Strange parallels in religion...

[Radar]

I stumbled across this article recently. It's pretty interesting.

http://altreligion.about.com/library.../aa052902a.htm

Here's a couple of excerpts...

An inscription in the Vatican states plainly, "He who will not eat of my body, nor drink of my blood, so that he may be one with me and I with him, shall not be saved." This is not terribly surprising, unless you consider that this is inscribed on the remains of the temple the Vatican was built on- one dedicated to the God Mithras.

Thousands of years before Jesus, there was another passion story told about a God man, born of a virgin mother, in a stable. He travels about with his followers, preaching and performing miracles, including turning water into wine. Eventually, he incurs the wrath of the religious authorities, who are appalled that he refers to himself as a god. He allows himself to be arrested and tried for blasphemy. He is found guilty and executed, only to rise from the grave three days later, where the women weeping at his tomb do not recognize him until he assumes his divine form- as the God Dionysus.

[Catwoman]

All this fact-proving and coincidence hunting still doesn't answer the question of the futility and hypocrisy of religion in general. IMHO, it doesn't really matter who existed when and the parallels between them - spirituality comes from within and cannot be dictated - the truly godlike need no bible.

[Happy Monkey]

Apparently "there are no new stories" was even true 2000 years ago...

[Radar]

I don't need the bible, but I don't think I'm "godlike". If I were godlike, I'd be a fictional character.

I personally don't believe in any diety or higher power. I believe that we are here for as long as we're alive and then we're gone and there isn't anything more. Some people do great things and some don't during this time.

I found the article interesting because there are many who would have thought the story of a virgin mother having a child in a stable who later travels with followers performing miracles including the water into wine trick, who ticks off religious leaders, is accused of blasphemy, allows himself to be arrested and killed, and who is later resurrected, might apply only to Christian religions.

[Catwoman]

I wasn't suggesting that you were godlike.

I agree - the similarities are interesting. More evidence that the bible is all just myth, perhaps? Nothing but a story passed down through generations, just that someone got the dates wrong? Either way it doesn't do Christianity any favours, although it will probably be misinterpreted to mean 'See! Such a man could exist! I told you!'.

Apparently HM there are only 4 stories in existence. I can only think of one:

Establishment of Natural Order - Protagonist - Enigma - Breakdown of Order - Quest for Normality - Return to Normality

We're taught this in GCSE English over here. I think our continual dissatisfaction with our lives is the result of this 'story' we're told over and over again that has little bearing on actual reality where things often do not 'conclude', and enigmas happen every day. Just one more myth to dispose of before we start to see what's real.

edited for: so much for GCSE English - my spelling's terrible today

[Undertoad]

Could you apply that, say, to Titanic?

Est of natural order: Jack and Rose find they must be together ?

Protagonist ?

Enigma: Social order conspires to keep them apart ?

Breakdown of Order: Ship hits fucking massive iceberg ?

Quest for Normality: Amidst shit hitting fan they manage to come together and express their love ?

Return to Normality: Rose determines what is important in life and honors the love that inspired her ?

Excuse me, but what's the point? From the moment the first human being climbed down from the trees, mankind has come up with parables and myths which became codified into various religions to explain our existance on this earth. There's nothing new in this. I, personally, don't believe in the literal interpretation of the Bible, the Koran, the Greek myths, or the various Native American creation stories. IMO they are all allegories which attempt to point the way to some greater understanding. Unfortunately, religion has taken the place of true spirituality and various leaders from time immemorial have used religion for their own ends, whipping the masses into a frenzy of religous hysteria to justify various wars and atrocities. Tell me something I don't know, already.

[Cyber Wolf]

Here's some good reading on the subject. J. F. Bierlein's Parallel Myths, 1994.

This book covers similar parallels between, not only Christian biblical history and others, but everybody's and everybody else's. It covers creation myths, myths of the earliest years of man, tales of love, tales of morality, hero myths, underworld/afterlife myths and more. Bierlein also did another book, Living Myths, full of myths that people subscribe to currently and how it affects their lives. Good stuff all around if you're into ancient and current mythology from everywhere.

