jews: are we actually different? - Page 2

regular.joe · 03-05-2012, 04:25 PM

My intuition is telling me I won't care at that point.

BigV · 03-05-2012, 05:56 PM

are jews actually different? Not really. But this Jewish custom (emphasis on the word custom), yeah. That is different.

Ibby · 03-05-2012, 08:57 PM

Exactly. Jewish culture and history, and thus identity, emphasizes that Jews are different. They are the chosen people, and thus, even if they don't believe in the religious doctrine of Judaism, still tend believe in being a part of the Jewish community, with a distinct yet assimilated culture. Judaism is about story and law - and neither without the other. Keeping Jewish custom - not necessarily Orthodoxy, but at least custom and culture - is what defines Jews, much more than their ethnic separation from the local culture. But this is more than just keeping Jewish religious culture - it's (in this argument more importantly) Jewish family culture, Jewish upbringing. And it seems to be at the very least statistically plausible, then, that their customs and culture are particularly aligned towards "success". It doesn't hurt that most American Jews are middle- or upper-class, either.

It's like saying Asian-Americans are particularly smart. Broadly, yes, that's often true - but it's because of the Asian work/academic ethic, because "tiger moms" raise their kids to strive for that. Similarly, I would argue that it's a cultural and customs-based difference in upbringing and worldview that has little to do with ethnicity and is mostly detached from the religious roots of the custom. It's a matter of raising your kids the way you were raised, even if you raise them secularly or without much emphasis on their Jewishness.

GunMaster357 · 03-06-2012, 04:26 PM

Reminds me of an discussion taking place between two guys in a book (fiction). The setting is post-apocalyptic. They are gathered with a group of survivors and one evening one of them reads the Bible out loud as a way to pass time. Just read, not preaching. After a while, one guy asks :

"According to the Book, all of us come from Adam and Eve?"
"Yes, that's what it says."
"And Adam and Eve were Jews, right?"
"Again, yes."
"So we are all Jews?"
"In a a way..."
"Then why do the Jews think they are more Jewish than us?"

While I think this discussion was there for some comic relief in the book, and sure I laughed, I thought that the question was interesting.

regular.joe · 03-06-2012, 06:35 PM

It's kind of like the guy who dies and goes to heaven. He's being showen around the place and is a little surprised to see that people are still living in groups in heaven. The Catholics have a neighborhood, the Jews have a neighborhood and so on. Finally he notices that there is not a southern Baptist to be seen anywhere. He asks about this and is told that they live way over there out of sight of everyone else. He asks "why"? His host says "they think they are the only ones here".

tw · 03-06-2012, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by regular.joe

It's kind of like the guy who dies and goes to heaven. He's being showen around the place and is a little surprised to see that people are still living in groups in heaven.

Which way to the virgins?

You have your religion. And I have mine.

sexobon · 03-07-2012, 12:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by regular.joe

It's kind of like the guy who dies ... and is a little surprised to see that people are still living in groups ...

Satan calls muster in hell and says:
"All the murderers assemble in a group to my left."
So all the murderers line up in formation to his left.
"Next, all the adulterers assemble in a group to my right."
And all the adulterers line up in formation to his right.
"Now, all the Christians form a group directly behind me."
As all the Christians move past Satan to form up behind him, one of them looks up and says: "You mean ...!
Satan nods and says: "The Jews were right."

infinite monkey · 03-09-2012, 02:40 PM

I totally don't get that joke.

Please 'splain?

regular.joe · 03-09-2012, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tw

Which way to the virgins?

tw · 03-09-2012, 05:39 PM

Did I mention my fantasies?

Like religion, my fantasies are also protected by the Constitution (and the NRA).

sexobon · 03-10-2012, 09:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by infinite monkey

I totally don't get that joke.

Please 'splain?

It's a silly double whammy played off gross generalities about religious ideas. If you look at it in terms of complex belief systems, you won't get it. It's premised on the ideas that Christians believe Jesus is God (divine) and Jews do not; also, that Christians believe in hell (eternal punishment) and Jews do not. The joke implies that if Jews are right about Jesus, then Christians are worshipping a false God (#3. Thou shalt have no other gods before me.) and will be condemned to hell pursuant to their own beliefs; also, that it wouldn't matter if Jews are wrong about hell not existing because no one gets sent there for not believing in it anyways.

wolf · 03-11-2012, 02:18 PM

I guess you had to be there.

