Isolationism

[Clodfobble]

Originally Posted by dov

I believe the States are decadent and that feeds terrorism and will ultimately be the States downfall.

When?

Just a rough estimate will do, but "ultimately" is about as impractically untenable as Revelation prophesy.

Yesterday.

You are entitled to your point of view.

Originally Posted by dov

The amount spent on an illegal invasion and the subsequent murder of 100k innocent Iraqis, same bucks spent in narrowing the rift between third world and the decadent ones would have made a profound effect in lowering terrorism. It would have defused it.

I believe the states is being run by born again evangelicals...

Dov, you have two and a half sentences in your post that would actually make for a reasonable discussion or debate. The problem that you have which is even worse than your writing style, is that you "single issue hammer," in the words of UT.

We all understand how horrific the holocaust was (and Jews weren't the only group targeted for extermination, BTW). We all understand that certain groups would like to see Israel destroyed. We all understand that certain Evangelicals actually do have the agenda you described in mind.

However, society, politics, and life in general are a complex, intersecting web of beleif's, actions, nations, and philosophies. You are like someone who is standing in the middle of a burning forest and concentrating on a single tree that might or might not catch flame when you could be out helping dig a fire line around the entire thing.

Let's say that you are correct, and the US ultimately falls completely into the hands of whacko's who expect the book of Revelations prophesy that you have outlined to come true. Its really hard to go there, even in hypothetical land, frankly. I can envision a hypothetical US that restricts more and more freedoms, just as it is currently doing. I can go to a hypothetical land where the US government becomes ever more repressive. But you are asking us to waltz off to a hypothetical land where the US rounds up every Jew on the face of the earth, forcibly transports them all to Israel, and then exterminates them all a la Hitler, except for 144,000 lucky ones who make nice to the concentration camp guards

The logistics alone of this are mind boggling. There are so many more possible future scenarios of atrocities that are far more plausible than yours. It is an interesting idea to bring up once, but to keep whining away about it really does place you in the lunatic fringe catagory.

Helpful Hint: Do not show up on a US board and make blanket accusations of how awful we all are. I post to the boards where there are Brit's, Canadians, Aussies, etc who are quite dismayed by current US policies. They talk about the need for reform in their own countries, as well, and they don't hate me or other people from the US who post there just because we are Americans. Some of us might actually have been on your side if you were posting stuff that was slightly more in the realm of sanity and if your over-all attitude was slightly less derogatory.

Thank you for your thoughtful post and recommendations.

Yes I do stand in the middle of a forest fire and focus on one tree.
I have no affect on the forest, just possibly the tree.

I beleive in what I post.

I don’t care what anybody thinks of me. Nobody knows me. (You will grow to love me.)

Many of you address yourselves as we. Have you noticed?

I have never had a need to be a part of we.

I truly appreciate your post.

[BigV]

Originally Posted by dov

...
I have never had a need to be a part of we.

I truly appreciate your post.

Then why the heck are you here? Seriously.


I appreciate your posts too.

[Clodfobble]

Originally Posted by dov

Yesterday.

You are entitled to your point of view.

Thank you, but I have not expressed my point of view. "Yesterday" is patently false, as the United States is still a functioning country as of today. When will our inevitable downfall occur? 5 years? 50 years?

Originally Posted by dov

I have never had a need to be a part of we.

Unless we = Jews and/or Canadians, I suppose?

Originally Posted by marichiko

Let's say that you are correct, and the US ultimately falls completely into the hands of whacko's who expect the book of Revelations prophesy that you have outlined to come true. Its really hard to go there, even in hypothetical land, frankly. I can envision a hypothetical US that restricts more and more freedoms, just as it is currently doing. I can go to a hypothetical land where the US government becomes ever more repressive. But you are asking us to waltz off to a hypothetical land where the US rounds up every Jew on the face of the earth, forcibly transports them all to Israel, and then exterminates them all a la Hitler, except for 144,000 lucky ones who make nice to the concentration camp guards

The logistics alone of this are mind boggling.

Could you, in your wildest dreams about six years ago, envisioned where we are standing today? I won’t list the atrocities, I will just say, the logistics, which brought us to this reality, today, alone are mind-boggling. One example, eight trillion. There are 1000 more examples of this twilight zone. I can’t focus on the thousand. I would become saturated. Simply one at a time is how I work.

