Bush's Shrinking Safety Zone

[tw]

I read where George Jr has a dress code for the White House. Does it ban blue dresses? As long as there is no blue dress, does that mean the president can lie and not be impeached? Clearly demonstrates what are righteous religious principles. I wonder if dog collars were also banned? Otherwise somebody might get the wrong idea.

[tw]

From the NY Times of 9 Dec 2005:

Qaeda-Iraq Link U.S. Cited Is Tied to Coercion Claim
The Bush administration based a crucial prewar assertion about ties between Iraq and Al Qaeda on detailed statements made by a prisoner while in Egyptian custody who later said he had fabricated them to escape harsh treatment, according to current and former government officials.

The officials said the captive, Ibn al-Shaykh al-Libi, provided his most specific and elaborate accounts about ties between Iraq and Al Qaeda only after he was secretly handed over to Egypt by the United States in January 2002, in a process known as rendition.

The new disclosure provides the first public evidence that bad intelligence on Iraq may have resulted partly from the administration's heavy reliance on third countries to carry out interrogations of Qaeda members and others detained as part of American counterterrorism efforts. The Bush administration used Mr. Libi's accounts as the basis for its prewar claims, now discredited, that ties between Iraq and Al Qaeda included training in explosives and chemical weapons.

Clearly the above must be all lies. First, it is contrary to what religous Christian extremists have been telling us. Torture does not produce lies - even though tortured enemies in Guantanamo provide unreliable information. Even though we contract others to do it - rendition. Even though we are not secretly kidnapping people in other nations. Even though numerous people once held in Guantanamo for years are being quietly released back to freedom in their own countries - because they were never terrorists.

The Bush administration used Mr. Libi's accounts as the basis for its prewar claims, now discredited, that ties between Iraq and Al Qaeda included training in explosives and chemical weapons.

The fact that Mr. Libi recanted after the American invasion of Iraq and that intelligence based on his remarks was withdrawn by the C.I.A. in March 2004 has been public for more than a year. But American officials had not previously acknowledged either that Mr. Libi made the false statements in foreign custody or that Mr. Libi contended that his statements had been coerced. ...

The [CIA] currently holds between two and three dozen high-ranking terrorist suspects in secret prisons around the world.

But these prisons never exists. A righteous Christian tells us so. The president wouldn't lie.

Among the first and most prominent assertions was one by Mr. Bush, who said in a major speech in Cincinnati in October 2002 that "we've learned that Iraq has trained Al Qaeda members in bomb making and poisons and gases." ...

The question of why the administration relied so heavily on the statements by Mr. Libi has long been a subject of contention. ...

The document showed that the Defense Intelligence Agency had identified Mr. Libi as a probable fabricator months before the Bush administration began to use his statements as the foundation for its claims about ties between Iraq and Al Qaeda involving illicit weapons.

Just waiting for George Jr to claim that he also reads his PDBs. After all, what is one more white lie. The nuns told me that lying was a mortal sin. Clearly the nuns were wrong. George Jr is god's chosen one. George Jr would never commit a mortal sin.

[lookout123]

tw- i don't necessarily disagree that we need more boots in the sand to bring this to a quick close... but have you read some of the independents, such as Michael Yon.

although the situation is far from good, it is necessarily as dire as we see on TV. i'm just sayin'.

[Urbane Guerrilla]

I see, tw, that you are still hellbent to lose the war to a bunch of religious bigots who don't deserve to win anything but a sudden death.

I say you are a fool. You can't even conceive of knowing any better, you walking bundle of wisdomless short circuits. Daily you demonstrate that your third eye needs its glasses cleaned.

[tw]

Originally Posted by lookout123

although the situation is far from good, it is necessarily as dire as we see on TV. i'm just sayin'.

Who is looking at TV? Do the numbers. Iraqi unemployment still remains just as high - well in excess of 50%. Why join the army? Army is one of the few jobs that actually pays. Now if that recruit can just stay out of combat - which is why so many Iraqi battalions disappear when the battle starts.

