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Old 05-01-2007, 11:26 AM   #16
Sheldonrs
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Sheldon, if you and your partner ever go on one of her cruises, I may have no choice but to kick your asses...but it won't be a hate crime, I assure you.
My partner hates boats so that ain't going to happen.
But I actually like Rosie. So you can go ahead and do what you want with my ass. ;-)
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Old 05-01-2007, 06:06 PM   #17
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So - I live in the bay area - but I live in south bay - San Jose - and I work in Fremont (about 30 mins south of Oakland). This was expected to cause ALL sorts of traffic nightmares - but so far it hasn't been that bad. Public transportation is free this week. Oddly enough - everyone has been pretty gracious about the whole thing.

Funniest thing though - CalTrans has said that they hope to have this fixed by the end of the week - I say HAHAHAHAHAHAH to that.
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Old 05-01-2007, 06:44 PM   #18
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Funniest thing though - CalTrans has said that they hope to have this fixed by the end of the week - I say HAHAHAHAHAHAH to that.
Eh, it *should* all be modular, so they just need to unbolt a few sections, and slap in a couple new ones. Unless the support pillars are damaged, which they shouldn't be - concrete is pretty fireproof. Didn't they show us that in a movie? Volcano, i think it was?

Is it a modular structure? I have no idea...
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Old 05-01-2007, 07:04 PM   #19
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With all the earth quakes in that part of the world I would THINK they have a contingency plan for failed bridge sections , hell even have a few of them laying about in generic sizes ??

A few years back a 2 lane bridge over the Missippi at Helena Arkansas was hit by a bardge , it didn't do THIS much damage but , the bridge was closed and a section had to be ripped out and re poured ( its cement ) , from start to finnish the bridge was only closed for 2 weeks or less .
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Old 05-01-2007, 07:12 PM   #20
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I have a feeling daniwong wasn't referring to the engineering or physical difficulties but caltrans bumbling, molasses slow nature.
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Old 05-01-2007, 08:08 PM   #21
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California. Pah. Young State, thinks it's know everything. We warned it not to burn it's bridges but it has to go find out the hard way......
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Old 05-02-2007, 12:18 AM   #22
tw
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Unless the support pillars are damaged, which they shouldn't be - concrete is pretty fireproof.
Concrete is not fireproof. Concrete simply raises the temperature necessary to destroy the structure. In Philadelphia many years ago, rags in a pile started a skyscraper fire that destroyed the structural integrity of that entire building. A 30+ story building had to be disassembled because concrete encased supports may have been too hot. If concrete is so fireproof, then the building would have been cleared and quickly reoccupied.

That fire was fueled only by room furnishings. This gasoline fire was far hotter. Surprising is that the damage was so limited.

Is this new roads built after to replace and bypass the Admiral Nimitz freeway?
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Old 05-02-2007, 01:01 AM   #23
WabUfvot5
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Briefly glanced at the front of a newspaper here. Sounds like the driver had numerous run-ins with the law. It wouldn't be a huge leap to wager he was on something when he crashed.
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Old 05-02-2007, 01:32 AM   #24
Bitman
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The truth will out.

If the WTC has taught us anything, it's that large amounts of flammable liquid cannot melt concrete and steel.
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Old 05-02-2007, 04:51 AM   #25
SPUCK
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The fuel ran down the drains and heated things from the inside too.

No they don't have 100 ton bridge sections lying around. How would you even move it?

That spot is horrid for traffic because all the north bound traffic on one side of S.F. bay is trying to funnel onto the Oakland Bay Bridge to get to S.F. over that section. The detours are miles and miles around.

Caltrans signage thru there is absolutely terrible! You can easily discover 'your' exit on the the wrong side of your lanes, in the middle of a curve right in that maze.


That particular road way was steel beams forming the bottom with a concrete road surface on top. That's why it eventually slumped.

Who pays for it?? Good question. Normally if you "lose it" and say knock down a street light you or your insurance company,(property damage aspect), pay for it. In this case they're talking probably 30-50 million dollars. (Chop chop hurry hurry and all.) So I am curious how they deal with that. It would sink a lot of insurance companies. But in most cases they have liability limits. Like 5 or 10 million with a hazardous trucking policy.
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Old 05-02-2007, 04:57 AM   #26
CharlieG
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...snip..So I am curious how they deal with that. It would sink a lot of insurance companies. But in most cases they have liability limits. Like 5 or 10 million with a hazardous trucking policy.
They deal with it by 2 methods. The first, as you said, is policy limits, the second is by what is called re-insurance. This is (effectively) an insurance company taking out an insurance policy on itself - over a certain $ figure, the re-insurance company pays. These are usually written by the BIG boys
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Old 05-02-2007, 05:08 AM   #27
Aliantha
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Also of course, not only the usual vehicle insurance but presumably business indemnity insurance would come into play in this one.

I'm sure they'll work it out somehow though. Maybe arnie could help out?
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Old 05-02-2007, 10:14 AM   #28
SquadRat1
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Originally Posted by tw View Post
Concrete is not fireproof. Concrete simply raises the temperature necessary to destroy the structure. In Philadelphia many years ago, rags in a pile started a skyscraper fire that destroyed the structural integrity of that entire building. A 30+ story building had to be disassembled because concrete encased supports may have been too hot. If concrete is so fireproof, then the building would have been cleared and quickly reoccupied.

That fire was fueled only by room furnishings. This gasoline fire was far hotter. Surprising is that the damage was so limited.

Is this new roads built after to replace and bypass the Admiral Nimitz freeway?
Correct....concrete contains moisture. So when fire heats it up it "spalls", cracks and breaks apart.. Then the fire hits the steel and guess what? It begins to weaken (not melt). Steel weakens at approx. 1000 degees, meaning it could start at 900 or 1100 etc...
I could bore you with more FACTS about steel and concrete. But, I'll leave it at this
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Old 05-02-2007, 12:45 PM   #29
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The truth will out.

If the WTC has taught us anything, it's that large amounts of flammable liquid cannot melt concrete and steel.
Great link;
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G-A-Y is spelled 429″ on a standard American telephone. The attacks occurred only 8.5 miles from the notorious Castro Street homosexual district. COINCIDENCE?
for laughs.
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Old 05-02-2007, 01:52 PM   #30
HungLikeJesus
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No they don't have 100 ton bridge sections lying around. How would you even move it?
With a 100-ton crane, of course.
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