MH17

elSicomoro · 07-18-2014, 04:00 PM

Unless you've been living under a rock, you probably know that a Malaysian Airlines Boeing 777 crashed in eastern Ukraine yesterday. It appears that a missile took the plane out.

One woman in Australia has lost relatives in both recent Malaysian Airlines tragedies.

From a political standpoint, if it was the Russian separatists, I think it will destroy their movement. If it was the Ukrainians, there will be more political chaos...a very destabilizing event.

From a humanity standpoint...all of this upheaval, war, death...all started with a decision not to sign a trade agreement. A hurricane triggered by butterfly wings...

orthodoc · 07-18-2014, 07:54 PM

Not butterfly wings. This was triggered by Putin. The whole enchilada (not just MH17) was Putin's plan. CCCP is his goal.

xoxoxoBruce · 07-18-2014, 08:49 PM

295 innocent people died as a result of this political struggle. Yes, but it's a drop in the bucket when you count ALL the innocents killed in these struggles for power and treasure.

orthodoc · 07-18-2014, 09:02 PM

More than 20 million died for Putin's goal, back in the day. He'd view 295 as small change. As you say. It's obscene. I've listened to some of the survivors of the mid-20th century, heard them talk about how hungry they were when Stalin starved them out, how they saw unspeakable things.

Putin is getting up in our faces right now, willing us to do things we'd normally refuse. I don't pretend to assume what should be the right response, but - from an intimate knowledge of history - I know what's happening. Why do we always do this to ourselves?

sexobon · 07-18-2014, 10:29 PM

It takes people's minds off their relationships problems.

orthodoc · 07-18-2014, 10:43 PM

It makes the under-endowed feel powerful, sure.

sexobon · 07-18-2014, 10:54 PM

Now that Putin isn't henpecked anymore, he wants to impress the ladies.

orthodoc · 07-18-2014, 11:12 PM

Megalomaniac tyrants are so predictable.

sexobon · 07-18-2014, 11:20 PM

In Russia, these are the good old days.

Sundae · 07-19-2014, 03:12 AM

Same old same old.
And I do not mean that to be dismissive.
I mean that normal people of any race, colour, creed, religion, political viewpoint are just pawns.

Want to get some attention? Kill, maim, blow up nameless, faceless non-entities at work, travelling, on holiday, heading for a conference to try to save lives, going shopping etc etc etc. Silly little labrats.

If I had to lose a family member or loved one I'd rather it was due to neglect, human error, sheer fuck-uppery. At least then I'd know it was on someone's conscience, horribly regretted and their name would never be forgotton. Not by someone to whom the death was just a statistic in ramping up an atrocity.

Griff · 07-19-2014, 06:53 AM

Bush had no linguistic or cultural claim to Iraq and he killed and maimed far more people than Putin. To be fair, we gave it back although it could use a new paint job. Putin is an old school maniac but so far he's just a piker compared to ours.

Spexxvet · 07-19-2014, 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elSicomoro

From a political standpoint, if it was the Russian separatists, I think it will destroy their movement. If it was the Ukrainians, there will be more political chaos...a very destabilizing event.

If it was the Ukraine government, then it was done on purpose. The plane came out of the west, so they knew it wasn't coming from Russia. The rebels don't have any war planes, so they knew it wasn't them. I don't believe the Ukrainian government would intentionally shoot down a civilian plane. The rebels, on the other hand, would see a potential Ukrainian war plane coming from Ukraine and mistakenly shoot down a civilian plane.

That's my take

xoxoxoBruce · 07-19-2014, 11:06 AM

Putin...

elSicomoro · 07-19-2014, 04:34 PM

I was reading Pravda yesterday...if you want to see a Russian perspective on things, it is a treat!

I almost wish that news were presented droll and boring as hell. "A plane crashed. This is why it crashed. This many people died. The sports team won. Good night."

elSicomoro · 07-19-2014, 04:40 PM

Then there is this guy, who was not only supposed to be on MH17, but was also supposed to be on MH370.

I'd say he's got someone looking out for him...and/or he's going to die of something like tetanus.

