Critique of Black Culture

[ladysycamore]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

C'mon Rho, how long do I have to listen to these stations to find out what there discussing? 1 hour? 1 evening? 1 week? That's hardly the same as linking an article that I can read at my convenience and make a judgement on it's author and content. I'm not looking for a hobby or thesis subject.

Then don't regard it as such *shrugs*. It was merely a suggestion. You can listen as long or as little as you like, but let's be "real" here: to only listen for an hour/evening/week isn't going to create miracles, but hell, it's a start.

Besides, I wonder if what makes it on the radio as the supposed topics on every black mind, is the same as the shit being talked about among blacks when I walk up and they look at me like "it's a black thing, you wouldn't understand".

I've always wondered why that statement makes some white folks so dang crazy? And no Bruce, every subject that is discussed are not on *every* black mind.

I work with some older black men that have been around long enough to have lived Jim Crow at it's worst. They've been colored, nigger, negro, black and African American. A few on them won't even talk to white people unless it's required to do their job. They've told me stories (yeah they talk to me) of things that happened to them in the 30's, 40's and 50's that floored me. Regardless of the changing laws and times, you can't say, that's in the past, move on, to these men. They have been permanently scarred, I would be too. But to their credit they don't preach hate to the younger ones and give me the impression they don't approve of the "jive ass niggas" either.

My father is somewhat the same way.

Curious: what's "preaching hate" to the younger ones?

[ladysycamore]

Originally Posted by mrnoodle

They're perpetuating emnity between races by constantly pointing out perceived slights, insults, etc. But they're not offering feasible solutions. One of the biggest jokes of modern society is this business of "raising awareness" as a solution to a problem. Pinning ribbons on lapels, booking a celebrity for a $1,000/plate dinner, bitching on cable news shows, and marching with signs raises awareness, but it's never ever ever been shown to do a damn bit of good FIXING anything. Ditto for governmental programs - they're poorly administrated, corrupt, and serve only to "show people that we're doing something". Instead, people need to be good to one another on an individual level. That can't happen when supposed "leaders" are constantly throwing lit matches into a brushpile.

Well, as far as I'm concerned, NO ONE has *the* answer anyway. So, I personally listen to every suggestion, and pick the one that I have some common ground with.

[ladysycamore]

Originally Posted by Troubleshooter

What exactly is a people?

What do Italians have to be proud of?

What do Spaniards have to be proud of?

What do Chinese have to be proud of?

What do blacks have to be proud of?

How about asking Italians, Spanish, Chinese, Af/Americans, etc. what they are proud of?

[ladysycamore]

Originally Posted by sycamore

Keep in mind, though, that many people believe that the government should take care of such issues. That's not necessarily good or bad...it just is.

IMO, the government has a responsibility to take care of it's citizens, to a certain degree.

Notice people: I didn't say in EVERY sense, so don't get on my damn case about handouts, etc.

[Troubleshooter]

Originally Posted by ladysycamore

How about asking Italians, Spanish, Chinese, Af/Americans, etc. what they are proud of?

The question is what has each of those groups accomplished?

[Troubleshooter]

Originally Posted by ladysycamore

I've always wondered why that statement makes some white folks so dang crazy? And no Bruce, every subject that is discussed are not on *every* black mind.

Because it's being said by a group that is simultaneously bitching about not being included in our reindeer games.

[ladysycamore]

Originally Posted by Troubleshooter

The question is what has each of those groups accomplished?

But why ask those who are not of those ethnicites? It's always good to go to the source.

Originally Posted by ladysycamore
I've always wondered why that statement makes some white folks so dang crazy? And no Bruce, every subject that is discussed are not on *every* black mind.

TS:
Because it's being said by a group that is simultaneously bitching about not being included in our reindeer games.

And if you can't beat 'em or join 'em...then do your own damn thing.

AAAANYway, there are just some things that I may mention that you will not possibly relate to in a way that another Af/American will relate to. (and NOOO I don't mean "studying" or "discussing" either!!)

Not to say that ALL Af/Ams will necessarily relate, but I'd be willing to bet that they would have SOME kind of recognition/connection in some way. I just don't see why that's so "upsetting" to some people.

[Troubleshooter]

Originally Posted by ladysycamore

But why ask those who are not of those ethnicites? It's always good to go to the source.