Where are these utilities that are provided how many years after "Mission Accomplished" was declared? Even Saigon had better electrical supply while we were losing the Vietnam War. Baghdad still has less electricity than when Saddam was in power. In Iraq, Americans don't leave the once called Green Zones. Even Vietnam was safer for Americans during that war.

American intelligence numbers say the insurgency is growing in numbers so large that they really are not sure how large the insurgency is. In only eight months, one insurgency group call Zarqawi could increase his numbers by a factor of ten! And new insurgency groups are appearing every month. This is widespread. So where is this victory?

The numbers say things completely different from what George Jr is preaching. For if things were getting better, then why is unemployment so high? Why have the number of battle ready Iraqi battalions only decreased - down to one. If things are getting better, then why have the military stopped talking about ongoing reconstruction? No sense talking about reconstruction when most projects were halted - some literally sabotaged. If things are getting better, then why does more than 25% of all reconstruction money, instead, go to security? Even in Vietnam, construction did not require so much security.

If this were Firestone, then we would all be blaming failures on someone else - ie Ford - and then claim the war against failing tires was being won. Then we could ignore the numbers of failed tires. If the war was being won, then Urbane Guerilla could post some facts demonstrating same. Well, maybe that is too much of a stretch.....

The facts stand sharply consistent with Vietnam of 30 years previous. Americans in Iraq must reside only in areas with multiple layers of security. There are few places outside of Kurdish and southern Iraq that is safe for any American without layers of protection. Even Fallujah, that was suppose to be a secured city instead saw multiple artillery shells maim 21 Marines. This in a city where those shells should have been detected by explosive sniffing machines. So how did all those bombs still get into Fallujah if we are winning this war? Deja vue Vietnam ... all over again. We won that war too? Yes, in the minds of those who denied reality of the numbers. Ie Willaim Westmoreland - may he also sizzle in hell and his own lies.

With current troop levels, we are losing the "Mission Accomplished" war. But the generals have always said we don't have enough troops. Who do you believe? Republican Party spin doctors who decided to "fix" Iraq and who now short the generals of needed troops? Or the generals who actually do the work? The generals say they don't have enough troops. Facts say that we are not winning "Mission Accomplished" - which is only consistent with what the generals are saying.

So how does George Jr win this war? He is currently on a propaganda campaign to 'win the war'. Clearly propaganda can win a war because the enemy is American minds. Does George Jr give the product people - the generals - what they need? Of course not. MBAs win by cutting costs - not solving problems. George Jr need only convince US that the war is being won. So again he can claim "Mission Accomplished". Deja vue Vietnam. The numbers say the "Mission Accomplished" war is being lost no matter how much propaganda George Jr spews.

The numbers are damning to any claim made by George Jr or President Cheney.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by lookout123

tw- i don't necessarily disagree that we need more boots in the sand to bring this to a quick close... but have you read some of the independents, such as Michael Yon.

although the situation is far from good, it is necessarily as dire as we see on TV. i'm just sayin'.

The Stryker Brigade that Mike Yon was with seems to be effective. But it looks to me it's like being the world champion at "Whack-A-Mole", they keep whacking but the "Mole" supply seems endless.

On another note....The Iraqui people have been so closely controlled, for so long, I wonder if they've lost all inititive to do anything but wait to see what they are given by the government?

[Griff]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

On another note....The Iraqui people have been so closely controlled, for so long, I wonder if they've lost all inititive to do anything but wait to see what they are given by the government?

It makes me wonder how fragile and complex voluntary associations between people are. As we in this country replace choices with mandates and interdependence with dependence, will we reach a tipping point?

[xoxoxoBruce]

Like in New Orleans?

[richlevy]

Originally Posted by Urbane Guerrilla

I see, tw, that you are still hellbent to lose the war to a bunch of religious bigots who don't deserve to win anything but a sudden death.

