Dear Griff

[BigV]

Hey man.

I have followed your words for years, and I have enjoyed and learned from what I read. The window into your life you've shared with me has let me learn about your family life and your work. I've especially loved learning about your dedication to your children, not just the ones that live in your house. I owe a great debt to the teachers of my kids, and I'd like to express my gratitude to you.

I love my kids, of course. When I send them off to school, I'm trusting you with what is most precious to me. Your care, your effort, your creativity, your courage, these are gifts to me and to my children. I thank you from the bottom of my heart for them. Thank you. I know you give these same gifts to lots of people; they're still special to me. Even from this great distance you're making *my* world better, and my kids' world better. You deserve a parade (and a vacation!).

You've shared your personal life with me too. I've loved learning about your kids growing up, their successes and their AFOGs (Another F*cking Opportunity for Growth). the fencing, the languages, the Prom, what a journey. You're a fencer too and that puts me in a pretty exclusive group, people with friends who know how to wield a sword. I'm in awe of your DIY houseBUILDING skills. And of course the goats enchant me.

You're doing great, you're making a successful life. You're making the world a better place. Selfish of me, I know, but I'm glad for it. Thanks Griff.

[casimendocina]

Can anyone confirm or deny for me if fencer = narcissist or if it is possible for the two elements to be mutually exclusive?

[BigV]

I know some narcissists and none of them are fencers (though they have other combat skills). I know some fencers and none of them are narcissists.

I would vote weak correlation at best and definitely no causation.

[Griff]

Thanks V!

Casi- Some they is and some they isn't. Narcissism exists in all competitive arenas probably increasing as you get toward the top. I wonder if when fencing was real that personality wasn't chosen for? I've seen a fair amount of ego in the coaching ranks but some pretty cool characters as well.

[casimendocina]

Thanks Big V and Griff...re narcissim present in elite athletes, I have heard the view expressed by wanna-be elite cyclists that basically elite cyclists aren't required to have any morals because they're so good at what they do. Not an opinion I agree with.

[BigV]

You're welcome Griff. I mean it from my heart.

You're welcome too, casi. But you changed the question substantially. I don't really know any elite athletes (meaning performing at a very high / professional level), so I can't comment on the new question. If by elite you mean competing in a sport that is uncommon, well, fencing applies then, but I don't think that's what you mean.

[casimendocina]

I'll need to leave a longer response for later as currently I'm misappropriating my time, but in a nutshell, an amateur cyclist stated that Lance Armstrong could be as much of a bastard as he wanted to be because of his prowess in his sport...the crux of the message here being extremely talented people can live by whatever rules they like. I'll comment more later in the day.

[casimendocina]

Originally Posted by BigV

I would vote weak correlation at best and definitely no causation.

Thought about logically, what you say totally makes sense...I just have a beef with one particular fencer and this was a rather weak excuse for a vent.

[footfootfoot]

Originally Posted by casimendocina

Thought about logically, what you say totally makes sense...I just have a beef with one particular fencer ...

Which is why they make long range weapons

[Sundae]

Originally Posted by casimendocina

I'll need to leave a longer response for later as currently I'm misappropriating my time, but in a nutshell, an amateur cyclist stated that Lance Armstrong could be as much of a bastard as he wanted to be because of his prowess in his sport...the crux of the message here being extremely talented people can live by whatever rules they like. I'll comment more later in the day.

George Orwell wrote an essay on Salvidor Dali titled "Benefit of the Clergy". I was asking whether Dali should be judged on anything but his art, given that he was such amn outstanding artist. The title comes from the fact that clergymen had the benefit of being tried only by their peers rather than in a court of law.

People outstanding in their field often seem to assume this distinction. I generally try not to find out too much about the personal lives of my heroes, just in case. (Men of letters especially seem prone to becoming besotted with girls youger than their own daughters once they reach their 50s. And often start new familes to the detriment of the old.)

[BigV]

Originally Posted by casimendocina

Thought about logically, what you say totally makes sense... --snip

What I live for.

[casimendocina]

Originally Posted by BigV

What I live for.

But being illogical is so much more fun. Dana, can I borrow your "throwing a tantrum" pic?

[casimendocina]

Originally Posted by Sundae

George Orwell wrote an essay on Salvidor Dali titled "Benefit of the Clergy". I was asking whether Dali should be judged on anything but his art, given that he was such amn outstanding artist. The title comes from the fact that clergymen had the benefit of being tried only by their peers rather than in a court of law.

People outstanding in their field often seem to assume this distinction. I generally try not to find out too much about the personal lives of my heroes, just in case. (Men of letters especially seem prone to becoming besotted with girls youger than their own daughters once they reach their 50s. And often start new familes to the detriment of the old.)

There's an article in this month's Economist about the head of the IMF. The author argues that no matter how much of a twat etc... the guy is and how much he deserves to be tried by courts, his ideas should not be disregarded because of his actions...guess it all goes back to the Ad Hominem attack. Judge the ideas/argument, not the person. DAMN!!!!