I'm beginning to see a pattern here. Do you really have any answers of your own? Do you actually have an informed opinion based on research or study or do you just glom on to the most recent tidbit or the most strident voice of protest?

As far as sources, I believe that I have read enough history to be sure of the accomplishments of the non-black groups in my previous question, my point was to ask whether you actually have any clue of the accomplishments of the group that you are so busy trumpeting about.

Originally Posted by ladysycamore

And if you can't beat 'em or join 'em...then do your own damn thing.

So it's a case of sandlot politics?

Originally Posted by ladysycamore

AAAANYway, there are just some things that I may mention that you will not possibly relate to in a way that another Af/American will relate to. (and NOOO I don't mean "studying" or "discussing" either!!)

So you're going to further perpetuate the stereotype by pretending that that whole "black thing" is a good thing and that people should just not try to understand?

Originally Posted by ladysycamore

Not to say that ALL Af/Ams will necessarily relate, but I'd be willing to bet that they would have SOME kind of recognition/connection in some way. I just don't see why that's so "upsetting" to some people.

I think that both camps have enough crossover members that that doesn't hold water. I've seen more than enough ethnically challenged people in this town as well as my share of people who are successful regardless of their heritage.

[ladysycamore]

Originally Posted by ladysycamore
But why ask those who are not of those ethnicites? It's always good to go to the source.

I'm beginning to see a pattern here.

Really? I was just thinking the same of you.

Do you really have any answers of your own?

M'kay...

Do you actually have an informed opinion based on research or study or do you just glom on to the most recent tidbit or the most strident voice of protest?

*shrugs* I thought an opinion was an opinion no matter where it came from.

As far as sources, I believe that I have read enough history to be sure of the accomplishments of the non-black groups in my previous question, my point was to ask whether you actually have any clue of the accomplishments of the group that you are so busy trumpeting about.

"Originally Posted by Troubleshooter
What exactly is a people?
What do Italians have to be proud of?
What do Spaniards have to be proud of?
What do Chinese have to be proud of?
What do blacks have to be proud of?

YOU asked those questions, and IIRC, you asked them of Sycamore and NOT me. Boy, for someone who like to study, you sure ask a lot of questions that I wouldn't have expected for someone of your expertise.

Oh and BTW, yes I DO have a clue of the accomplishments of various ethnic groups, thanks.

Originally Posted by ladysycamore
And if you can't beat 'em or join 'em...then do your own damn thing.

So it's a case of sandlot politics?

You said it, not me. I was being somewhat facetious anyway..damn!

Originally Posted by ladysycamore
AAAANYway, there are just some things that I may mention that you will not possibly relate to in a way that another Af/American will relate to. (and NOOO I don't mean "studying" or "discussing" either!!)

So you're going to further perpetuate the stereotype by pretending that that whole "black thing" is a good thing and that people should just not try to understand?

LOL, again your assumptions.
Never said it was "good" or "bad". It just "is". You can try to understand all you damn well want to. That doesn't mean that you will. And wow, sometimes, it's OKAYYYY to not understand everyone and everything! Whatta concept! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Originally Posted by ladysycamore
Not to say that ALL Af/Ams will necessarily relate, but I'd be willing to bet that they would have SOME kind of recognition/connection in some way. I just don't see why that's so "upsetting" to some people.

I think that both camps have enough crossover members that that doesn't hold water.

"Crossover" is great, but that's not what I was talking about. Sure, there are some things that all/any group can relate to, and find some common ground, but there will be *some* things that we will not relate to when it comes to certain parts of various cultures. I'm talking about connections on a deeper level than just "studying" and "discussing".

Oh, btw, you (and anyone else) are officially invited to our Kwanzaa Celebration on The Bosque . Remember, the day after Christmas is "Umoja":

(Unity)
To strive for and maintain unity in the family, community, nation and race.

Habari gani!

[Troubleshooter]

Originally Posted by ladysycamore

Really? I was just thinking the same of you.

It's hard to go wrong if you share a few thoughts with me, but you missed a few vital steps.

Originally Posted by ladysycamore

*shrugs* I thought an opinion was an opinion no matter where it came from.

True, but that doesn't make it a good opinion. One formed from an aggregation of knowledge and ideas that gives you a defensible point.