Hey, you can't talk about Kansas like that.

[tw]

Within Republican extremist circles, they are trying to decide where George Jr will appear in relation to Reagan on the list of great presidents. They don't have a clue because of their .... well we have Urbane Guerilla who has the same grasp of reality.

Today George Jr spent a very short time exposed to the public - in Philadelphia. The boos were loud and aggressive - as any patriot must. To have so much animosity towards a president, one must go all the way back to another scumbag president - Richard Nixon. Presidents that lie for their own personal glory must avoid public exposure. Just being on the streets of Philadelphia - well, news reports suggest violence was on the verge of breaking out.

But then, when was the last time an American president caused the death of 100,000 civilians in a conquered nation. He did not even understand the purpose of war - and therefore left Iraq to simmer for seven months without any effort to construct an ally. Only an idiot leader would have done that. And only an idiot would fire the army and police - in direct contradiction to basic military doctrine. Yet we never had reason to attribute intelligent thought to this man.

As new reports note, George Jr is desperately campaigning for his popularity. It's billed as a speech about Iraq. Finally the public has seen George Jr for what he is - as was becoming apparent so many years ago in those contentious posts between MaggieL and this author. Which one correctly identified George Jr's agenda?

A liar only because he is the mental equivalent of Dan Quayle. He has not a clue - does not even read his PDBs or even the famous four page memo from Paul O'Neill (his Sec of Treasury). But George Jr does have a self serving political agenda. And so he goes about the country, carefully protected from the public, presenting Rush Limbaugh type logic in speeches to defend his fiasco - the "Mission Accomplished" war.

Richard Nixon would sacrifice 35,000 of America's best only because he could not lose Vietnam on 'his watch'. Denial is essential when the president is more concerned about his ranking in history than in the purpose of his job. George Jr would even condone torture to secure a high ranking on that historical list - screw America as necessary. But the George Jr was educated as an MBA - means such thinking is consistent with his education.

And so the patriots in the street of Philadelphia loudly called president names that were appropriate.

We only have two acceptable options in this war we created when we Pearl Harbored Iraq. Either we give the generals sufficient troops to end this problem this year - or we pull out within the year. Anything else - such as the George Jr strategy - will only prolong this war even for a decades, massacre America's best in a "Mission Accomplished" war that cannot be won, and make America one of the worlds less respected nations. Either we must get in to fix the problem, or get out that another president so smartly did in Somolia. It requires a president with real balls - and a grasp of the world.

[tw]

In 2004, ABCNEWS, BBC and Time Assess Iraq
What We Found

By nearly every quantifiable measure, the situation has improved since before the war — and also since our last effort.

However, the one exception security also happens to be the yardstick that Iraqis say matters most.

That was a year ago. The BBC last night announced from Baghdad a result of the latest poll conducted by ABC News, Time Magazine, BBC, Der Spiegel, and NHK. By numbers of two to one, Iraqis declared everything as worse than it was under Saddam. Security has never been worse - although neighborhood security and security in the more rural areas has improved. But other things such as jobs, basic human services, etc all were lists as worse. After US spending $2billion just on the electrical grid, Iraq still has less electricity than under Saddam. Amazing what happens when an MBA throws money at a problem - that he created.

BTW, the ABC News version of the same poll is more optimistic noting gains in Shia and Kurd regions. But most important is the Iraq overall opinion that Americans should leave once the Iraqi government takes power. That means get out in one year.

As the president stomped his 'I'm doing good' tour, remember what the numbers really say in Iraq. Things are getting worse every year the US stays there with woefully too few troops. The generals say we needed about 500,000. George Jr only gives then 135,000. Classic of MBA cost controls.

