Has our intelligence dropped to zero already? - Page 9

richlevy · 05-07-2005, 11:46 AM

Quote:

"He became very belligerent and very threatening to her" when she asked him to turn over the phone, Phillips said.

"He said he was 17 years old and he would do what he wanted to do," Phillips told CNN-affiliate WTVM.

The teacher took him to the principal's office, where "he became very unruly and out of control," said Phillips. "It was escalating to a point where they were getting ready to call security."

Francois disputed the school's version of the story.

"I was just talking to them and they wouldn't listen to me about talking to my mom," he said. "I didn't curse at them."

Francois received the call from his mother, who left for duty in Iraq in January, during a lunch break.

Phillips said Francois did not tell the teacher he was talking to his mother in Iraq.

"I'm sure if she was aware of that, she would have acted much differently in dealing with the matter," Phillips said.

Phillips said the school, which is located near Fort Benning, often arranges for

So the teacher says the kid never told him/her he was talking to his mom, that instead he said "I'm 17 years old and can do what I want". Why wouldn't he tell the teacher it was his mom calling from Iraq?

I think the teacher is trying to cover his/her ass, unless the kid is completely dysfunctional to the point where he cannot communicate a simple fact.

wolf · 05-07-2005, 01:52 PM

I've seen a lot of teenagers. Option 2.

xoxoxoBruce · 05-07-2005, 03:11 PM

Quote:

"He became very belligerent and very threatening to her" when she asked him to turn over the phone, Phillips said.

Quote:

"He said he was 17 years old and he would do what he wanted to do," Phillips told CNN-affiliate WTVM.

I wonder if this was during or after the call he was supposed to have made these remarks? Sounds fishy

Troubleshooter · 05-08-2005, 12:27 PM

And isn't lunchtime considered during school hours?

russotto · 05-09-2005, 09:36 AM

I've seen a lot of petty tyrants. Option 1. He probably DID tell the teacher it was his mom, and THEN went off on them when they didn't consider that an acceptable "excuse".

OnyxCougar · 05-09-2005, 10:05 AM

I'm with russotto.

I would have done the same thing. And Iraq is 8 hours + Eastern time, so when it's noon on east coast, it's 8pm in Iraq. Makes sense she's calling during lunch.

BigV · 08-01-2005, 11:13 AM

From here to here.

This is a good articulation of what I was trying to express. She's right, it works.

lookout123 · 08-01-2005, 11:21 AM

two completely different sets of circumstances BigV. a newly adopted (previously abused and neglected) child being restrained and held by a new parent to prevent injury vs. a child in school being a complete demon. if the schoolkid's parent had bothered to show up then they could have chosen to pin her down and love her - that isn't the role of a teacher or a cop.

the teacher is there to teach a number of kids. if one is out of control you remove that child. spending inordinate amounts of time "loving" that child into a calm rational state would be an incorrect use of the teacher's time and energy.

Happy Monkey · 08-01-2005, 12:01 PM

Whereas arresting a five-year-old having a temper tantrum is a correct use of the time and energy of the police.

lookout123 · 08-01-2005, 12:07 PM

i don't know - i wasn't there. i do know that if she is destructive and cannot be controlled in the classroom she needs to be removed. if the parent or guardian was contacted but didn't show up and the destructive behavior continues then there aren't a lot of attractive options. i went to a school that would have just pummeled my ass if i had behaved like that. i had parents that would have crushed my ass when i got home if i behaved like that. maybe that knowledge is why i never behaved like that. maybe, just maybe, this kid might remember getting tossed into the back of a squad car next time and not go on a little rampage.

xoxoxoBruce · 08-01-2005, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lookout123

i don't know - i wasn't there. i do know that if she is destructive and cannot be controlled in the classroom she needs to be removed. if the parent or guardian was contacted but didn't show up and the destructive behavior continues then there aren't a lot of attractive options. i went to a school that would have just pummeled my ass if i had behaved like that. i had parents that would have crushed my ass when i got home if i behaved like that. maybe that knowledge is why i never behaved like that. maybe, just maybe, this kid might remember getting tossed into the back of a squad car next time and not go on a little rampage.

Amen.

Happy Monkey · 08-01-2005, 12:23 PM

That's what the principal is for.

I just found it odd that your complaint was about wasting a teacher's time, and your solution was an even bigger waste of police time.

lookout123 · 08-01-2005, 12:40 PM

yeah, i know HM. i've got mixed feelings on this. i understand what BigV is saying. love the kids. my beef is with the idea that the teacher should just love the kids into compliance - eff that. they are there to teach. if one child disrupts the learning experience for the rest of the kids - get rid of that kid. yes i know that is cold and callous but i don't care. if the teacher is forced to take time away from the other kids to deal with an unruly brat who obviously has no parental involvement in their discipline, that is just not right.

as far as the cops? that is their job - to respond to problems. school calls and says we've got an out of control child and the parents aren't coming - the cops respond. they subdue, restrain, and remove the child. the cops did their job and the teacher can get back to doing theirs.

Happy Monkey · 08-01-2005, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lookout123

as far as the cops? that is their job - to respond to problems. school calls and says we've got an out of control child and the parents aren't coming - the cops respond. they subdue, restrain, and remove the child. the cops did their job and the teacher can get back to doing theirs.

