Is it ever *ok* to cheat?

[Sheldonrs]

I have never understood the mindset of someone who dates/sleeps with a married person, hoping they will leave their spouse and marry them.
All you are getting is someone who cheats on the person they are married to.

That's like stealing a great looking car and parking it the middle of the worst neighborhood and leaving the doors un-locked.

[Dagney]

Originally Posted by Shawnee123

I like what you had to say, Dagney. I hope to have a relationship of mutual respect like that someday. Respecting, not only by not cheating, but with your words, and actions, and the way you live your life.

Through some my fault and some not my fault, I have failed to find that so far.

Cheers to you and yours!

Thanks Shawnee

I have always thought that relationships were best when a strong foundation is laid. I treat people the way I wish to be treated (for the most part, I'm not always perfect, especially when the bitch engine is revving). And part of that, is to treat people with the respect that I'd like to be given.

I can't remember who said it, and I think it was Zippy actually - that a marriage is not 50/50 - you can't just give 'half'. You have to give your everything - and so does your partner - it's 100/100. To me, cheating, either physically, emotionally, or in any other manner, takes away from that 100/100 ratio, and damages the foundation of the relationship - it chips away at the trust and respect that you have for your partner, and I strongly think that cheating chips away at your own self respect, as well as the self respect of the person you're cheating on. (Been there, done that, being cheated on is devastating)

In regards to the Man, it took me a _long_ time to find him. And well, there are days where I wonder what lottery I won to have him just 'drop' into my life. Some day - I'll put together the story of how we met and what transpired to bring us together. It's an interesting story.

In the past few months, I've figured out that the guys I dated previously (for the most part) did not treat me the way I deserved to be treated. That's partly my fault - because I let them treat me in a way that was less than what I deserved. It was quite the eye opening experience - that's for sure.

I'm not sure what changed actually - if it was finding him, and the recognition of being treated well came after that - or if I changed beforehand, making it the right 'time' in my life for him to find me. I know that in one of our first long conversations, he said that while he felt terrible that I had been through so many painful things in my past, that those things were what eventually made me 'ready' to be found by him - and vice versa of course.

Either way - I'm tremendously glad that we're together

[Shawnee123]

Originally Posted by Dagney

Thanks Shawnee

In the past few months, I've figured out that the guys I dated previously (for the most part) did not treat me the way I deserved to be treated. That's partly my fault - because I let them treat me in a way that was less than what I deserved. It was quite the eye opening experience - that's for sure.

That has been my situation, selling myself short. Actually, my ex husband is a great guy...we are just better at being best friends than we were at being married. But the couple relationships I've had since then I've let them take me for granted.

Your words and feelings are inspiring. I feel that if I don't find that right guy I'll be fine, and I'm not looking for it...but the romantic side of me hopes I win that kind of lottery: a caring, respecting, funny guy who I can count on!

[Dagney]

I'd offer you his brother, but his wife may not like that

I seriously stopped looking, and he (almost literally) fell in my lap.

[Shawnee123]

You must tell the story!

[Dagney]

Once upon a time.....

Nah, I changed my mind.

[Elspode]

Originally Posted by lumberjim

the posts elspode has shared about selene being out on dates, however, have the opposite impact on my imagination.

My posts on that topic are meant to reveal my own state of mind at a given moment - the moment of the posting, actually. It isn't required, or even possible (IMHO) to be always and utterly at ease with everything about a poly relationship.

It is my own internal and minute to minute misgivings I share. I'm not intending to indict the *concept* of poly/open marriage. I feel as though that sharing what goes through my head is far more honest than waxing eloquent about the philosophical, emotional and intellectual superiority of poly relationships. I have, in fact, seen someone do exactly that on an e-list recently, and watched with some bemusement as his wife divorced him a couple of short months later. I'm pretty sure I've mentioned somewhere along the line that this sort of thing isn't right for everyone, and on some evenings, it isn't right for me, either. But I usually get over it once I've whined enough.

Mostly, I'm whining because I'm not exactly a hot property right now, while Selene is doing rather well. I am happy for her, unhappy for me, and that's a part of the reality of this type of relationship. I don't really mean to communicate anything other than my own chagrin, and to provide some insight on the inner workings of insecurity and polyamory in action. Think of it as my offering in the intellectual voyeurism contest.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Extramarital sex leads to extramarital intimacy.
Extramarital intimacy leads to extramarital love.
Extramarital love leads to marital fear.
Marital fear leads to marital anger.
Marital anger leads to marital stress.
Marital stress leads to doobies.
Doobies leads to Twinkies.
Twinkies lead to fat.
Fat leads to embarrassment.
Embarrassment leads to hiding in the Cellar instead of getting fresh air and exercise.
Works for me.

[Elspode]

One of the ways that I know that Bruce is a really standup guy is that he insists on making me look at the big picture, even though I really only want to scan the Readers Digest.

For someone I've never met, he's about my best damn friend in many ways.

[kerosene]

Bruce, are you saying that extramarital sex is the path to the dark side?

[yesman065]

Els you are the first one to share the inner workings of a poly relationship and it has been quite eye opening for me. I appreciate your honesty and candid posts. Thanks for that!

[Iggy]

Originally Posted by yesman065

Iggy that polyamorous attitude seems contradictory to "That is why I feel we can be together for the rest of our lives." I just don't understand how that can work. I'm not being judgemental - I'm honestly tying to understand that philosophy.

Well, that might have been a bad choice of words. We want to be together for as long as possible. I guess the best way to put it is if we have the freedom to be who we want to be, then why leave? We love each other very much and trust each other very much and we can expand our horizons while staying in the relationship. There isn't going to be a day where we get bored and want to go elsewhere and are forced to cheat or separate. If that makes sense. We both know that there could be things in the future that cause us to not want to be together, but we have been through so much it is hard to imagine. I honestly don't know how to describe it. But I do know that from where I sit right now I can't see any reason for him to leave me or for me to leave him. I will mull this over some more and try to find a more satisfactory answer.

[yesman065]

I find it very fascinating, I think I get what you mean, but the whole idea is so contradictory to everything I have ever known it just - well I dunno. I don't mean that I'm against it or negative towards it in any way either.

[Iggy]

I think elspode and case say it best. I am just not the best at saying what I want to say... *ugh*

[Elspode]

Nonsense. Your point of view is quite cogent and a welcome addition to such discussions. As with all things, each individual experiences polyamory/open marriage in a different manner. No two experiences or points of view are likely to be precisely the same, even though the activities involved often are.

Polyamory is a pretty alien concept to our society in general. Discussing both the concept and our individual experiences is a good thing, IMHO.