The Immaterial Mind

[Cicero]

Let's talk about consciousness vs essence.

[henry quirk]

"...is such a thing as a 'soul' or whatever you want to call it(?)"

not likely: at least not likely in the sense of an 'indwelling spirit'

as i self-inspect: i see no evidence of duality...no soul/body or mind/body or brain/body division

what i perceive is 'me' as a whole, as a unit, as separate and discrete from all of you; and as irreducible to parts and process and, therefore, indescribable by way of parts and process

certainly: i'm comprised of pieces, parts, and process but these parts, pieces, and processes fall 'beneath' me, fall 'within' me

the examination of parts and process can tell the inquisitive a lot about 'the flesh' but next to nothing about 'me'

to know about 'me' i must be inspected, interrogated, as 'myself'

so: i am not my brain, but my brain -- as locus for intellect and consciousness -- is a very important part of me

in the same vein: i don't have memories...i remember; i don't have a free will...i choose; etc.


"...there may be a non-material element to our minds, it's certainly very hard to account for consciousness without it"

i'm not sure i buy this, but, really: what bearing does it have on anything?

if i'm an embodied soul...so what?

if i'm a cobbled-together bio-machine...so what?

if i'm something else (mundane or supranatural) entirely...so what?

none of the above possibilities (or any others) have any real bearing on how i choose to comport myself in the world

if scientists, tomorrow, prove without a doubt that i'm just a bio-machine with no special relevance in the world, i should do 'what' because of this information?

i can't imagine such information having any effect on my life...my own, subjective, self-definition as 'henry quirk' trumps all objective definitions... --henry

[Shawnee123]

Originally Posted by henry quirk

..if scientists, tomorrow, prove without a doubt that i'm just a bio-machine with no special relevance in the world, i should do 'what' because of this information?

I, for one, would kill a lot more hobos. Without cause.

[Cicero]

Originally Posted by henry quirk

'henry quirk' trumps all objective definitions... --henry

Except for solipsist.

Definition:

sol·ip·sism (slp-szm, slp-)
n. Philosophy
1. The theory that the self is the only thing that can be known and verified.
2. The theory or view that the self is the only reality.

[henry quirk]

"I, for one, would kill a lot more hobos. Without cause."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!


"solipsist": a perspective having absolutely nothing to do with my own

read #47 again, within the context of the thread

*sigh*

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by Cicero

snip~ 2. The theory or view that the self is the only reality.

Yup, that's him.

[henry quirk]

"Yup, that's him."

if the 'him' you reference is cicero, then, i have no opinion not knowing the person

if the 'him' you reference is 'me', and if -- like cicero -- you believe me to be a solipsist, i have to ask how you come to this conclusion

nothing i've posted here, in this thread, in this forum, or on the net as a whole, could lead anyone to conclude i...

...believe knowledge of anything outside the mind is unjustified

or

...believe the self is all i know to exist

or

…confine reality to myself and my experiences

or

...believe nothing exists except my mind and the creations of my mind

or

...believe i alone exist or i alone am conscious

*shrug*

mayhap the best way to proceed: who is the 'him' you're talking 'bout?

[Pie]

"Watchu talkin' 'bout, Willis?"

[classicman]

The Immaterial Mind

Isn't that when
I say "I mind" and
she says "That's immaterial"

[Shawnee123]

lol @ classic!

[Cicero]

Well if all objective definitions have been trumped by henry quick.....And you talk about henry quick so much, all self......leads to solipsistic tendencies...But if you say "nay" then I will have to take your word for it!

Sorry, I need to go trump myself. Gotta run!

[henry quirk]

"Well if all objective definitions have been trumped by henry quick"

folks who respond to posts in threads really, really, really need to keep the thread, the context of the discussion, in mind


"And you talk about henry quick so much, all self"

context, context, context


"leads to solipsistic tendencies"

i'm an egoist: there's no doubt of that

but, if i were a solipsist: i wouldn't waste my time having conversations with what i could only assume were the retarded parts of my own psyche


"go trump myself"

yes: 'trumping' yourself sounds like a good idea...

[Cicero]

Originally Posted by henry quirk

"Well if all objective definitions have been trumped by henry quick"

folks who respond to posts in threads really, really, really need to keep the thread, the context of the discussion, in mind



but, if i were a solipsist: i wouldn't waste my time having conversations with what i could only assume were the retarded parts of my own psyche


yes: 'trumping' yourself sounds like a good idea...

No seriously, you aren't clearly subjective if you trump all objectivity?

Your definition of solipsist looks screwy. Is it to obfuscate my portion of discussion? Yes?

[Happy Monkey]

Originally Posted by Cicero

sol·ip·sism (slp-szm, slp-)
n. Philosophy
1. The theory that the self is the only thing that can be known and verified.

In the sense that I believe that cogito, ergo sum is the only conclusion that one can make with 100% certainty, I would probably technically count as a solipsist under definition one.

"God does not exist" is a different conclusion, so I obviously can't make it with 100% certainty. So I am also technically an agnostic.

In practice, though, I am an atheist who believes that other people exist.

[Cicero]

I like the "I am" part....."I think, therefore" was attached later. It is a good qualifier, but I am still uncertain whether or not it needs one.

I agree with you HM, on all counts.