Originally Posted by ladysycamore

Boy, for someone who like to study, you sure ask a lot of questions that I wouldn't have expected for someone of your expertise.

That's because your idea of rhetoric is a snap and a turbo chicken neck twist.

Originally Posted by ladysycamore

Oh and BTW, yes I DO have a clue of the accomplishments of various ethnic groups, thanks.

Then make with discussion instead of evasion.

Originally Posted by ladysycamore

LOL, again your assumptions.
Never said it was "good" or "bad". It just "is". You can try to understand all you damn well want to. That doesn't mean that you will. And wow, sometimes, it's OKAYYYY to not understand everyone and everything! Whatta concept! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Maybe in your world ignorance is acceptable. Even the things that I'm unable to understand are brought back out into the light for a second or third study when time permits.

Originally Posted by ladysycamore

"Crossover" is great, but that's not what I was talking about. Sure, there are some things that all/any group can relate to, and find some common ground, but there will be *some* things that we will not relate to when it comes to certain parts of various cultures. I'm talking about connections on a deeper level than just "studying" and "discussing".

The is nothing, nothing that seperates people other than thought. To perpetuate the idea of "it's a black thing," or "aryan supremecy" is intellectual laziness and a crime against humanity because it is the root of what is wrong in most of the world.

[Troubleshooter]

Originally Posted by ladysycamore

Oh, btw, you (and anyone else) are officially invited to our Kwanzaa Celebration on The Bosque.

http://www.spectator.org/dsp_article.asp?art_id=5914

Kwanza Komedy
By Kathy Shaidle
Published 12/16/2003 11:10:28 AM

'Twas the night before Kwanzaa
And all through the 'hood,
Maulana Karenga was up to no good.

He'd tortured a woman and spent time in jail.
He needed a new scam that just wouldn't fail.
("So what if I stuck some chick's toe in a vice?
Nobody said revolution was nice!")

The Sixties were over. Now what would he do?
Why, he went back to school -- so that's "Dr." to you!
He once ordered shootouts at UCLA
Now he teaches Black Studies just miles away.

Then to top it all off, the good Doctor's new plan
Was to get rid of Christmas and piss off The Man.

Karenga invented a fake holiday.
He called the thing Kwanza. "Hey, what's that you say?

"You don't get what's 'black' about Maoist baloney?
You say that my festival's totally phony?

"Who cares if corn isn't an African crop?
Who cares if our harvest's a month or two off?
Who cares if Swahili's not our mother tongue?
A lie for The Cause never hurt anyone!

"Umoja! Ujima! Kujichagulia, too!
Collectivist crap never sounded so cool!
Those guilty white liberals -- easy to fool.
Your kids will now celebrate Kwanzaa in school!"

And we heard him exclaim as he drove out of sight:
"Happy Kwanzaa to all, except if you're white!"

[ladysycamore]

Originally Posted by Troubleshooter

True, but that doesn't make it a good opinion. One formed from an aggregation of knowledge and ideas that gives you a defensible point.

Oh so now it's all about whether or not an opinion is "good" or not. (why am I not surprised...)

That's because your idea of rhetoric is a snap and a turbo chicken neck twist.

Oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo good one! I've been known to snap and twist on occasion.

Then make with discussion instead of evasion.

Hm...I thought I was discussing.

There is nothing, nothing that seperates people other than thought.

I suppose this is one of your "good opinions"?

To perpetuate the idea of "it's a black thing," or "aryan supremecy" is intellectual laziness and a crime against humanity because it is the root of what is wrong in most of the world.

Oh god..."crime against humanity"... Such melodrama.

Ok well, the offer to join the celebration still stands.
Good day.

[xoxoxoBruce]

As far as sources, I believe that I have read enough history to be sure of the accomplishments of the non-black groups in my previous question, my point was to ask whether you actually have any clue of the accomplishments of the group that you are so busy trumpeting about.

I know a lot of them. Those selfish black people invented so much good stuff they didn't leave hardly anything for anybody else to invent. :p

[wolf]

You're just jealous you didn't think of peanut butter first.

[wolf]

This gentleman is truly impressive ... not because he was Black, but because of what he was able to accomplish despite a lack of formal education.

Drive, initiative, and brilliance bring one to the fore, no matter what.