5/7/2005: Soldier comforts dying Iraqi girl

[tw]

I cannot get sad about this. My sadness was expressed some years ago when I was so adamently opposed to this war. Anyone who supported the president in unilaterally attacking Iraq should have no right to be sad. We created these pictures many times over when we attacked another sovereign nation. And we know this will only get worse as long as Americans remain in Iraq. That too being the lessons of history.

I was sad about this little girl or her peers long ago. But we attacked Iraq anyway. If you advocated war as the president did, then you expect this picture hundreds of times more. Otherwise you were just lying to yourself. The time to be sad for this girl was back in 2002. This because America attacked a sovereign nation without even any plans for the peace. The actual death therefore being a foregone conclusion.

[mrnoodle]

yep. the last thought in that bomber's mind was "how dare they attack our sovreign nation? george bush has forced me to blow up a crowd full of children. if only they had let the UN continue to appease us, none of this would've happened. allah be praised."

[edited a diatribe about brainwashed michael moore followers]

[jaguar]

yep. the last thought in that bomber's mind was "how dare they attack our sovreign nation?

Er, yea, probably. With something islamic thrown in.

[Troubleshooter]

That would be "Allahu Ackbar!"

[dar512]

Well, TW, maybe you've used up all your sad. But I haven't. I was against the Iraqi invasion from the start and every friggen day there's some news from Iraq that makes me sadder still.

[mrnoodle]

jaguar, i'm betting you're wrong. i think they're mindless thugs who prefer carnage over peace, and only use nationalist sentiment as an excuse to kill, maim, and destroy. you obviously think they're quite a bit more magnanimous. I think the picture proves my point, not yours.

they're killing their own children. they're killing people standing in line for jobs. they deliberately target civilians because they're fucking evil. the idea that terrorism is acceptable political protest will one day be shown for the BS that it is (hopefully with the rest of liberal dogma)

[lookout123]

oh shut up MRN! it is BS, capitalist, white man, verbal vomit like yours that forces otherwise peaceful people to become carbombers. only by blowing up their children and those looking for work can they teach us the lesson we've been begging for with our imperialist quests!
don't you get it?!?!?!

*zips ups flame suit while sprinting towards the door*

[warch]

Wha!?! Terrorism is "acceptable" political protest = liberal dogma? I will have to disagree with that blazing slander.

What these insurgents are doing is hideous. you mistake attempts to understand why this evil has manifested with excusing its existence, justification. There are reasons why this evil has surfaced and it would be wise to be aware of them and counter them as well as the bombers. And if you think the solution is as simple as wacking them back hard....you are an ass of whatever political leaning who doesnt appreciate the complexity of this situation.

This photo is a powerful weapon for our side.

[magilla]

Originally Posted by jw

I cannot get sad about this. My sadness was expressed some years ago when I was so adamently opposed to this war. Anyone who supported the president in unilaterally attacking Iraq should have no right to be sad. We created these pictures many times over when we attacked another sovereign nation. And we know this will only get worse as long as Americans remain in Iraq. That too being the lessons of history...

I actually don't think you mean this. I think there's almost no one who won't be saddened at this image. I understand what you mean, though, since I also was completely against this optional, worthless war from the very start. But you'd almost be inhuman to not be affected by this image. I won't go so far as to say this death was our fault, but I know thousands of innocents have been killed by our actions.

As for the other---

Originally Posted by mrnoodle

jaguar, i'm betting you're wrong. i think they're mindless thugs who prefer carnage over peace, and only use nationalist sentiment as an excuse to kill, maim, and destroy. you obviously think they're quite a bit more magnanimous.

You could not be more wrong. These are not mindless thugs. Mindless thugs might plant bombs and run off, but they won't blow themselves up in the process. These are religiously motivated fanatics who are opposed to everything the US stands for and does-- including unilaterally invading a country that was not threatening us. They sure as hell want us completely out of the Middle East. You can go on calling them mindless thugs and you probably will, but until you understand what motivates them, you'll never stop them and you sure as hell won't beat them. Every one we kill has a son or a brother or a nephew or a daughter who'll get pissed off enough to strap a few kilos of Semtex to their chest and walk into a crowd. So unless you're advocating a little genocide with your morning coffee, you're not going to get anywhere (and genocide won't work either).

And this:

Originally Posted by mrnoodle

the idea that terrorism is acceptable political protest will one day be shown for the BS that it is (hopefully with the rest of liberal dogma)

shows just how intellectually and morally bankrupt you are. In case you missed it, it was not liberals who started this, not liberals who were frothing at the mouth and jumping up and down screaming "WMD! WMD!"; it wasn't liberals who conflated the 9/11 attacks with Saddam Hussein for months; it wasn't liberals who reached a decision to wage an optional war and then invented a reason to do so. As a matter of fact, when several million people (whom you'd probably call "liberals" but normal people would call "human beings") demonstrated against this travesty in dozens of spots all over the world, I don't recall a single bomb going off at any of those protests.

