Saving the US Auto Industry

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by Shawnee123

The smartass side of me thinks that perhaps some of the employees could sell their RV that's bigger than my place, their top of the line Harley, their 45000 ton pick-em-up truck, and learn to live like the rest of us schmucks who get by with so much less.

Sell them to whom?

[glatt]

Do they deliver? I could use a shed. I'd pay $100 for a large RV. I'm sure my neighbors would be thrilled if I parked one in my back yard.

[Shawnee123]

Sell them to whom?

I dunno: Honda employees?

Haa...true! The smartass side of me doesn't always think things through.

So we have to change our entire culture that you don't have to have the biggest bike on the block, the nicest house in the hood, and the biggest camper in the camp. Not gonna happen. The smartass side of me wants to say: sorry dumbass, you should have saved a dime or two from your ridiculous wages, and not spend it all on pretending you're somebody.

[glatt]

The Ant and the Grasshopper

IN a field one summer’s day a Grasshopper was hopping about, chirping and singing to its heart’s content. An Ant passed by, bearing along with great toil an ear of corn he was taking to the nest.
“Why not come and chat with me,” said the Grasshopper, “instead of toiling and moiling in that way?"
“I am helping to lay up food for the winter,” said the Ant, “and recommend you to do the same.”
“Why bother about winter?” said the Grasshopper; “we have got plenty of food at present.” But the Ant went on its way and continued its toil. When the winter came the Grasshopper had no food, and found itself dying of hunger, while it saw the ants distributing every day corn and grain from the stores they had collected in the summer. Then the Grasshopper knew:
“IT IS BEST TO PREPARE FOR THE DAYS OF NECESSITY.”

The Grasshopper went back to his RV and tried to hang himself, but the ceiling wasn't high enough.

[glatt]

Of course, the modern version of the Ant and the Grasshopper has the Ant putting all his food in the 401K storage room only to have it be eaten by hungry mole digging through.

[footfootfoot]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

Sell them to whom?

The Chinese, obviously.

[Clodfobble]

Originally Posted by glatt

Do they deliver? I could use a shed. I'd pay $100 for a large RV. I'm sure my neighbors would be thrilled if I parked one in my back yard.

There's a house in my neighborhood that was either remodeled, or custom-built in the first place, to have a part of the garage be two stories high, so they can park their RV inside. It's pretty funny looking.

[tw]

Originally Posted by Shawnee123

The problem: the other big employers in this area are suppliers. If GM goes down, they suffer. Honda suffers because they are paying more to make up for business the supplier isn't getting from GM...the trickle effect is quite scary.

You have ignored lessons from history. If GM goes down, all those supplies and all those employee jobs are saved. GM then reorganizes. However if GM gets $billions, then those jobs are lost later and supplies go under.

Stated was a fact you should know - Chapter 7 verse Chapter 11. Liars tell us that if GM goes down, that all jobs are lost. Wrong. Wrong are repeatedly demonstrated in history.

Meanwhile, this will do nothing to affect Honda’s part prices. In fact, using basic economics, Honda’s prices will go down. No, prices won’t because of other facts based in a concept called quality – beyond this discussion.

GM has no intention of fixing their problem because of a big carrot - $billions of free money. GM will not fix anything until bankruptcy theats force GM to fix their only problem - Rick Wagoner. The longer Rick Wagoner is there, then Chapter 7 becomes more likely.

We are all expected to learn from history. Next post will provide but another historical example that everyone should know. Again, company saved once the only problem was removed.

[tw]

Why does IBM still exist? John Akers, an MBA, was running IBM into the ground while claiming to be fixing IBM. In 1992, Bill Gates finally understood why he had so much trouble with IBM. 1990s IBM desks had IBM-XT PCs with CGA monitors. No software sold in malls could run on computers in IBM Corporate. John Akers did not even know how to use a computer except for e-mail and stock quotes. He also promoted a myth called computer literacy. Akers was the classic bean counter who stifled innovation (especially in mainframes) and therefore destroyed 100,000 jobs.

How did IBM save itself? From Wikipedia, Louis Gerstner

is credited with saving IBM ... he describes his arrival at the company in April 1993, when an active plan was in place to disaggregate the company. The prevailing wisdom of the time held that IBM's core mainframe business was headed for obsolescence. The company's own management was in the process of allowing its various divisions to rebrand and manage themselves — the so-called "Baby Blues."

Gerstner reversed this plan, ... His decision to keep the company together was the defining decision of his tenure. The subsequent refocusing on the IT services business, the embrace of the Internet as a business phenomenon, and a broad effort to revive the company's culture are widely seen as having resulted in one of the most remarkable turnarounds in business history.

IBM stopped firing employees when Gerstner enabled employess to focus on products.