03-05-2012, 04:25 PM	#16
regular.joe Старый сержант Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: NC, dreaming of large Russian women. Posts: 1,464	My intuition is telling me I won't care at that point. __________________ Birth, wealth, and position are valueless during wartime. Man is only judged by his character --Soldier's Testament. Death, like birth, is a secret of Nature. - Marcus Aurelius.

03-05-2012, 05:56 PM	#17
BigV Goon Squad Leader Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Seattle Posts: 27,063	are jews actually different? Not really. But this Jewish custom (emphasis on the word custom), yeah. That is different. __________________ Be Just and Fear Not.

03-05-2012, 08:57 PM	#18
Ibby erika Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: "the high up north" Posts: 6,127	Exactly. Jewish culture and history, and thus identity, emphasizes that Jews are different. They are the chosen people, and thus, even if they don't believe in the religious doctrine of Judaism, still tend believe in being a part of the Jewish community, with a distinct yet assimilated culture. Judaism is about story and law - and neither without the other. Keeping Jewish custom - not necessarily Orthodoxy, but at least custom and culture - is what defines Jews, much more than their ethnic separation from the local culture. But this is more than just keeping Jewish religious culture - it's (in this argument more importantly) Jewish family culture, Jewish upbringing. And it seems to be at the very least statistically plausible, then, that their customs and culture are particularly aligned towards "success". It doesn't hurt that most American Jews are middle- or upper-class, either. It's like saying Asian-Americans are particularly smart. Broadly, yes, that's often true - but it's because of the Asian work/academic ethic, because "tiger moms" raise their kids to strive for that. Similarly, I would argue that it's a cultural and customs-based difference in upbringing and worldview that has little to do with ethnicity and is mostly detached from the religious roots of the custom. It's a matter of raising your kids the way you were raised, even if you raise them secularly or without much emphasis on their Jewishness. __________________ not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh

03-06-2012, 04:26 PM	#19
GunMaster357 Professor Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Brest (FRANCE) Posts: 1,837	Reminds me of an discussion taking place between two guys in a book (fiction). The setting is post-apocalyptic. They are gathered with a group of survivors and one evening one of them reads the Bible out loud as a way to pass time. Just read, not preaching. After a while, one guy asks : "According to the Book, all of us come from Adam and Eve?" "Yes, that's what it says." "And Adam and Eve were Jews, right?" "Again, yes." "So we are all Jews?" "In a a way..." "Then why do the Jews think they are more Jewish than us?" While I think this discussion was there for some comic relief in the book, and sure I laughed, I thought that the question was interesting. __________________ "War is God's way of teaching Americans geography." - Ambrose Bierce

03-06-2012, 06:35 PM	#20
regular.joe Старый сержант Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: NC, dreaming of large Russian women. Posts: 1,464	It's kind of like the guy who dies and goes to heaven. He's being showen around the place and is a little surprised to see that people are still living in groups in heaven. The Catholics have a neighborhood, the Jews have a neighborhood and so on. Finally he notices that there is not a southern Baptist to be seen anywhere. He asks about this and is told that they live way over there out of sight of everyone else. He asks "why"? His host says "they think they are the only ones here". __________________ Birth, wealth, and position are valueless during wartime. Man is only judged by his character --Soldier's Testament. Death, like birth, is a secret of Nature. - Marcus Aurelius.

03-09-2012, 02:40 PM	#23
infinite monkey Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 13,002	I totally don't get that joke. Please 'splain?

03-09-2012, 05:39 PM	#25
tw Read? I only know how to write. Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 11,933	Did I mention my fantasies? Like religion, my fantasies are also protected by the Constitution (and the NRA). Last edited by tw; 03-09-2012 at 05:45 PM.

03-11-2012, 02:18 PM	#27
wolf lobber of scimitars Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Phila Burbs Posts: 20,774	I guess you had to be there. __________________ wolf eht htiw og "Conspiracies are the norm, not the exception." --G. Edward Griffin The Creature from Jekyll Island High Priestess of the Church of the Whale Penis

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