Extinction and the Dread of Insignificance

coberst · 07-04-2008, 11:00 AM

Extinction and the Dread of Insignificance

Becker compares three great thinkers Otto Rank, Wilhelm Reich, and Carl Jung to conclude that the three provide us nothing with which to connect their conclusions except that they dissented from Freud. However, there is agreement on the answer to the fundamental question, “What causes evil in human affairs?”

This agreement is also the agreement in all of the human sciences; “man wants above all to endure and prosper, to achieve immortality in some way”.

Wo/man wants, above all, to reject the knowledge of mortality; s/he does so by seeking to assure immortality in some way. Mortality is connected to our animal nature and thereby wo/man reaches for some way of being transcendent of that nature. As our mental capacity increased we rejected other animals with a vengeance because these other animals “embodied what man feared most, a nameless and faceless death.

Our fears are buried deeply within our unconsciousness by repression, that great discovery of the science of psychoanalysis. This repression “is achieved by the symbolic engineering of culture, which everywhere serves men as an antidote to terror by giving them a new and durable life beyond that of the body”.

I have recently finished reading “The Art of War” an article in the March 12, 2007 edition of “Time” by Lev Grossman. The article is about a, largely computer generated, movie regarding a war in ancient Greece. The movie’s title is “The 300 Spartans” and Zack Snyder is the director. The movie is, except for the human actors, a virtual world created by digital movie techniques. http://www.time.com/time/magazine/ar...5241-2,00.html

“Snyder is one of a small, hypertechnical fringe of directors who are exploring a new way to make movies by discarding props, sets, extras and real-life locations and replacing them with their computer-generated equivalents.”

“With so much computer-generated make-believe going on, the actor’s physicality is the movie’s only link to the real world…every frame was manipulated and color-shifted to create an intense, thunderstorm palette…The result is a gorgeous, dreamlike movie that’s almost perfect. Every frame is neat and composed, like an oil painting, not a hair or a grain of sand out of place. All noise and dissonance have been digitally eliminated. Maybe that’s the only way to make a war movie right now, or at least, the only way to make a war movie that’s not an antiwar movie…That’s why it’s a piece of mythology. It’s what we would hope for. “300” is a vision of war as ennobling and morally unambiguous and spectacularly good-looking.”

That’s one hell of a special effect. And this movie is, I find, an insight into the meaning of “evil in human affairs”. We are all directors of our individual and our community’s virtual reality.

I suspect we have repressed such conscious thoughts about mortality that we are inclined to dispatch with a shrug any talk of such matters; do you ever consciously seek to “achieve immortality in some way”?

Quotes from “Escape from Evil”—Ernest Becker

xoxoxoBruce · 07-04-2008, 12:17 PM

Becker didn't pay attention when I said...

Quote:

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

So remember folks, movies ain't real. Come to think of it, most of the people in 'em are pretty phony too.

Trying to draw some pompous corollary from a commercial Hollywood attempt to entertain, and make money, is stupid.

Sundae · 07-04-2008, 05:30 PM

How do you qualify a post as spam?
Surely if it's all of the same bent and pushing the same author it has to be reined in at some point...?

It's not my cup of tea to start with, but that certainly doesn't mean it's not worthwhile. It's the same name coming up again and again that raises my red flag.

DanaC · 07-04-2008, 06:15 PM

Yeah. Replace "Becker compares ....etc" with "and you know that reminds me of Jesus when he...."

That last sentence may mean more to Brits, come to think about it....but nonetheless, this is not a bid for philosophical discussion and exploration, so much as an attempt to evangelise a particular branch of Humanist philosophy. It is 'bible bashing' without the bible.

lookout123 · 07-04-2008, 11:27 PM

the problem is he doesn't engage, so he doesn't really qualify as intolerably irritating. i just wish the ridiculous fucker would get involved or go away. i don't have to like what he says as long as i feel there is a real person there saying it.

Urbane Guerrilla · 07-05-2008, 01:51 AM

What causes evil in human affairs? Evil is the downside of free will.

Some will contend that fate and determinism obviate free will. I don't buy that, reckoning fate not to be knowable before the fact; one may as well behave as if one has free will at all times.

And if the man can only behave like a jerk, he should be unsurprised if he's treated like one.

Sundae · 07-05-2008, 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DanaC

Yeah. Replace "Becker compares ....etc" with "and you know that reminds me of Jesus when he...."

Oh yes!

DanaC · 07-05-2008, 09:38 AM

Quote:

Some will contend that fate and determinism obviate free will. I don't buy that, reckoning fate not to be knowable before the fact; one may as well behave as if one has free will at all times.

Well put.

busterb · 07-05-2008, 12:28 PM

UT, where are U???

Urbane Guerrilla · 07-05-2008, 07:55 PM

If you think he should act, better PM him. Actually, it doesn't look like Charlie Oberst here will be particularly active, or really terribly disruptive. His situation seems to be not-enough-of-a-troll. It might help were he more droll.

BigV · 08-08-2008, 08:09 PM

New Day (I think) songwriter, Mr. C. Oberst??

xoxoxoBruce · 08-08-2008, 11:32 PM

He has one day left on his time out.

Griff · 08-09-2008, 07:07 AM

Will he follow the Cellar Rule Book?

classicman · 08-10-2008, 10:55 AM

Can I borrow your copy, or did you lend it to him?

BigV · 08-10-2008, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigV

New Day (I think) songwriter, Mr. C. Oberst??

Quote:

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

He has one day left on his time out.

Sorry. I made this post in haste. I misremembered the band name. I wrote New Day when I should have written "Bright Eyes". And I only wrote the first initial "C" because I wasn't sure of the first name. I thought it might be Christopher, but I'm glad I hesitated, because now that I have the time to check my facts I see that Conor is what I was originally thinking.