What is always needed to save a company? 85% of all problems are directly traceable to ... but then how many finally appreciate what everyone should have known long ago.

John Akers became IBM's president in 1983. Therefore ten years of stifled innovation terminated over 100,000 jobs. How does GM fix itself? Their Akers (Wagoner) must be replaced by a Gerstner. However some are so misinformed as to blame employees or unions rather than stifled innovation. John Akers and Rick Wagoner are classic bean counters with no grasp of the product and a denial that they are the problem.

Deutsche Bank has a target price for GM stock at zero dollars.

[tw]

Originally Posted by Shawnee123

The GM stories I've heard are different. Retirees have told me of days spent playing cards. They make much more than Honda employees, but don't seem to have the accountability...

Then you did not work in a GM plant. These are very hard working people - very responsible. When a bad attitude exists, you can quickly see why. Bad attitude is created by bad management. Management so self centered and so destructive to even change all signs to read "employe". Spend massive money only because the boss is important.

Productive company - your boss works for you. Communism - you work for your boss. GM is very communist. Obviously, employees will have a bad attitude. The CEO makes that obvious.

Yes, one day there were many idle employees. A 747 carrying essential parts crashed in Malaysia. Slowly employees had no more work. Therefore those employees are lazy? Hardly.

What happens in a Honda plant if the door manufacturer delivers one defective door? Everyone in Honda stops working. Are those Honda employees lazy? Nonsense. Someone else screwed up. So very responsible employees are doing what they can do - maybe play cards.

If GM employees don't have work, the layers of management have screwed Americans again. 85% of all problems are ...

[monster]

Originally Posted by tw

How many times do I remind everyone

who knows? you repeat and contradict yourself so often they haven't yet invented terms for numbers that high

of what is now monster’s myth? Throwing money like a grenade only destroys jobs. Did Perot teach you anything? Anyone with any grasp of history would know that.

monster - what saved 1979 and 1981 Chrysler and Ford? No bailout. Both companies were finally forced to submit detailed restructuring plans. .

wait, where did I say I was in favor of a bailout? I understand it can be hard when you're just bursting to condescend to someone, but please, spare me your ego.

I realize I have the answer to pretty much everything, but I think it's going a little far to say that me admitting that I don't know what should happen is a myth....


thank you for your considered response, Governor Palin.

[lookout123]

OOOOOOOOOOHH, DAAAAAAA-YUMMMMM. Sarah Baracuda is gonna be pissed at that dis.

[monster]

Originally Posted by tw

You have ignored lessons from history. If GM goes down, all those supplies and all those employee jobs are saved. .

if it's just GM, maybe. But if it's all of them, no. We're already hanging on by threads, waiting for the turn-around. We've been there for years. We've done chapter 11 -even survived it. But it will take too long for it to work this time. workers for suppliers are already not being paid but it's not just the suppliers, they're only a little part of it. it's the caf on the corner where the workers eat lunch, the preschools where there kids go, the people who clean their houses, mow their lawns, pack their groceries and ask them if they want fries with that. Half of these went in AA when Pfizer closed. they can't survive another so soon. The company logistics may be following the pattern described by events past, but the characters in this play have different structures and the old framework won't fit and can't be made to. Square peg, round hole. Your ivory tower theories of history repeating itself might be comfortable up where you are, but down here on the ground, we can see that the cows are in fact small and not just far away.

(points for that one, Brits and Britophiles....)

[Shawnee123]

Originally Posted by tw

Then you did not work in a GM plant. These are very hard working people - very responsible. When a bad attitude exists, you can quickly see why. Bad attitude is created by bad management. Management so self centered and so destructive to even change all signs to read "employe". Spend massive money only because the boss is important.

Productive company - your boss works for you. Communism - you work for your boss. GM is very communist. Obviously, employees will have a bad attitude. The CEO makes that obvious.

Yes, one day there were many idle employees. A 747 carrying essential parts crashed in Malaysia. Slowly employees had no more work. Therefore those employees are lazy? Hardly.

What happens in a Honda plant if the door manufacturer delivers one defective door? Everyone in Honda stops working. Are those Honda employees lazy? Nonsense. Someone else screwed up. So very responsible employees are doing what they can do - maybe play cards.

If GM employees don't have work, the layers of management have screwed Americans again. 85% of all problems are ...

Honey, I'm just reiterating what people told me. And I'll bet you a LOT of money that no one who works at Honda has ever sat around on the clock playing card. Huh-uh. IN fact, my buddies would laugh to hear that.

But you're right, I blame management. My post did not NOT blame management. You silly wabbit.

[Pico and ME]

Shawnee...down time happens a lot because they dont have parts. What are they going to do while they are waiting? Does Honda insist that employees clock out?