|
08-29-2006, 05:18 AM | #1 |
Flocci Non Facio
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: In The Line Of Fire
Posts: 571
|
A must read website from within the Jewish community is The Forward with a very interesting editorial with a 1973 analogy. Like I've always said, Israel needs to make peace with its neighbours to survive. But where is the new Kissinger?
"As it happens, every one of the target nations has sent urgent signals to Israel in recent weeks, making it clear that they want to do business. Israelis must now ask themselves what price they would have to pay to join the game, and what role they need their American ally to play to make it work." "That is the challenge for Israel’s friends right now. Bush has been convinced by self-appointed spokesmen for Israel and the Jewish community that endless war is in Israel’s interest. He needs to hear in no uncertain terms that Israel is ready for dialogue, that the alternative — endless jihad — is unthinkable. Now is time to change the tune."
__________________
Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it. |
08-29-2006, 08:15 AM | #2 | |
Radical Centrist
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Cottage of Prussia
Posts: 31,423
|
Quote:
Gal Aizenman, 5 years old. Killed by a Palestinian suicide bomber at a bus station. Would you kill her yourself? Would you look in her eyes and push the button, knowing that hundreds of pieces of red-hot shrapnel coated in rat poison would enter her body? Your grandchildren would kill her. Your grandchildren are a bunch of losers. Mine would be in California working as developers. They'd be working to build a bigger and better world, for themselves and for everyone else. Israel has developers... lots of 'em. Palestine doesn't have any. They have an entire university there, An-Najah; and instead of studying something useful, millions in international funds have gone into figuring out how to make bigger and better bombs. After a rather successful suicide bombing, at a Jerusalem Sbarro restaurant in 2001, the students of An-Najah University created a room-sized reenactment display. There go your theoretical grandchildren. So beautiful as they go around celebrating a culture of death. If you really get your wish, one of them will blow themselves up. That's your glorious vision for them. The blood on the walls, they love it. They eat that shit up. Did I mention mine are developers? Our entire argument boils down to progress and civilization versus stupid blood-cult racist/religious claptrap hatred. Do you think these people are the only ones who have had a greivance in the world? The rest of them got on with their lives; these people have developed a stupid death cult because people like you have encouraged it. Well fucking done. Ghandi would smile at you, no? And that's how international terrorism is justified. |
|
08-29-2006, 08:19 AM | #3 |
Slattern of the Swail
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 15,654
|
UT, everyone here knows Hippikos is an anti-Semite. Maybe if we ignore him he'll go away.
__________________
In Barrie's play and novel, the roles of fairies are brief: they are allies to the Lost Boys, the source of fairy dust and ...They are portrayed as dangerous, whimsical and extremely clever but quite hedonistic. "Shall I give you a kiss?" Peter asked and, jerking an acorn button off his coat, solemnly presented it to her. —James Barrie Wimminfolk they be tricksy. - ZenGum |
08-29-2006, 09:09 AM | #4 | ||
Read? I only know how to write.
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 11,933
|
Quote:
Gal is a perfect example of who must die when politicians do not do their job. Her head belongs in Likud's trophy room. Ironic that people such as Gal were assured of life when Israel was negotiating. And then Likud extremists did everything necessary to destroy that peace - to intentionally restart the intafada. Quite intentional for Likud to destroy the Oslo Accords so that West Bank lands could be confiscated - this time with a new trick - the wall. And so Gal must die to the greater glory of Zionism and Likud. Likud whose objective is extremist Zionism: annexation even of the West Bank and Gaza. UT forgot to include that reality in his spin. UT posted Gal not for logical thought. He posted Gal for emotional - classic Rush Limbaugh - propaganda value. He does this with more frequency. UT forgets why violence restarted and why negotiations failed - when Likud extremists intentionally did everything necessary to restart the intafada. The Economist also writes more of what UT ignores: Quote:
|
||
08-29-2006, 08:31 AM | #5 |
Radical Centrist
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Cottage of Prussia
Posts: 31,423
|
Anti-Semite, I wish. Hip is a standard-issue European citizen.
|
08-29-2006, 08:51 AM | #6 | ||
Flocci Non Facio
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: In The Line Of Fire
Posts: 571
|
Quote:
For each pic you post I can post the same from the other side: Here's the grim reality you wish to ignore: Since September 28, 2000: * 383 Palestinian children (under the age of 18) have been killed by the Israeli army and Israeli settlers, i.e. almost 19% of the total Palestinians killed (figure at 21 November 2002); * Approximately 36% of total Palestinians injured (estimated at more than 41,000) are children; * 86 of these children were under the age of ten; * 21 infants under the age of 12 months have been killed; * 500 Palestinian children have been permanently disabled due to Israeli attacks. Of course Brianna would call these statistics antisemitic, wouldn't she? If my grandchildren were ethnic cleansed, deprived from basic daily needs, education, relatives killed, houses destroyed, without any hope of a better future I cannot stand what they do. Because unlike you thy wouldn't live in a developed 1st world country with relatives in a comfortable house with aircon where you can watch sitcoms whilst zipping a coke with ice. All I want is peace for all parties. You, Brianna and Maggie insist on seeing the world in blacks and whites and are willing to keep fighting to the last Israeli or Palestinian. Now why don't you go and read the above editorial from Jewish people who think about a future peace and try to solve the situation instead of inflaming it. You're just the same as the Islam fanatics preaching the endless jihad. Quote:
TW is a communist and I'm an antisemitic, how convenient
__________________
Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it. Last edited by Hippikos; 08-29-2006 at 08:55 AM. |
||
08-29-2006, 09:07 AM | #7 |
Radical Centrist
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Cottage of Prussia
Posts: 31,423
|
The pic you can't post is the one where the Israeli soldier saw the child's eyes.