Chris

["Who the hell do they think they are, walking around on top of all our oil?" --Nameless Usenet poster]

[wah]

<i>they indocrinate their kids from the womb to kill themselves in the course of killing other innocents. </i>

Umm, this was an attack on a U.S. patrol (hence the U.S. soldiers being there, duh). The innocents, were, are, and will aways be, <i>collateral damage</i>.

<i>the idea that they are forced by our actions to resort to this kind of behavior is about 50 generations late.</i>

Right, because I remember hearing about bombs going off in Iraq nearly every day <i>before</i> we invaded.

I can't, honestly, wait until this 'greatest generation' of racists just withers off this planet, and those of us who can understand the common thread of humanity that runs through all our veins gets a chance to work for positive change without needed the threat and application of great violence to make progress.

Neocons. Can't live with 'em, *watch out* they've got their fingers on the trigger.

<i> strip away the layers of useless analysis, stop calling evil anything other than what it is: evil. it's unjustifiable under any circumstance.

microanalyzing someone who is willing to drop bombs in a mall is the most useless masturbatory pseudointellectual exercise in futility ever.</i>

no doubt, but I consider Bush more *misguided* than pure evil. Hey, but at least profits are up in the defense and oil industries. Woohoo! Profit!

[tw]

Originally Posted by magilla

I actually don't think you mean this. I think there's almost no one who won't be saddened at this image. I understand what you mean, though, since I also was completely against this optional, worthless war from the very start.

I meant exactly what I posted - as usual in a bluntly honest tone.

You opposed the war. But was this the picture in your mind back in 2002? It was in my mind. Exactly. To currently be upset about this picture only demonstrates a total disconnect from what happens every day since George Jr declared "Mission Accomplished". An average of 50 acts of violence every day - and it will only continue.

FISHing. Throw a grenade into the house. Then charge in to discover if insurgents or just another innocent family has been killed. Good Morning Vietnam. We had to burn the village to save it. Specific lessons from Vietnam. A picture that saddens you today is to me equivalent to a death years ago. Sad. Of course. But her death (or someone just like her) is a forgone conclusion and happens every day.

We created these deaths. Do you think The Lancet was lying about 98,000 Iraqi civilian deaths as a result of American actions? She died by violence or due to other acts. No difference. Children are dying everyday because a president lied about Saddam, created the insurgency, and now lies about 'light at the end of the tunnel'. She is but another innocent victim when two evil forces - the American invaders and the insurgent - collide. She is what happens when people believe a lying president - Nixon or George Jr. Who never learned why the smoking gun is so critically necessary to justify war? Who never learned why the lessons of Sun-tzu were proven so often in history. Ignorance and denial years ago in America doomed this girl - or someone just like her.

Sorry. But I have long since resigned to this picture being a daily event because the US invaded illegally, without justification, and then created an insurgency. I cannot be sad every day. To be honest and be sad for this girl means I must be sad every day for two years past and for many years into the future. That is not humanly possible. Anyone sad for this girl today is either seriously depressed or has been in denial about many other dead girls created because George Jr lied. I am too much of a realist to think even for one minute that this picture and this dead girl is any different. I am resigned that this picture occurs every day in Iraq because America did not even bother to plan for the peace. I am long since past being sad the day I posted in The Cellar that this war was a forgone conclusion.

Magilla - ask anyone here how adamantly and almost singly I had argued that this war was completely wrong. But then I was thinking about pictures just like this one - another death without purpose but created in the greater glory of George Jr. I cannot be sad for something that was a forgone conclusion years ago - as taught even by the lessons of history.

[lookout123]

(and genocide won't work either).

oh sure it will, if you try hard enough.

[mrnoodle]

so, right and wrong are simpleminded concepts and only through applying infinite layers of "complexity" to every situation can we find true enlightenment. garbage. strip away the layers of useless analysis, stop calling evil anything other than what it is: evil. it's unjustifiable under any circumstance.

microanalyzing someone who is willing to tie bombs to themselves and detonate them in a mall is the most useless masturbatory pseudointellectual exercise in futility ever.

And i'm not slandering anyone. liberals have a long and rich history of trying to blame every ill in the world on the united states. far from being open-minded, they have the strictest set of dogma this side of the 10 commandments, and they are as predictable as buttless leather pants at a gay pride parade. essentially, the left-wing playbook boils down to: "everything you've ever been told is wrong, because a white man came up with it"

[jaguar]

I considered replying properly but it's not worth the 5 minutes of my life, fuck off you clueless halfwit. A lot less 2000 years ago the forerunners of your fucking religion were slashing and burning their way though the middle east in the name of christ and they're still at it, you're in one serious glass house and you're throwing very big stones.You clearly have little or no understanding of the situation beyond what FOX feeds you today, I'd bet fairly good money you've never been to the middle east, hell, you probably haven't been out of the US. You're merely demonstrating just how fucking ignorant your ilk are.

[lookout123]

screw you whiteboy. now thanks to your bilge, i feel compelled to buy a little semtex.

*disclaimer: dear federal agents: i have no intention on following through on this thought.*