a parent it is solely MY RIGHT to teach my child about life as I see fit...not as you or the school sees fit.
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Quote:

Originally posted by Cam

I think that is the attitude that makes drug dealers kids drug dealers.

Through my work (no, honestly) I know a lot of drug dealers. And their kids, who are, for the most part as fucked up as their parents in a variety of ways. I also know drug dealer's kids that while not perfect, are much better people than their parents. What makes the difference is the level of parental involvement with the kids.

When you leave your child to be raised by the state (including the state supported public education system), making only minimal effort to be involved in your child's life and upbringing, you're not going to have a high quality, interested, involved, inquisitive child.

I know several children who are either homeschooled, or whose parents invest a lot of their time (not just "quality time," which is a fiction developed to make part-time parents feel better about ignoring thier offspring 90% of the time) in their children, being involved in their lives, but also giving them reponsibility in making choices in their lives and understanding the consequences of their actions. These kids are a joy to be around, no matter what their ages ...

I spend too much of my time talking to parents who are essentially begging me (and my facility) to help them correct the mistakes in childrearing they have been making for the last 15 or so years.

"I give him everything he wants."

"He doesn't listen to me."

No wonder.

You get a different perspective on childrearing today when you see the mother of th 14 year old who herself has a 1-1/2 year old child, with mom wondering why her daughter won't straighten up and fly right.

Or the mother with deep bruises on her neck from her 14 year old son's attempt to strangle her (she had lost consciousness and also probably had a concusion from her darling boy kicking her in the head after she fell to the ground) refusing to file paperwork for an emergency commitment evaluation because he said he was sorry when the police were putting him in the handcuffs and loading him in to the back of the cruiser. Beating the shit out of mom was a regular family activity. Probably still is, assuming he's not in juvenile dentention for beating up someone other than mom.

So, although I've wandered from the point here, the American educational system is broken ... more than likely because as a nation, we've turned the children over to the system to parent, rather than doing the job ourselves, demanding of the schools more than what they're intended to do.

I'm a product of the public school system (save for a disatrous year in a catholic school), and overall have no problem with the quality of education I received. That was a bit of a while ago, though. Given the opportunity, I'll homeschool.

wolf · 12-19-2002, 09:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jaguar
... I'm surrounded by and am one of thousands of happy, bright kids going into top uni places, the leaders and innovators of the future. On the other hand our socialist system is better funded than yours.

Your socialist system is at least admitting up front it's a socialist system, jag, rather than pretending otherwise.

hermit22 · 12-20-2002, 11:41 AM

I think you're confusing the blame, wolf. You start off by blaming the parents, and then somehow transfer the blame onto the public education system. Which is it?

My general group of friends includes several different backgrounds - home schooled, private schooled, and public schooled, and we're young enough that we're only a few years out of the systems. I think there are few traits you can associate with any one group of them, and, obviously, this is a less than scientific study. However, I generally seem to get the feeling that the private school kids are better students and the home school kids had a harder time getting started in life on their own. And, since I hung out with the Honors crowd, my public school friends are the smartest.

I don't really think that you can directly blame public schools for our social ills. Public schools aren't the place to teach morality, the home is. Which brings me back to the first point - parent involvement. If kids don't find the attention they need from their parents, they'll look for it elsewhere. It's unfortunate that many of today's parents are too busy to recognise that.

wolf · 12-20-2002, 12:09 PM

Ultimately the fault lies with the parents. Perhaps in my rambling I didn't express my point clearly enough.

I'm only blaming the school system for being ineffective in what it's supposed to do ... educate children (in the three Rs sense of the word).

perth · 12-20-2002, 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by wolf
Given the opportunity, I'll homeschool.

i dont know about homeschooling, in my case at least. i think its a luxury few people can afford today. i will say that when it comes time to put my son in school he will be attending private school. i have lost faith in the public school system as well.

~james

Undertoad · 12-20-2002, 12:57 PM

Aahhh!!! Don't hijack the thread started to prevent the continued thread hijacking!

perth · 12-20-2002, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Undertoad
Aahhh!!! Don't hijack the thread started to prevent the continued thread hijacking!

oops. sorry. for the benefit of the thread, pretend i said parochial school instead of private.

~james

12-18-2002, 05:15 PM	#17
Cam dripping with ignorance Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Grand Forks ND Posts: 642	I thought this article had an interesting insight on the Segway yeah it's from ESPN but scroll down about half way or just search for segway. The rest of the article is interesting to. Tuesday Morning Quarterback __________________ After the seventh beer I generally try and stay away from the keyboard, I apologize for what happens when I fail.

12-18-2002, 05:46 PM	#20
jaguar whig Join Date: Apr 2001 Posts: 5,075	I was thinking more shoot him and escape on the segway while being chased by a baclk helicopter but.... __________________ Good friends, good books and a sleepy conscience: this is the ideal life. - Twain

12-20-2002, 11:41 AM	#26
hermit22 sleep. Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: So Cal. Posts: 257	I think you're confusing the blame, wolf. You start off by blaming the parents, and then somehow transfer the blame onto the public education system. Which is it? My general group of friends includes several different backgrounds - home schooled, private schooled, and public schooled, and we're young enough that we're only a few years out of the systems. I think there are few traits you can associate with any one group of them, and, obviously, this is a less than scientific study. However, I generally seem to get the feeling that the private school kids are better students and the home school kids had a harder time getting started in life on their own. And, since I hung out with the Honors crowd, my public school friends are the smartest. I don't really think that you can directly blame public schools for our social ills. Public schools aren't the place to teach morality, the home is. Which brings me back to the first point - parent involvement. If kids don't find the attention they need from their parents, they'll look for it elsewhere. It's unfortunate that many of today's parents are too busy to recognise that. __________________ blippety blah bluh blah blah

12-20-2002, 12:09 PM	#27
wolf lobber of scimitars Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Phila Burbs Posts: 20,774	Ultimately the fault lies with the parents. Perhaps in my rambling I didn't express my point clearly enough. I'm only blaming the school system for being ineffective in what it's supposed to do ... educate children (in the three Rs sense of the word). __________________ wolf eht htiw og "Conspiracies are the norm, not the exception." --G. Edward Griffin The Creature from Jekyll Island High Priestess of the Church of the Whale Penis

12-18-2002, 05:52 PM	#21
elSicomoro Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 12,486	I happened to be thinking about God today, and for some reason, the NIN song "Heresy" came to mind. "God is dead And no one cares If there is a hell I'll see you there." Mean-spirited as can be, but truly a classic set of lyrics.

12-18-2002, 06:03 PM	#23
elSicomoro Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 12,486	I say it is relevant as it refers to religion (Al Sharpton being a Pentecostal minister). (Look...it's a fucking stretch...gimme some damned brownie points here. )

12-20-2002, 12:57 PM	#29
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	Aahhh!!! Don't hijack the thread started to prevent the continued thread hijacking!

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