07-18-2014, 04:00 PM	#1
elSicomoro Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 12,486	MH17 Unless you've been living under a rock, you probably know that a Malaysian Airlines Boeing 777 crashed in eastern Ukraine yesterday. It appears that a missile took the plane out. One woman in Australia has lost relatives in both recent Malaysian Airlines tragedies. From a political standpoint, if it was the Russian separatists, I think it will destroy their movement. If it was the Ukrainians, there will be more political chaos...a very destabilizing event. From a humanity standpoint...all of this upheaval, war, death...all started with a decision not to sign a trade agreement. A hurricane triggered by butterfly wings...

07-18-2014, 07:54 PM	#2
orthodoc Not Suspicious, Merely Canadian Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 3,774	Not butterfly wings. This was triggered by Putin. The whole enchilada (not just MH17) was Putin's plan. CCCP is his goal. __________________ The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated. - Ghandi

07-18-2014, 08:49 PM	#3
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	295 innocent people died as a result of this political struggle. Yes, but it's a drop in the bucket when you count ALL the innocents killed in these struggles for power and treasure. __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

07-18-2014, 09:02 PM	#4
orthodoc Not Suspicious, Merely Canadian Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 3,774	More than 20 million died for Putin's goal, back in the day. He'd view 295 as small change. As you say. It's obscene. I've listened to some of the survivors of the mid-20th century, heard them talk about how hungry they were when Stalin starved them out, how they saw unspeakable things. Putin is getting up in our faces right now, willing us to do things we'd normally refuse. I don't pretend to assume what should be the right response, but - from an intimate knowledge of history - I know what's happening. Why do we always do this to ourselves? __________________ The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated. - Ghandi

07-18-2014, 10:43 PM	#6
orthodoc Not Suspicious, Merely Canadian Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 3,774	It makes the under-endowed feel powerful, sure. __________________ The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated. - Ghandi

07-18-2014, 10:29 PM	#5
sexobon I love it when a plan comes together. Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 9,793	It takes people's minds off their relationships problems.

07-18-2014, 10:54 PM	#7
sexobon I love it when a plan comes together. Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 9,793	Now that Putin isn't henpecked anymore, he wants to impress the ladies.

07-18-2014, 11:12 PM	#8
orthodoc Not Suspicious, Merely Canadian Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 3,774	Megalomaniac tyrants are so predictable. __________________ The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated. - Ghandi

07-18-2014, 11:20 PM	#9
sexobon I love it when a plan comes together. Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 9,793	In Russia, these are the good old days.

07-19-2014, 03:12 AM	#10
Sundae polaroid of perfection Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 24,185	Same old same old. And I do not mean that to be dismissive. I mean that normal people of any race, colour, creed, religion, political viewpoint are just pawns. Want to get some attention? Kill, maim, blow up nameless, faceless non-entities at work, travelling, on holiday, heading for a conference to try to save lives, going shopping etc etc etc. Silly little labrats. If I had to lose a family member or loved one I'd rather it was due to neglect, human error, sheer fuck-uppery. At least then I'd know it was on someone's conscience, horribly regretted and their name would never be forgotton. Not by someone to whom the death was just a statistic in ramping up an atrocity. __________________ Life's hard you know, so strike a pose on a Cadillac

07-19-2014, 06:53 AM	#11
Griff still says videotape Join Date: Feb 2001 Posts: 26,813	Bush had no linguistic or cultural claim to Iraq and he killed and maimed far more people than Putin. To be fair, we gave it back although it could use a new paint job. Putin is an old school maniac but so far he's just a piker compared to ours. __________________ If you would only recognize that life is hard, things would be so much easier for you. - Louis D. Brandeis

07-19-2014, 11:06 AM	#13
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	Putin... Attached Images __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

07-19-2014, 04:34 PM	#14
elSicomoro Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 12,486	I was reading Pravda yesterday...if you want to see a Russian perspective on things, it is a treat! I almost wish that news were presented droll and boring as hell. "A plane crashed. This is why it crashed. This many people died. The sports team won. Good night."

07-19-2014, 04:40 PM	#15
elSicomoro Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 12,486	Then there is this guy, who was not only supposed to be on MH17, but was also supposed to be on MH370. I'd say he's got someone looking out for him...and/or he's going to die of something like tetanus.

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