Finally the BBC World Service reporter noted one more glaring fact. Last year, he recorded the poll's report from inside an Iraqi shopping mall. Today, he says, he does not dare enter that mall anymore. Doing so would only invite death or kidnapping. Yes, Iraq is getting worse every year - no matter what the mental midget president declares - while carefully protected from public view. Just like Richard Nixon - who lied when he declared himself 'not a crook'.

[richlevy]

What I found very interesting was GWB's answer to the 'Saddam-9/11' link. He stated that the reason that 9/11 was a reason to invade Iraq was that 9/11 taught him not to ignore danger.

I'm surprised he didn't explain his thinking to Congress when he was seeking authorization. I'm sure they would have understood his reasoning and found it well worth 200 billion dollars and 17,000 US casualties.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Agree or not, at least I could have respected that position.

[Undertoad]

ABC itself, left to digest the same poll as tw's BBC

Poll: Broad Optimism in Iraq, But Also Deep Divisions Among Groups

Surprising levels of optimism prevail in Iraq with living conditions improved, security more a national worry than a local one, and expectations for the future high. But views of the country's situation overall are far less positive, and there are vast differences in views among Iraqi groups — a study in contrasts between increasingly disaffected Sunni areas and vastly more positive Shiite and Kurdish provinces.

An ABC News poll in Iraq, conducted with Time magazine and other media partners, includes some remarkable results: Despite the daily violence there, most living conditions are rated positively, seven in 10 Iraqis say their own lives are going well, and nearly two-thirds expect things to improve in the year ahead.

Surprisingly, given the insurgents' attacks on Iraqi civilians, more than six in 10 Iraqis feel very safe in their own neighborhoods, up sharply from just 40 percent in a poll in June 2004. And 61 percent say local security is good — up from 49 percent in the first ABC News poll in Iraq in February 2004.

Nonetheless, nationally, security is seen as the most pressing problem by far; 57 percent identify it as the country's top priority. Economic improvements are helping the public mood.

Average household incomes have soared by 60 percent in the last 20 months (to $263 a month), 70 percent of Iraqis rate their own economic situation positively, and consumer goods are sweeping the country. In early 2004, 6 percent of Iraqi households had cell phones; now it's 62 percent. Ownership of satellite dishes has nearly tripled, and many more families now own air conditioners (58 percent, up from 44 percent), cars, washing machines and kitchen appliances.
...
Other views, moreover, are more negative: Fewer than half, 46 percent, say the country is better off now than it was before the war. And half of Iraqis now say it was wrong for U.S.-led forces to invade in spring 2003, up from 39 percent in 2004.

The number of Iraqis who say things are going well in their country overall is just 44 percent, far fewer than the 71 percent who say their own lives are going well. Fifty-two percent instead say the country is doing badly.

There's other evidence of the United States' increasing unpopularity: Two-thirds now oppose the presence of U.S. and coalition forces in Iraq, 14 points higher than in February 2004. Nearly six in 10 disapprove of how the United States has operated in Iraq since the war, and most of them disapprove strongly. And nearly half of Iraqis would like to see U.S. forces leave soon.

Specifically, 26 percent of Iraqis say U.S. and other coalition forces should "leave now" and another 19 percent say they should go after the government chosen in this week's election takes office; that adds to 45 percent. Roughly the other half says coalition forces should remain until security is restored (31 percent), until Iraqi security forces can operate independently (16 percent), or longer (5 percent).

[xoxoxoBruce]

Other views, moreover, are more negative: Fewer than half, 46 percent, say the country is better off now than it was before the war. And half of Iraqis now say it was wrong for U.S.-led forces to invade in spring 2003, up from 39 percent in 2004.

There's other evidence of the United States' increasing unpopularity: Two-thirds now oppose the presence of U.S. and coalition forces in Iraq, 14 points higher than in February 2004. Nearly six in 10 disapprove of how the United States has operated in Iraq since the war, and most of them disapprove strongly. And nearly half of Iraqis would like to see U.S. forces leave soon.

Nothing unites a country like a common enemy.
Uh...that would be us.