Ten percent of the world’s population are Born Again Evangelicals. I will worry for both of us, unless you are one of those who spark the flame to fry us.

Originally Posted by Clodfobble

Thank you, but I have not expressed my point of view. "Yesterday" is patently false, as the United States is still a functioning country as of today. When will our inevitable downfall occur? 5 years? 50 years?

Yesterday. All your bridges have been burnt. All illusions of functioning is a delusion.

Originally Posted by Clodfobble

Jews and/or Canadians, I suppose?

Ungrounded assumption, and stereotypical, a shot in the dark and none of your business. Good try at pushing the personal button though. Try again, now that I know whom and what you are it will be more difficult. You played that card way too early.

[Happy Monkey]

Originally Posted by dov

Ungrounded assumption, and stereotypical, a shot in the dark and none of your business.

Which, that you're Canadian, or that you're Jewish? You've said both. Is is an ungrounded assumption that you thell the truth?

[xoxoxoBruce]

I believe it was Canadian, Jewish, artist, fund-raiser.

Originally Posted by Happy Monkey

Which, that you're Canadian, or that you're Jewish? You've said both. Is is an ungrounded assumption that you thell the truth?

Ungrounded by the fact I do not define myself by religion or nationality as was implied.

I am grateful being both.

How do you define yourself?

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

I believe it was Canadian, Jewish, artist, fund-raiser.

I am flattered, thank you. (sculptor)

I am also a father a son a brother a friend, and a human being.

I am blessed with three wonderful young adults, who were once my babies. The boys are twins, twenty-one, their sister is twenty-two. I was a single parent of three babies in diapers at the same time.

I have the most wonderful cat in the world, Pookie. Please don’t tell him I called him a cat, he doesn’t know.

Thanks again for your attention.

Originally Posted by dov

Could you, in your wildest dreams about six years ago, envisioned where we are standing today? I won’t list the atrocities, I will just say, the logistics, which brought us to this reality, today, alone are mind-boggling. One example, eight trillion. There are 1000 more examples of this twilight zone. I can’t focus on the thousand. I would become saturated. Simply one at a time is how I work.

Ten percent of the world’s population are Born Again Evangelicals. I will worry for both of us, unless you are one of those who spark the flame to fry us.

Six years ago I had other things on my so-called mind, but, yes, as a matter of fact, I could have accepted the hypothesis of a future which has become current reality. Six years ago, the US was as greedy for oil as it is now; six years ago the US had already engaged in the first Gulf War; six years ago I saw first hand how the US military was treating its Gulf War veterans; six years ago my city had already been over-run with religous whacko's like the Focus on the Family crowd, etc., etc.

I don't know about your statistic of 10% of the world being Evangelicals, but, for the sake of argument, I'll accept it. I live in a town right next door to the epicenter of the religous right in this country, Colorado Springs. The town I currently reside in has a reputation for being a haven for Wiccan's and other pagan types. There are certainly individuals in the next town over who practice religous intolerance. I have had people advise me to move out of my town or just look at me like I've suddenly sprouted two horns and a tail when I tell them where I live. Ignorant folks next door think witches on broomsticks fly around here. Whatever.

The fact remains that no one has come and burned down my town or rounded up its residents to be burned at the stake. We still have the same rights here as the folks next door do, despite the fact that we all live in the same county. When I go down to the county court house for some reason and give my place of residence, I am not automatically shunted off into a "witches only area." The local representative to the state legislature actually resides in my community.

You are going to have a very hard time getting me to believe that this country would round up all Jewish Americans to be deported to Israel and killed. If somebody ever sets fire to Manitou Springs, I'll be sure to let you all know, never fear. I was horrified when everyone told me of the danger involved when I thought I had run across some old explosives, since I have no desire to send sparks flying at ANYONE.

Originally Posted by BigV

Then why the heck are you here? Seriously.
I appreciate your posts too.

To learn, to laugh, for company, and on occasion make a friend.

You?

[Beestie]

Sometimes, a rolled-up newspaper isn't the reason for the silence but the reason for the barking.