Men Abortion and Choice

[bluecuracao]

What, let him spew crap with no repercussions? Hell no. Rk knows the deal here.

[Aliantha]

The funny part (in my opinion) is that rkz truly believes what he's saying but doesn't realize how sexist he's being.

Sorry rkz, but it's true. I realize there's reasons why you feel the way you do and that you honestly believe what you're saying, but mate, you're not a woman. You never will be so you will never understand.

Before you go ahead and tell me I'm not a man and I'll never understand, I agree.

That's why it's a case of n'er the twain shall meet on this issue.

[bluecuracao]

WTF? Will you guys stop deleting your posts?

[DucksNuts]

Makes it very hard to follow

[Aliantha]

and swallow

[DucksNuts]

Have you had your daily dose of potassium?

[Aliantha]

I thought it was protien?

[smurfalicious]

I know a woman who got pregnant. At the time, her relationship was a disaster that had nearly run its course. The boyfriend wanted an abortion. She did not. She left. She endures pregnancy and raises the child on entirely her own. Because she believes she has an ethical - not legal - duty to take his opinion into consideration, she eliminates his responsibility to that child by raising the child on her own without financial, emotional, or any kind of support whatsoever from him. She recognizes that although she has the biological "advantage" (or disadvantage, depending on your POV) which allows her the ultimate decisions when it comes to her body, she believes she is ethically bound to respect his wishes.

It isn't fair to women that men don't have to deal with the baby plumbing that we do - the bleeding, the cramps, the migraines, the cancers, the risks and complications, the scarring, the pain... I spend 25% of my life stuffing cotton up my twat, another 25% eating chocolate and crying. I'm only "normal" 50% of the time! You guys walk around without a care in the world except when it comes to your ability to impregnate.

It isn't fair that men don't have the ultimate say. But as with most things in life, it isn't fair, and it is about trade-offs. You don't physically have to deal with it, you don't get the final decision.

You start putting limitations on abortions like this legislation suggests, and we've regressed back to coat hanger abortions, and abortions for the privileged.

[DanaC]

I suspect its a little of both......probably no carbs though..

[DucksNuts]

Originally Posted by Aliantha

I thought it was protien?

Originally Posted by DanaC

I suspect its a little of both......probably no carbs though..

Protein, Magnessium and Potassium. Low Carbs, High GI.

[Shawnee123]

Keep your laws off my body.

[kerosene]

Yikes. I thought we were suppose to be getting away from the archaic idea of men controlling women.

I respect your opinion, rkzenrage, but I am a little shocked.

Perhaps my problem is my inability to trust what a man would decide for my body (or our child.) This is a time when people don't have sex just to procreate and we can no longer fool ourselves about that. Don't get me wrong. If the law were this way and my husband and I got pregnant, I would trust him because I know he would respect me and we would make this decision together. If I had chosen to marry a different man? If I were not married and a surprise pregnancy came about? Who the fuck knows? Makes me even more happy about who I married. A bit of a scary thought, though.

I see a lot of problems with this law:

- If a man has the final say in whether or not to abort the baby, as someone else stated above, what is to keep some of them from abusing this law to control a woman or to "punish" her? I won't believe that this would be a small minority of situations. Many people cannot handle responsibility, so they use it to control another person. This happens already in so many other ways.

- Once the child is born, what of him/her? Can you honestly say you believe that all fathers are going to be supportive, loving, whatever for that child? What portion of those children do you suspect will end up in the state cycle, unwanted? Who pays for these services already, and whose taxes will increase as a result of further "strain" on the system? I hate to put it this way, but it is a factor.

- There are ways around this law for pregnant women, too. "I don't remember who I slept with. Here's a list, but he might not be on there."

- Who needs more laws to control us? If the man is not considered in the decision about the life of a fetus and he has a problem with that, perhaps he should have considered his partner's perspective on that ahead of time and used a condom? Or, perhaps he might have determined his partner's perspective on having children, before he started having sex with her? Same goes for the woman. If she didn't want to get pregnant, perhaps she might have taken precautions? Both parties have responsibility in this, but once a woman gets pregnant, she has full physical responsibility for that child. Only she can eat right, not lift really heavy things, etc. to take care of that child while in the womb. If she chooses to abort the baby, obviously she isn't prepared for the responsibility. The man has no physical obligation to the child, so naturally his perspective is going to be different.

- What about situations where the man makes the woman keep the baby and she later decides she wants to be a mother? I have heard of this happening in situations where the intent is to give the baby up for adoption.

This is so case by case, therefore, putting a law around it is just dangerous. I realize my points are "obvious" but they are still valid and need to be addressed.

Rage, like I said, I respect how you feel about this, but I suspect you are putting yourself in the place of one of the men whose child is aborted without your consent and thinking "what would I want?" Not all men have the same connection to their emotions that you do. Not all men would respect a woman enough not to control her or use her. I don't believe you are archaic or domineering. I just think you are looking at this without considering other perspectives.

[Clodfobble]

- There are ways around this law for pregnant women, too. "I don't remember who I slept with. Here's a list, but he might not be on there."

Not to mention the really obvious way: pick any random male friend, assert he's the father, have him sign the permission slip, and go on your merry way. Paternity tests are expensive and take a long time, there's no way they could legislate it to be a requirement for every abortion.

[smurfalicious]

Isn't there a fairly high risk associated with paternity tests performed in utero? I know that invasive prenatal testing, such as amniocentesis, which detects genetic disorders or chromosomal abnormalities, carries with it a high risk of infection or complication.

And what about the old oops-I-"accidentally"-fell-down-the-stairs-and-lost-the-baby trick?

[Cicero]

I thought my "possession for dummys" post was pretty clear.
So blind they can't interpret their own laws anymore. Or provide any valid justification.
Just don't spit in my coke and think it's yours.