The pic you can't post is the one at the Israeli University celebrating the massacre. The pic you can't post is the one Photoshopped or brazenly set up. The pic you can't post is of the Israeli gloriously showing his blood-soaked hands to the cheering crowd after lynching a Palestinian. Your grandchild: The pic you can't post is people in Berlin celebrating that event in the name of "peace". Your child: The pic you can't post is the one of the IDF hanging "conspirators" from a crane. Our entire argument boils down to progress and civilization versus stupid blood-cult racist/religious claptrap hatred. |
08-29-2006, 09:18 AM | #8 | |
Read? I only know how to write.
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 11,933
|
Quote:
Even the Iwo Jima picture was staged. Does it matter? UT will take the tiniest and most irrelevant detail to hype it as if the big picture. It is called propaganda. It works on those who cannot see his pictures for what they are. He is promoting hate by posting for emotion response. Photoshopped pictures are only curious details. Dead Gal whose head hangs in Likud's trophy room is only a curious detail. And yet hyping those details is how emotional radical extremists get more trophy heads. They even have UT and Brianna doing their job. |
|
08-29-2006, 09:19 AM | #9 | |
Flocci Non Facio
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: In The Line Of Fire
Posts: 571
|
UT dude, with your last message you show you really lost the plot, sharing your website co-owner Bruce's emotional reasoning.
Some more facts you wish to ignore: The Israeli army’s widespread destruction of schools, the forced closure of educational institutes, the ever- present danger to school children and staff attempting to continue normal education, together demonstrate the Israeli government’s complete violation of the right of Palestinian children to an education. For example: * Since September 2000: → 2,610 pupils have been wounded on their way to or from school; → 245 Palestinian students and school children have been killed and 166 students and 75 teachers have been arrested * Between January and July 2002, Israeli military forces occupied 18 schools in the West Bank, converting them to military bases or prisons; * In Hebron alone, four schools have been converted to military bases, with three still under Israeli control (as of December 2002), denying 1,920 students access to their schools; * Between January and June 2002, 24 schools were heavily shelled by the Israeli military; * Since 29 March 2002, the education process has been completely paralyzed in 850 schools; * Since September 2000, 197 schools have been damaged, 11 schools completely destroyed and 9 vandalized; * From 29 March to 1 May 2002: 1,289 schools were closed, 45,000 tawjihi students supposed to take the general exam in June were prevented from accessing their schools, and 54,730 teaching sessions per day were lost due to complete cessation of classes in major West Bank towns during Israeli military operations. I have dozens of equally grim statistics about health situation, prisons etc. But I hope you get the message. Quote:
__________________
Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it. |
|
08-29-2006, 09:38 AM | #10 | |
in the Hour of Scampering
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Jeffersonville PA (15 mi NW of Philadelphia)
Posts: 4,060
|
Quote:
__________________
"Neither can his Mind be thought to be in Tune,whose words do jarre; nor his reason In frame, whose sentence is preposterous..." |
|
08-29-2006, 10:10 AM | #11 | |
Read? I only know how to write.
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 11,933
|
Quote:
|
|
08-29-2006, 10:32 AM | #12 | |
in the Hour of Scampering
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Jeffersonville PA (15 mi NW of Philadelphia)
Posts: 4,060
|
Quote:
By the way, "facts" that have heavy perspective dependencies have little claim on actually being facts as opposed to interpretations.
__________________
"Neither can his Mind be thought to be in Tune,whose words do jarre; nor his reason In frame, whose sentence is preposterous..." |
|
08-29-2006, 09:41 AM | #13 | ||
Radical Centrist
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Cottage of Prussia
Posts: 31,423
|
All we need, really, is one picture celebrating those events.
Certainly you can find one image of insanely happy Israelis celebrating the destruction of their enemies' school. It's emotional, yes, but it demonstrates the mind-set and shows who wanted that kind of thing to happen. By the way, the idea of a school being destroyed is an emotional one. Because you think of a school as being kinda like the place where you went to school, right? The international community has given billions for those schools. But by 2001, it was tired of them teaching nothing but hate. Canada: Quote:
So, at the demand of the international community, did they change? Quote:
Your grandchildren are being educated to hate. Mine are developers. |
||
08-29-2006, 10:15 AM | #14 | |
Read? I only know how to write.
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 11,933
|
Quote:
|
|
08-29-2006, 10:05 AM | #15 | |
Flocci Non Facio
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: In The Line Of Fire
Posts: 571
|
These, mostly Jordanian schoolbooks didn't stand in the way to make peace with Jordan. Egypt had and still has lotsa antisemitic papers, still there's an active peace between Israel and Egypt.
This should be a good indication that once there is intention on both sides and partners to attain peace, the textbooks cannot stand in the way. The Israeli occupation authority used the Jordanian textbooks for 30 years, and they claim that they removed the “hate education” from them before reprinting them. Unfortunately, some of the things they removed had nothing to do with hate. Displacing the word “Palestine” wherever it occurred in the textbooks by the word “Israel” no matter in what context or period in time, was so ridiculous that it became a laughing matter amongst students and teachers alike, (as an example, in the History textbook of the ninth grade about the crusades, the text “When the Crusades came to Palestine in the 11th century “ became “ when the Crusades came to Israel”). Other displacements were more subtle but dangerous. Learning such values as “valor”, “ love of one’s land”, “sacrifice”, and similar values in reading books is important for children, and they cannot be described as “hate material”, yet many statements and poems with such values were removed. If anything, they indicated bad intentions on the part of Israel in mis-educating Palestinian children. Quote:
__________________
Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it. Last edited by Hippikos; 08-29-2006 at 10:09 AM. |
|
Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests) | |
|
|