Conor Oberst. Is that you?

07-04-2008, 11:00 AM	#1
coberst Civil Civilian Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 34	Extinction and the Dread of Insignificance Extinction and the Dread of Insignificance Becker compares three great thinkers Otto Rank, Wilhelm Reich, and Carl Jung to conclude that the three provide us nothing with which to connect their conclusions except that they dissented from Freud. However, there is agreement on the answer to the fundamental question, “What causes evil in human affairs?” This agreement is also the agreement in all of the human sciences; “man wants above all to endure and prosper, to achieve immortality in some way”. Wo/man wants, above all, to reject the knowledge of mortality; s/he does so by seeking to assure immortality in some way. Mortality is connected to our animal nature and thereby wo/man reaches for some way of being transcendent of that nature. As our mental capacity increased we rejected other animals with a vengeance because these other animals “embodied what man feared most, a nameless and faceless death. Our fears are buried deeply within our unconsciousness by repression, that great discovery of the science of psychoanalysis. This repression “is achieved by the symbolic engineering of culture, which everywhere serves men as an antidote to terror by giving them a new and durable life beyond that of the body”. I have recently finished reading “The Art of War” an article in the March 12, 2007 edition of “Time” by Lev Grossman. The article is about a, largely computer generated, movie regarding a war in ancient Greece. The movie’s title is “The 300 Spartans” and Zack Snyder is the director. The movie is, except for the human actors, a virtual world created by digital movie techniques. http://www.time.com/time/magazine/ar...5241-2,00.html “Snyder is one of a small, hypertechnical fringe of directors who are exploring a new way to make movies by discarding props, sets, extras and real-life locations and replacing them with their computer-generated equivalents.” “With so much computer-generated make-believe going on, the actor’s physicality is the movie’s only link to the real world…every frame was manipulated and color-shifted to create an intense, thunderstorm palette…The result is a gorgeous, dreamlike movie that’s almost perfect. Every frame is neat and composed, like an oil painting, not a hair or a grain of sand out of place. All noise and dissonance have been digitally eliminated. Maybe that’s the only way to make a war movie right now, or at least, the only way to make a war movie that’s not an antiwar movie…That’s why it’s a piece of mythology. It’s what we would hope for. “300” is a vision of war as ennobling and morally unambiguous and spectacularly good-looking.” That’s one hell of a special effect. And this movie is, I find, an insight into the meaning of “evil in human affairs”. We are all directors of our individual and our community’s virtual reality. I suspect we have repressed such conscious thoughts about mortality that we are inclined to dispatch with a shrug any talk of such matters; do you ever consciously seek to “achieve immortality in some way”? Quotes from “Escape from Evil”—Ernest Becker

07-04-2008, 11:27 PM	#5
lookout123 changed his status to single Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Right behind you. No, the other side. Posts: 10,308	the problem is he doesn't engage, so he doesn't really qualify as intolerably irritating. i just wish the ridiculous fucker would get involved or go away. i don't have to like what he says as long as i feel there is a real person there saying it. __________________ Getting knocked down is no sin, it's not getting back up that's the sin

07-05-2008, 01:51 AM	#6
Urbane Guerrilla Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Southern California Posts: 6,674	What causes evil in human affairs? Evil is the downside of free will. Some will contend that fate and determinism obviate free will. I don't buy that, reckoning fate not to be knowable before the fact; one may as well behave as if one has free will at all times. And if the man can only behave like a jerk, he should be unsurprised if he's treated like one. __________________ Wanna stop school shootings? End Gun-Free Zones, of course.

07-05-2008, 12:28 PM	#9
busterb NSABFD Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: MS. usa Posts: 3,908	UT, where are U??? __________________ I've haven't left very deep footprints in the sands of time. But, boy I've left a bunch.

07-05-2008, 07:55 PM	#10
Urbane Guerrilla Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Southern California Posts: 6,674	If you think he should act, better PM him. Actually, it doesn't look like Charlie Oberst here will be particularly active, or really terribly disruptive. His situation seems to be not-enough-of-a-troll. It might help were he more droll. __________________ Wanna stop school shootings? End Gun-Free Zones, of course.

07-04-2008, 05:30 PM	#3
Sundae polaroid of perfection Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 24,185	How do you qualify a post as spam? Surely if it's all of the same bent and pushing the same author it has to be reined in at some point...? It's not my cup of tea to start with, but that certainly doesn't mean it's not worthwhile. It's the same name coming up again and again that raises my red flag.

07-04-2008, 06:15 PM	#4
DanaC We have to go back, Kate! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 25,964	Yeah. Replace "Becker compares ....etc" with "and you know that reminds me of Jesus when he...." That last sentence may mean more to Brits, come to think about it....but nonetheless, this is not a bid for philosophical discussion and exploration, so much as an attempt to evangelise a particular branch of Humanist philosophy. It is 'bible bashing' without the bible.

08-08-2008, 08:09 PM	#11
BigV Goon Squad Leader Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Seattle Posts: 27,063	New Day (I think) songwriter, Mr. C. Oberst?? __________________ Be Just and Fear Not.

08-08-2008, 11:32 PM	#12
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	He has one day left on his time out. __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

08-09-2008, 07:07 AM	#13
Griff still says videotape Join Date: Feb 2001 Posts: 26,813	Will he follow the Cellar Rule Book? __________________ If you would only recognize that life is hard, things would be so much easier for you. - Louis D. Brandeis

08-10-2008, 10:55 AM	#14
classicman barely disguised asshole, keeper of all that is holy. Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 23,401	Can I borrow your copy, or did you lend it to him? __________________ "like strapping a pillow on a bull in a china shop" Bullitt

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