Why is Obama Black?

[xoxoxoBruce]

And with it, the price of everything else goes up. Now the oil companies and the futures brokers, have the greenies on their side, the sky's the limit.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

And with it, the price of everything else goes up. Now the oil companies and the futures brokers, have the greenies on their side, the sky's the limit.

If gas does go up that much then maybe our auto industry will see the light and either import or produce some of those very efficient diesel engines like the UK has. They have been getting well above 30mpg for years.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Now that low sulfur fuel is available they can, and still meet emissions standards. All those Europeans, even VW and Mercedes, had pulled out of the US market, because they couldn't do it.

[TheMercenary]

And didn't the US auto unions block it as well, for other reasons?

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

And didn't the US auto unions block it as well, for other reasons?

Why would they do that? That's doesn't make any sense, but if you've got a link to that I'd love to read it.

[Shawnee123]

I asked some time ago why 30 mpg is now considered great mileage. My 1990 CRX got about 35, but the HF version got near 50. We're being screwed. They can do better. Somebody's pockets would suffer, methinks, and better ours than "theirs" in their eyes. If gas prices keep going up I don't know what I will do. My VW gets about 30, so it's considered great mileage: I have a 300 mile total commute each week. This is the suxxors.

[tw]

Originally Posted by Shawnee123

I asked some time ago why 30 mpg is now considered great mileage. My 1990 CRX got about 35, but the HF version got near 50. We're being screwed. They can do better.

30 MPG is average to poor mileage. It was 1970/80 technology. But management (not union workers) were disciples of TheMercenary. Therefore routinely stifled innovation for their self serving purposes.

Japan, that does less innovation, prospered by putting inside their products technologies that were intentionally stifled by American management.

Meanwhile, so many consumers are so easily manipulated as to think 20 - and later 26 - MPG was great mileage. Mileage numbers would be much worse except that environmental protection (low pollution) laws required management to implement some innovations. Yes, environmental protection hyped by liars for making lower mileage was a reason for 30 MPG in 1970 and later cars.

I was driving a GM 5 speed in 1975. By 1980, GM has eliminated all 5 speeds. Innovation is bad - according to management.

For those outside the US - TheMercenary is hyping, almost word for word, a diatribe by wacko extremists such as Limbaugh. Same people who thought it was good when White House lawyers rewrote science papers. People with so much contempt for the advancement of mankind as to build the Constellation - a manned spacecraft disaster.

A 70 Hp per liter engine was ready for production in GM in 1975. That meant four cylinders replaced all big block V8s. But that also meant innovation and more union jobs. Only management stifled that technology to even create 1991 and 2008 bankruptcies.

[TheMercenary]

I will look. I believe it revolved around the UAW getting language into the bills that regulated what was defined as a "domestic" auto and then taxing those imports that did not meet that standard. Hence the Jap companies among others proceeded to open plants in the US that were located in Right to Work states and not where unions could not dominate. But due to the low price of gas in the US as well as the low standards for mpg efficiency, currently around 27mpg average, I believe, there was no incentive for them to make the same efficient engines that they have in their own countries.

[TheMercenary]

This speaks to some of it but it does reference more in general terms "US Auto industry" rather than direct union offense. I can see from the article how they would have been on the same side of the arguments.

http://www.ucsusa.org/clean_vehicles...slow-lane.html

This references the UAW some.

http://www.cato.org/pubs/regulation/...n3/v32n3-2.pdf

This is a proposal to do direct imports of the complete cars and some of the roadblocks, little to do with the issues surrounding jobs but you could imagine the outcry if we imported significantly more fuel efficient complete autos built by Ford and GM overseas...

http://wheels.blogs.nytimes.com/2008...ome-good-cars/


Specifically mentions the unions...

http://www.bitbotters.com/47/why-ame...fficient-cars/

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...051900550.html

http://www.thestar.com/business/article/635994

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17344368/ns/business-autos/

[xoxoxoBruce]

Yeah, I can see the UAW backing what they see as beneficial to their members, that what they do. At least that's what they should do.

As far as imported parts, that's the manufactures call, like the Big Ford Crown Vics that have dominated the police market. Ford arranged for a high percentage of the parts to be imported so it would be classed as an import and it's gas mileage averaged in with their other imports. Using the rules(law) to their advantage. But that doesn't affect the UAW very much, even if they had a say in the matter.

But like I said up front, keep in mind the UAW is first and foremost in the business of protecting their members, who are paying 2 hours a month. As least it should be... actually the first and foremost is to benefit the rat bastards running the show, then the dues paying members.

[TheMercenary]

Kill off the UAW and things would improve.

[DanaC]

Kill of the UAW and the workers would be more vulnerable to exploitation.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by DanaC

Kill of the UAW and the workers would be more vulnerable to exploitation.

Bull shit. The UAW time has come and gone. But I do understand you come from a Socialist POV. You are forgiven.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Don't be ridiculous, do you think the manufacturers are going to adhere to health and safety labor laws on their own? The day to day problems are not between labor and upper management, it's the first line management that try to cut corners. And often there's too much middle management between the two for good communication.

Yes there was some stupid programs going on for awhile, but the UAW didn't come up with these on their own, the companies were just as guilty.
The Germans give more money, and vacation, than the UAW gets here, and have done ok because they've funded those obligations.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

The Germans give more money, and vacation, than the UAW gets here, and have done ok because they've funded those obligations.

And do they have a UAW equivalent there?