A five year old having a temper tantrum isn't a law enforcement problem. It's what any teacher or principal of an elementary school should be willing and able to deal with. The teacher should get the kid to the principal and get back to class, and the principal should either handle the tantrum or pass the kid off to a counselor. When kids get older, that line can get blurry, but five is solidly in the "school can handle it" range.

wolf · 08-01-2005, 01:16 PM

I thought we had covered this at least partially ... school policy doesn't allow the staff to contact the students. Their hands are tied, if you'll excuse the expression, so they have to go to the next step (calling the cops) to control an out of control child.

05-07-2005, 01:52 PM	#2
wolf lobber of scimitars Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Phila Burbs Posts: 20,774	I've seen a lot of teenagers. Option 2. __________________ wolf eht htiw og "Conspiracies are the norm, not the exception." --G. Edward Griffin The Creature from Jekyll Island High Priestess of the Church of the Whale Penis

05-08-2005, 12:27 PM	#4
Troubleshooter The urban Jane Goodall Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Florida Posts: 3,012	And isn't lunchtime considered during school hours? __________________ I have gained this from philosophy: that I do without being commanded what others do only from fear of the law. - Aristotle

05-09-2005, 10:05 AM	#6
OnyxCougar Junior Master Dwellar Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Kingdom of Atlantia Posts: 2,979	I'm with russotto. I would have done the same thing. And Iraq is 8 hours + Eastern time, so when it's noon on east coast, it's 8pm in Iraq. Makes sense she's calling during lunch. __________________ Impotentes defendere libertatem non possunt. "Repetition does not transform a lie into a truth." ~Franklin D. Roosevelt

08-01-2005, 11:13 AM	#7
BigV Goon Squad Leader Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Seattle Posts: 27,063	From here to here. This is a good articulation of what I was trying to express. She's right, it works. __________________ Be Just and Fear Not.

08-01-2005, 11:21 AM	#8
lookout123 changed his status to single Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Right behind you. No, the other side. Posts: 10,308	two completely different sets of circumstances BigV. a newly adopted (previously abused and neglected) child being restrained and held by a new parent to prevent injury vs. a child in school being a complete demon. if the schoolkid's parent had bothered to show up then they could have chosen to pin her down and love her - that isn't the role of a teacher or a cop. the teacher is there to teach a number of kids. if one is out of control you remove that child. spending inordinate amounts of time "loving" that child into a calm rational state would be an incorrect use of the teacher's time and energy. __________________ Getting knocked down is no sin, it's not getting back up that's the sin

05-09-2005, 09:36 AM	#5
russotto Professor Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 1,788	I've seen a lot of petty tyrants. Option 1. He probably DID tell the teacher it was his mom, and THEN went off on them when they didn't consider that an acceptable "excuse".

08-01-2005, 12:01 PM	#9
Happy Monkey I think this line's mostly filler. Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: DC Posts: 13,575	Whereas arresting a five-year-old having a temper tantrum is a correct use of the time and energy of the police. __________________ _________________ \|...............\| We live in the nick of times. \| Len 17, Wid 3 \| \|_______________\| [pics]

08-01-2005, 12:07 PM	#10
lookout123 changed his status to single Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Right behind you. No, the other side. Posts: 10,308	i don't know - i wasn't there. i do know that if she is destructive and cannot be controlled in the classroom she needs to be removed. if the parent or guardian was contacted but didn't show up and the destructive behavior continues then there aren't a lot of attractive options. i went to a school that would have just pummeled my ass if i had behaved like that. i had parents that would have crushed my ass when i got home if i behaved like that. maybe that knowledge is why i never behaved like that. maybe, just maybe, this kid might remember getting tossed into the back of a squad car next time and not go on a little rampage. __________________ Getting knocked down is no sin, it's not getting back up that's the sin

08-01-2005, 12:23 PM	#12
Happy Monkey I think this line's mostly filler. Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: DC Posts: 13,575	That's what the principal is for. I just found it odd that your complaint was about wasting a teacher's time, and your solution was an even bigger waste of police time. __________________ _________________ \|...............\| We live in the nick of times. \| Len 17, Wid 3 \| \|_______________\| [pics]

08-01-2005, 12:40 PM	#13
lookout123 changed his status to single Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Right behind you. No, the other side. Posts: 10,308	yeah, i know HM. i've got mixed feelings on this. i understand what BigV is saying. love the kids. my beef is with the idea that the teacher should just love the kids into compliance - eff that. they are there to teach. if one child disrupts the learning experience for the rest of the kids - get rid of that kid. yes i know that is cold and callous but i don't care. if the teacher is forced to take time away from the other kids to deal with an unruly brat who obviously has no parental involvement in their discipline, that is just not right. as far as the cops? that is their job - to respond to problems. school calls and says we've got an out of control child and the parents aren't coming - the cops respond. they subdue, restrain, and remove the child. the cops did their job and the teacher can get back to doing theirs. __________________ Getting knocked down is no sin, it's not getting back up that's the sin

08-01-2005, 01:16 PM	#15
wolf lobber of scimitars Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Phila Burbs Posts: 20,774	I thought we had covered this at least partially ... school policy doesn't allow the staff to contact the students. Their hands are tied, if you'll excuse the expression, so they have to go to the next step (calling the cops) to control an out of control child. __________________ wolf eht htiw og "Conspiracies are the norm, not the exception." --G. Edward Griffin The Creature from Jekyll Island High Priestess of the Church of the Whale Penis

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