[alphageek31337]

I've always found the parallels is religious antagonists to be interesting: it seems to be that free thought and questioning, rather than submissive obedience, is all it really takes to make one evil. The two figures that come to mind are the greek prometheus, who because he taught man of fire, was chained to a rock and doomed to have his liver pecked at by an eagle, and satan, whose first two sins were challenging authority and getting man to think (eating from the tree of knowledge and thus gaining knowledge). Look at one of satan's other names: Lucifer. The light-bringer, the morningstar. He who sheds the light of knowledge on man, but, in the process, destroys man's innocence. Organized religions tend to have a common thread of mindless obedience to the will of whatever god they've convinced themselves runs the whole show, and deluded themselves into believing has their best interests in mind. I'm sure other examples exist, but it's 4:15 am, and I don't feel like looking...

[Catwoman]

Originally Posted by Undertoad

Could you apply that, say, to Titanic?

Est. Natural Order:
The scene is set - preparing for the voyage, clear contrast between high society and servants/lower classes, 'the ship that will never sink', secondary character introduction

Protagonist:
Enter main protagonist(s), establishing a difference between them and the secondary characters - Jack gambling and winning, Rose not quite fitting in with the others

Enigma:
Rose tries to break free from her society and begins to fall for Jack in the process - he represents her freedom

Breakdown of Order:
Rose acts on her desires, pursuing the relationship with Jack at the expense of society (her husband/mother). Oh, and 'ship hits fucking massive iceberg'. Note the symbolism.

Quest for Normality:
Rose trying to escape from her husband, jumping out of the life raft to find Jack, searching for love, survival in the freezing water

Return to Normality:
Jack dies, all is as was, except 'Rose determines what is important in life and honors the love that inspired her'.

At the end, the social order remains essentially the same, except Rose manages to find her way in it. The trouble with these stories is they admit 'hey - life is unfair' but instead of offering a wider solution or explanation they say 'here is an excellent coping mechanism (love)'. Keeps people in their place.

[ashke]

Hello, I'm new here and 'tis my first post =)

If you ever get your hands on History of God by Karen Armstrong, do read it. It's about the 3 major monotheist religions and traces their origins and the development of religious thought. There are some references to other religions like Hinduism and Buddhism but she doesn't go into details (since she wants to concentrate on Judaism, Christianity and Islam).

In it, she tells that Jesus never claimed to be any kind of god. It was only later on that people put him on that pedestal. That's why Jews and Muslims find it rather blasphemous that Christians would believe such a thing. The definition of "God" changes through time but ultimately is humans wrestling with just "What is God?" means.

[Note: I'm not a particularly religous person, I can't really say I accept any of the religion or the one I kinda grew up with. ^_^;; But I do want to know what all the fuss about God & various other deities is all about. So I pick up books on religion from time to time...]

[xoxoxoBruce]

[Note: I'm not a particularly religous person, I can't really say I accept any of the religion or the one I kinda grew up with. ^_^;; But I do want to know what all the fuss about God & various other deities is all about. So I pick up books on religion from time to time...]

Good move, know thine enemy.
You may not feel that the religious types are your enemy but they feel you are. Your lack of faith and questioning their beliefs, makes you threat that is not tolerated by the "Big 3".
Thanks for the reference and welcome to the Cellar, ashke.

[Troubleshooter]

Religion is real simple:

1) We don't know.
2) We make something up.

The similarities of the religions come from the similarities of the psychological needs of humans.

Religion, weed, and chocolate all effect the brain similarly, that's why people can't give up religion.

[perth]

The God FAQ

Not necessarily on-topic, but I've been dying for an excuse to post this.

[Elspode]

I think the most curious thing about the current state of religious affairs is that, even though we know historically that the current Predominant Religion is based on even older mythologies, it doesn't give Predominant Religion's ahderents enough perspective to stop violating their own religious dogma (i.e., thou shalt not kill, thou shalt not steal, thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife's ass, etc) in order to further that same dogma.

It is all about money and power, pure and simple. Nothing more. True spirituality is an inward experience. It has outward manifestations, sure, but the minute anyone practicing any sort of outward spirituality starts trying to tell *you* what you *must* or *must not* do, run screaming in the other direction...and keep your hand on your wallet.